Students Rioting in London.

Originally Posted by Sparkle

When a group of muslims march on our streets shouting death to us all, we do nothing, in fact we can't even deport the Abu-Hamza "hook-cleric". Despite all his hate rhetoric, he's still here. The government can tax us into oblivion and we do nothing. It just goes on and on.
But yet when our younger generation take to the streets to try to make a better future for our country (whether they've got it right or wrong), so many are shouting for their blood.
Sad times

Actually there are plenty of people - one or two on this forum, as well - calling for the blood of the Muslims who take to the streets to call for death to the infidels and the invaders.

That said, the ones who, for example, turned up in Luton to shout at the army's homecoming parade did just that - they shouted. They waved placards. They did not smash up any police vans, break shop windows, vandalise government buildings or throw debris off the top of office blocks.

If you want an explanation for the differing reactions to the different groups, there it is.

[TheNorm]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

...When a group of muslims march on our streets shouting death to us all, we do nothing, in fact we can't even deport the Abu-Hamza "hook-cleric". Despite all his hate rhetoric, he's still here. ...

What are you talking about? This guy was found guilty of "stirring up racial hatred" (amongst other crimes) and is currently in Belmarsh prison. He will probably be extradited to the USA to face further charges.

How can you possibly think this means "we do nothing"?

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Chris

throw debris off the top of office blocks.

Which in my eyes could be classed as attempted murder by that hooligan who btw was a student lets not forget that. He was not a career trouble maker. Just glad to see he will not be able to threaten anyone else's life at the next riot.

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by TheNorm

What are you talking about? This guy was found guilty of "stirring up racial hatred" (amongst other crimes) and is currently in Belmarsh prison. He will probably be extradited to the USA to face further charges.

How can you possibly think this means "we do nothing"?

You know fine what I'm talking about. The only reason the gov took any action was because of the notoriety he gained in the British media, after some years of preaching. He's still here, and there are countless other hate clerics in this country that are free to preach their spleen against their host country. As far as I'm concerned, that counts as doing nothing.

---------- Post added at 12:56 ---------- Previous post was at 12:54 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

That said, the ones who, for example, turned up in Luton to shout at the army's homecoming parade did just that - they shouted. They waved placards. They did not smash up any police vans, break shop windows, vandalise government buildings or throw debris off the top of office blocks.

If you want an explanation for the differing reactions to the different groups, there it is.

If we're talking about the muslims as a whole, what about the Bradford riots not so long ago? Would you say that was preferable to a fire extinguisher being thrown from a roof top and other violence we've seen from the students protests ?

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

You know fine what I'm talking about. The only reason the gov took any action was because of the notoriety he gained in the British media, after some years of preaching. He's still here, and there are countless other hate clerics in this country that are free to preach their spleen against their host country. As far as I'm concerned, that counts as doing nothing.

[TheNorm]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

You know fine what I'm talking about. The only reason the gov took any action was because of the notoriety he gained in the British media, after some years of preaching. He's still here, and there are countless other hate clerics in this country that are free to preach their spleen against their host country. As far as I'm concerned, that counts as doing nothing....

Yes, I have a pretty good idea what you are talking about...

He broke laws, was arrested, appeared in court, was found guilty, and is now in prison. It is the standard process for dealing with criminals. You seem to be hinting that another process should have been followed because he is Muslim. What did you have in mind - a public lynching?

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by TheNorm

Yes, I have a pretty good idea what you are talking about...

He broke laws, was arrested, appeared in court, was found guilty, and is now in prison. It is the standard process for dealing with criminals. You seem to be hinting that another process should have been followed because he is Muslim. What did you have in mind - a public lynching?

All I read was "Threatens our people and country, punished with free room and board."
No public lynching is necessary. Once his activities first became known, without delay he should've been on the first banana boat to whichever rock from under which he originally crawleth.

I read somewhere that since his Egyptian citizenship was revoked, to deport him would be against his human rights.

