Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by jem

A ‘proportionate response’ actually can’t be defined, it’s more of a ‘what do most people think is acceptable’.

<SNIP>

In the days following the attack Israel had the sympathy of most of the World, but they have managed to burn that all away. To the point where now Israel is seen as the aggressor, in the wrong, needs to be stopped.....

How, just how have Israel managed to switch from being the victim to the aggressor. Is it Netanyahu’s desperation to avoid legal action for a while?

You make your point well. You haven't offered an idealistic, impossible "solution" which only those viewing from the outside could concoct (e.g. what Grim said).

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by GrimUpNorth

So we can take it you feel nearly 60 Gazan's for 1 Israel is a proportionate response and that you value the lives of certain people so little compared to the Israelis.

That seems to be Seph's calculation.

So, if we assume that of the 2,055 people killed in Lebanon this year by Israel, 55 are terrorists and 2,000 are collateral damage, then a proportionate response by Lebanon would be to take out 60 x 2,000 = 120,000 people. But if it carries on like this, then everyone will be wiped out!

The reality is that we don't live in Old Testament times. It's not about revenging deaths, it's about ensuring Israel's future safety. This involves acting clever as Mossad has traditionally done and not acting like a bull in a china shop as Netanyahu favours.

One key factor in the equation is of course Iran. Helping facilitate the protestors in Iran through subtle means to bring about regime change would be hugely beneficial to reducing attacks on Israel. Another factor is the actions of the West Bank Israeli zealots who are being given free reign to violently take over Palestinian territory. Stopping this happening is a good start.

[Sephiroth]

So, what would be acceptable or proportionate?

[1andrew1]

Lurking behind all of this are Netanyahu's corruption hearings.

Netanyahu’s corruption trial hearings ‘cancelled’

The Times of Israel is reporting that three hearings in Binyamin Netanyahu’s corruption trial have been cancelled following a request from the Israeli prime minister’s legal team.

The hearings were scheduled to go ahead this week. They are the latest hearings to be cancelled in the long-running trial.

The Jerusalem District Court has asked for an update from Netanyahu’s lawyers regarding future possible hearings.

https://www.thetimes.com/us/news-tod...rump-93l533737

---------- Post added at 23:19 ---------- Previous post was at 23:18 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

So, what would be acceptable or proportionate?

I'm with Jem and Grim on this - find the perpetrators and bring them to justice. Act intelligently and understand that killing innocent citizens of other countries just acts as a recruiting sergeant for terrorists.