Students Rioting in London.

[vanman]

Originally Posted by alferret

I havnt read all 400 post's, dont really intend to either. But from what I have seen, heard been told the students are miffed at having to pay "UP TO" £9k a year in tuition fees, and that this will see them in debt after uni. But if they earn less than £21k they dont have to pay it back and then there is a sliding scale for repayments as their wages increase above that.

So what is the problem? I dont get it.

the increase stars in 2012.
3 years in uni that takes it to 2015.
so what will be the average salary in 2015 ?

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by alferret

If I was getting ready to go to uni and that I would have to pay more for my education I would make sure that my time at uni was well spent learning my chosen courses, striving to do my best, making sure that I made every effort to get a good job. Not ****ing it up the wall and shagging everything that had a heartbeat or moved.

Yes Al, that's fine if that was (hypothetically) what you wanted to do.

Stereotyping the students as you have done serves no purpose other than to show you are approaching the discussion from an already jaundiced perspective.

Unfortunately not all student behaviours, and indeed needs, are so easily compartmentalised.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by vanman

the increase stars in 2012.
3 years in uni that takes it to 2015.
so what will be the average salary in 2015 ?

what is it now ??

[vanman]

Originally Posted by papa smurf

what is it now ??

about £25,000
http://career-advice.monster.co.uk/s...s/article.aspx

[alferret]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Stereotyping the students as you have done serves no purpose other than to show you are approaching the discussion from an already jaundiced perspective.

Whilst I wouldnt want to stereotype students the vast majority, nay all but one of the ones I have known over the years have tended to live their university lives as beer drinking, women\men chasing, slovenly, lazy, arrogant oiks. They are nice people but used that time just let it all go.
If that makes my perspective jaded then so be it. But it is an opinion that is just a relevant and the next persons.

My stepson will be going to uni to study law in 2012 & he was there at the first student rally\riot.
Even though we have discussed the funding\fees issue I still dont see what the problem is. Forget the lib-dem pledge & what other parties has said what they will do, in a time of austerity how do we as a nation find the money to fund universities.
In the states parents save from the time they have a child for when he or she goes onto further education, the government only helps the poorest. So why should I and others pay for those that want to go to uni without them paying the full cost back.
The fees @ £3200 a year at the moment and the rest is subsidised by the gov.
So when the fees go up in 2012 we as tax payers will no longer be subsidising them as much, therefore more money will be availiable for issues more in need of funding.

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by alferret

In the states parents save from the time they have a child for when he or she goes onto further education, the government only helps the poorest. So why should I and others pay for those that want to go to uni without them paying the full cost back.

Err...is the answer "because we don't live in the states"?

You have evidenced that you understand fully what the argument is.

Suggesting that people simply "Forget the lib-dem pledge" and get on with it is a bit disingenuous given that it played a very major part in their election results.

I will happily contribute toward your stepsons university as I'm sure you will - whether through times of austerity or not.

I would, however remind you of those words of one of the great English statesmen Nick Clegg who said, rather famously, "We want to abolish tuition fees. We think they're wrong. At a time the economy is submerged in debt, more debt is not the answer to debt".

Seems he was a bit economical with the truth on at least two counts there.

[alferret]

Originally Posted by vanman

about £25,000
http://career-advice.monster.co.uk/s...s/article.aspx

£25k laughable... well for me anyway.

Looking at those tables and figures either they are wrong or I'm in the wrong job.
Skilled worker, 23 years in the trade, CNC operator\programmer & after OT & Bonus I may gross 24K.

---------- Post added at 20:57 ---------- Previous post was at 20:42 ----------

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Suggesting that people simply "Forget the lib-dem pledge" and get on with it is a bit disingenuous given that it played a very major part in their election results.

Maybe it is disingenuous, but we need to remember that the pledge was made before anyone other than Labour had a look at the books. Its all fine saying one thing but when faced with overwhelming odds sometimes you need to change your mind. Especially when we are up to our eyebrows in crap.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

When the next voting part comes in, l would suggest All Liberal Dem don't stand as they will lose there seats, Like all parties they are a bunch of liars - who would you trust.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by alferret

In the states ...

As was discussed earlier in the thread, tuition fees after the increase will be considerably higher than what the majority of the US students pay. It will also be 3-4 times higher than most of Western Europe (Netherlands: ~€1700 per year; Germany €500 per semester).

Do you think it's a good idea that the government puts a premium on education at a time when manufacturing in the UK is in decline and the economy is increasingly dependent on an educated workforce?

[alferret]

Originally Posted by danielf

As was discussed earlier in the thread,

As I stated in my first post in this thread I haven't & wont be reading the first 401 post's. But if you want you can summarise them for me

---------- Post added at 21:57 ---------- Previous post was at 21:55 ----------

Originally Posted by danielf

It will also be 3-4 times higher than most of Western Europe (Netherlands: ~€1700 per year; Germany €500 per semester).

We are not the rest of Western Europe, back at ya

[vanman]

what i can see is that all students from outside the uk.
will register to go to scottish universities as it will be cheaper

[alferret]

Originally Posted by danielf

Do you think it's a good idea that the government puts a premium on education at a time when manufacturing in the UK is in decline and the economy is increasingly dependent on an educated workforce?

Educated workforce all working at Maccy D's getting their 5* over the double arch.

And in answer to your question emphatically YES!

[danielf]

Originally Posted by alferret

As I stated in my first post in this thread I haven't & wont be reading the first 401 post's. But if you want you can summarise them for me

---------- Post added at 21:57 ---------- Previous post was at 21:55 ----------



We are not the rest of Western Europe, back at ya

No, we are not the rest of Western Europe, or the USA. What we are (or rather will be) is the country with the least subsidised and therefore most expensive Higher Education in the industrialized world. I don't think that puts us at a competitive advantage economically when manufacturing is in decline.

[alferret]

Originally Posted by vanman

what i can see is that all students from outside the uk.
will register to go to scottish universities as it will be cheaper

Which is subsidised by the UK because Scotland (no offence to the Scottish) wouldn't be able to sustain its own economy without outside help.

[vanman]

wonder if that is the plan

A consultation on cutting the number of non-degree level students coming to the UK - due to be published soon - has not yet got cross-coalition agreement, the BBC has learned.
Mrs May said: "Nearly half of all students coming here from abroad are actually coming to study a course below degree level and abuse is particularly common at these lower levels - a recent check of students studying at private institutions below degree level showed that a quarter could not be accounted for.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...ers-leap-third