Originally Posted by Sparkle

You know fine what I'm talking about. The only reason the gov took any action was because of the notoriety he gained in the British media, after some years of preaching. He's still here, and there are countless other hate clerics in this country that are free to preach their spleen against their host country. As far as I'm concerned, that counts as doing nothing.

Wrong on so many levels ,he was arrested and jailed because he was doing this

Guilty of six charges of soliciting to murder under the Offences against the Person Act 1861; not guilty on three further such charges.
Guilty of three charges related to "using threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour with the intention of stirring up racial hatred" under the Public Order Act 1986, not guilty on one further such charge.
Guilty of one further charge of owning recordings related to "stirring up racial hatred".
Guilty of one charge of possessing "terrorist encyclopaedia" under the Terrorism Act 2000, s58. The charges under the Terrorism Act of 2000 related to his possession of the Encyclopedia of Afghan Jihad and an Al Qaeda Handbook, and to propaganda materials produced by Masri.

that is why the police arrested him not the government

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Hamza_al-Masri

You also have to remember that just as you are allowed to "vent your spleen" against the country in which you live ,so was he untill he broke the law ,when he did he was arrested tried and thrown in jail

[Sparkle]

Before I reply in proper Marty, can you just clarify whether or not you're actually defending this guy and the way our government has dealt with him ?
i.e. Has this case been properly handled do you reckon ?

[TheNorm]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

.... Once his activities first became known, without delay he should've been on the first banana boat to whichever rock from under which he originally crawleth.....

If I understand that sentence correctly, you are advocating that people who were not born in the UK and commit a crime, should be sent (by boat) to the country where they were born. Instead of being locked in jail.

It sounds like you have a "soft spot" for immigrants.

Originally Posted by Sparkle

Before I reply in proper Marty, can you just clarify whether or not you're actually defending this guy and the way our government has dealt with him ?
i.e. Has this case been properly handled do you reckon ?

no i certainly am not defending him ,but unlike you i am not being being selective about which British citizens have the right to protest or free speech

[TheNorm]

Originally Posted by martyh

no i certainly am not defending him ,but unlike you i am not being being selective about which British citizens have the right to protest or free speech

Very well said.

Originally Posted by martyh

no i certainly am not defending him ,but unlike you i am not being being selective about which British citizens have the right to protest or free speech

Originally Posted by TheNorm

Very well said.

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by martyh

no i certainly am not defending him ,but unlike you i am not being being selective about which British citizens have the right to protest or free speech

Who's being selective? I certainly know who's being presumptuous....
I never said British citizens who are preaching death to all infidels, shouldn't be locked up.
I think you'll find that foreigners are often deported when they commit crimes in a host country, or have you not noticed this?
Abu Hamza is an Egyptian, therefore he should be deported. If he commits a serious offense whilst in the UK, then he should be deported after he's finished his sentence. That is, assuming the authorities will stand up to the PC brigade and risk being branded "racist" if they sentence him in accordance with UK law.
This has been a rather educational dialogue, since I never realised there was anyone outside of the government who thought the hook cleric was being swiftly dealt with in heavy handed fashion.
I assume you don't work for the government, or do you ?

I think the government has been so complacent in its dealing with this deplorable individual, that they've allowed him to succeed in making a complete mockery of our country and justice system, to the amusement of the French and utter amazement of the remaining civilised world. Everyone knows what this guy has preached and what he thinks of us, yet we are so incumbent that even after all these years we have yet to rid our soil of this wretched affliction.
The red tape that prevents us from seeing to it that common sense prevails, is entirely of our own making.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

The red tape that prevents us from seeing to it that common sense prevails, is entirely of our own making.

No actually it's the ECHR that ensures we can't do it. It seems that whenever we try to deport anyone a lawyer appears to claim that it's violating their human rights, the UK gets fined and told they can't do it.

Still that's what happens when you give away your sovereignty.