Ban the burkha ?

[nomadking]

And what would happen to anyone who refused somebody entry on those legitimate grounds? It is supporters of the burkha who would complain about the refusal of entry that are inadvertently(?) creating the climate where a complete ban becomes the only option.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by martyh

how do you refuse a bank robber permission to enter a bank ?
it's getting into the bank in the first place that the burkha is most useful whereas someone in a balaclava approaching a bank is going to raise suspicion

And would banning the burkha in banks not have the same effect as banning any other headwear that covers the face?

[Taf]

Originally Posted by martyh

how do you refuse a bank robber permission to enter a bank ?

In France many banks have twin airlock doors you have to be buzzed to get in or out...

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by nomadking

IMHO The issue of complete bans has only arisen because of the problems of partial/selective bans. You can ban the wearing of motorcycle helmets in banks etc but not the burkha etc, although the reasons for any ban would be the same, ie concealment of faces. It ends up with the only solution being a complete ban.

Actually, the problems with the burkha are relatively easy to overcome. Just ensure burkha wearing women are served only by women..

Originally Posted by nomadking

And what would happen to anyone who refused somebody entry on those legitimate grounds? It is supporters of the burkha who would complain about the refusal of entry that are inadvertently(?) creating the climate where a complete ban becomes the only option.

you are correct imo ,but a complete ban on the burkha brings it's own problems ,what about other suspicious items of clothing such as the aforementioned balaclava or hoody or even a scarf

---------- Post added at 18:45 ---------- Previous post was at 18:39 ----------

Originally Posted by Stuart C

And would banning the burkha in banks not have the same effect as banning any other headwear that covers the face?

yes it will ..no effect at all ,bank robbers still wear them to rob banks but anyone wearing a balaclava or a crash helmet in a bank will arouse suspicion (usually) and possibly the cashiers willl set the alarms off so banks would have to adopt this with burkhas .entering a bank with a burkha on and the alarm goes off

[nomadking]

The problem is that the wearing motorcycle helmets, balaclavas, scarves, cloth caps etc is allowed to be banned in selected situations, but banning burkhas in those same situations would(and indeed have) run into trouble. If a selective ban of a burkha etc was allowed in those same situations a proposal of a complete ban would be less likely.

Originally Posted by nomadking

The problem is that wearing motorcycle helmets, balaclavas, scarves, cloth caps etc are allowed to be banned in selected situations, but banning burkhas in those same situations would(and indeed have) run into trouble. If a selective ban of a burkha etc was allowed in those same situations a proposal of a complete ban would be less likely.

the only reason that banning the burkha in banks ect has run into trouble is because the authorities are terrified of upsetting muslims and are taken in by the wishy washy excuse of it's "a religious thing" .They need to grow some balls and tell them were to get off

[nomadking]

So a school could impose an uniform dress code without ending up in court?

Originally Posted by nomadking

So a school could impose an uniform dress code without ending up in court?

if you are referring to the burkha then yes they can the links in a previous post ,can't be bothered to look now

[Stuart]

This will surprise some of you who have me down as being very pro muslim. I am actually neither pro nor anti muslim (I tend to judge people based upon how they act rather than what they believe).

However, I do think the Burkha can be a bad thing (it can be used to hide a lot of bad things, not just criminals), and it should be phased out. However, I also believe that the muslims should do it voluntarily, they should not be forced to do so.

It is worth remembering, however, that not all muslim sects require the wearing of the burkha. Some require merely that women wear a headscarf (I have no idea of the muslim name for this), and others do not require any covering.

[nomadking]

Link

What about government - surely there are official guidelines?
There are indeed - but they are open to interpretation. The Department for Education and Skills' official guidelines says that uniform policy must be sensitive to differences and the need to adhere to dress for racial or religious reasons.
It stresses that a pupil should not be disciplined for refusing to adhere to a uniform for religious reasons, and that exclusion on these grounds is even less appropriate. Miss Begum's lawyers argued the school had breached these official rules.

Regardless of which way any decision goes, the school still ended up in court.

Originally Posted by Stuart C

This will surprise some of you who have me down as being very pro muslim. I am actually neither pro nor anti muslim (I tend to judge people based upon how they act rather than what they believe).

However, I do think the Burkha can be a bad thing (it can be used to hide a lot of bad things, not just criminals), and it should be phased out. However, I also believe that the muslims should do it voluntarily, they should not be forced to do so.

It is worth remembering, however, that not all muslim sects require the wearing of the burkha. Some require merely that women wear a headscarf (I have no idea of the muslim name for this), and others do not require any covering.

i didn't think any muslim sect "required"the wearing of burkhas i thought it was purley some sects interpretation of one of the rules .Yes i aggree that the headscarf is required but isn't the burkha just an extension of that and not required by the rules

By the way, reading another report on this robbery, it would appear the robbers aren't very bright - Linky

Staff let the pair through the security double doors of the banking branch of the postal office on Saturday, believing them to be veil-wearing Muslim women, before they flipped back their head coverings and pulled out a gun, officials said

btw, whilst I don't support the wearing of the burqa, I also don't support a blanket ban (because if we did that, shouldn't we also have a blanket ban on anything that covers the head and face, such as wearing hoods up and a scarf across the lower face in cold weather, fancy dress masks, etc etc?).

I do, however, think they should be subject to the same strictures as crash helmets, hoodies, etc, in banks.

[roger skillin]

Yes i think the burkha should be banned, if we go to theirs and other religeous countries we have to abide by their laws and do what they want so if they want to live here then they need to abide by ours laws and if we don't want them to cover up their faces they so be it, and if they don't like it well, i'll let the BNP finish that sentence

[Russ]

Originally Posted by roger skillin

Yes i think the burkha should be banned, if we go to theirs and other religeous countries we have to abide by their laws and do what they want so if they want to live here then they need to abide by ours laws and if we don't want them to cover up their faces they so be it, and if they don't like it well, i'll let the BNP finish that sentence

So what about British muslims who want to wear the burkha?