New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by pippincp

Don't forget I'm in "yet another Trial Area" which means 750MB download within the hours of 4.00pm and 12.00am.

I read several cable forums and the VM newsgroups (almost) every day and I've never heard of those trial times or thresholds.
Could you copy whatever VM notification you've received as I'd like to investigate further?

---------- Post added at 14:21 ---------- Previous post was at 14:17 ----------

Originally Posted by kryogenik

it appears either he [Alex Brown] doesn't know or he's not told anyone else exactly what these increases are because so far, two techs have failed to give me an answer.

Other, less charitable posters, might suggest that Alex is making it up as he goes along...

[hardtarget]

so does that mean that from 4pm to 9pm i can upload asmuch as i want as the upload limits are only 10am to 3pm?

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/05..._restrictions/

Originally Posted by ceedee

Other, less charitable posters, might suggest that Alex is making it up as he goes along...

Not *just* Alex.
In this post I pointed out that the NG tech's were giving us (always changing) dates for the upgrade. Now I'm told all they know is what's on the upgrade page on VM's site. With that, I'm starting to think they were making them up as they went along too. Why would they once know, but now don't?
I smell a fish..
However - roaming off topic with that so I guess it's the usual sit tight (very much) in the dark and see what someone eventually decided to do.

---------- Post added at 14:29 ---------- Previous post was at 14:28 ----------

Originally Posted by hardtarget

so does that mean that from 4pm to 9pm i can upload asmuch as i want as the upload limits are only 10am to 3pm?

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/05..._restrictions/

Upstream limits are between 3pm and 8pm.

http://www.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management.php

Originally Posted by TraxData

It's not a matter of educating them, it's a matter of why should they have to?

They are paying for a high speed connection, they should be allowed to use it when they need it, not when they are in bed.

What use is it when your asleep? you cant game/play demos/watch iplayer while your asleep can you? are you superhuman?

So basically your saying customers should pay £37 for that high speed connection so they can use it when they are in bed, you should work for VM, you'd make a great manager, neil has the same views, sell them something, just dont let them use it.

I don't think I'm any different to most people in that my 'take' on this is based on my personal useage/preferences, and I accept that other people will have different views - streaming media is one thing, for example, which I don't do & I can see how that being restricted by STM might upset some people.

Most of my bandwidth use, apart from normal browsing, is confined to downloads from usenet, which is very simple to organise to fall outside the STM 'windows' - even to the point of automatically turning the pc off when finished, if done overnight.

So I'm not such an apologist for VM as it might seem - however, your comment about 'why should they have to' is a little facile, imo - if you want something badly enough, then putting a little effort into getting it shouldn't be such a problem & while this isn't aimed at you, just sitting back & saying 'its not fair, why should I' doesn't really work. TANSTAAFL applies, in my opinion??

The days of Telewest was great no problems

Virgin came and messed that up

[LostintheNW]

Originally Posted by homealone

I don't think I'm any different to most people in that my 'take' on this is based on my personal useage/preferences, and I accept that other people will have different views - streaming media is one thing, for example, which I don't do & I can see how that being restricted by STM might upset some people.

Most of my bandwidth use, apart from normal browsing, is confined to downloads from usenet, which is very simple to organise to fall outside the STM 'windows' - even to the point of automatically turning the pc off when finished, if done overnight.

So I'm not such an apologist for VM as it might seem - however, your comment about 'why should they have to' is a little facile, imo - if you want something badly enough, then putting a little effort into getting it shouldn't be such a problem & while this isn't aimed at you, just sitting back & saying 'its not fair, why should I' doesn't really work. TANSTAAFL applies, in my opinion??

I can see your point in that you can schedule your downloads around the STM, but what about people who decide they wish to purchase a game from Valve or Steam (whatever it is) or people like me who download a demo from xbox live to play (which is way under the supposed threshold) and then we are thrown on this pathetic STM system as we are deemed heavy users?

But how am I supposed to put a little effort in wanting to play games with my friends, am I to stay up all night until such time the stupid system is not meant to be in place?

The way Virgin are at the moment, I can't play online games properly as my connection is STM'd when they feel like it, if I download a demo I am STM'd, I daren't download an xbox original as they are over 1gig, films that I could want to rent from live are also a no no as they are 5gig for the HD version. This is not unlimited internet by a longshot its a restrictive version of what they once had as unlimited.

At the end of the day doing what they are doing is going to make people jump ship a lot quicker than they may have done in the past. And why are they only writing to people now with this wonderful new idea to screw people over when the system has been in place for months?

Before anything like this was put in place they should have made sure it was working perfectly as it isn't at the moment, and if its so easy to STM people why can't they just target the supposed 5% of the people who are abusing the service and restrict their usage? They are taring everyone with the same brush.

[bikeman]

This is well out of order - the only reason I've stayed with VM so far (following their ever increasing pricing for phone calls and the change to the mobile 300/300 deal) was because of the unlimited downloads.

I am not a high user - I backup my websites weekly (200Mb), watch a couple of iplayer progs, internet radio and occasionally download a cd iso. But as a 2Mb user I was surprised how frequently my service slowed down. I thought it was just lousy service but now I know it is because the download limit for 2Mb users is only 512Mb a day and is easily exceeded.

As a group we should complain to trading standards that VM advertise unlimited downloads when clearly that is not the case.

VM are already suffering with customer loss and squeezing the life our of us loyal customers is not going to help them retain us.

If others do the same the internet as a medium for tv/radio distribution etc will never get beyond it's infancy.

[hardtarget]

Originally Posted by kryogenik

---------- Post added at 14:29 ---------- Previous post was at 14:28 ----------



Upstream limits are between 3pm and 8pm.

http://www.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management.php

so i can uplaod asmuch as i want during 10am and 3pm then without being stmed?

Originally Posted by LostintheNW

I can see your point in that you can schedule your downloads around the STM, but what about people who decide they wish to purchase a game from Valve or Steam (whatever it is) or people like me who download a demo from xbox live to play (which is way under the supposed threshold) and then we are thrown on this pathetic STM system as we are deemed heavy users?

But how am I supposed to put a little effort in wanting to play games with my friends, am I to stay up all night until such time the stupid system is not meant to be in place?

The way Virgin are at the moment, I can't play online games properly as my connection is STM'd when they feel like it, if I download a demo I am STM'd, I daren't download an xbox original as they are over 1gig, films that I could want to rent from live are also a no no as they are 5gig for the HD version. This is not unlimited internet by a longshot its a restrictive version of what they once had as unlimited.

At the end of the day doing what they are doing is going to make people jump ship a lot quicker than they may have done in the past. And why are they only writing to people now with this wonderful new idea to screw people over when the system has been in place for months?

Before anything like this was put in place they should have made sure it was working perfectly as it isn't at the moment, and if its so easy to STM people why can't they just target the supposed 5% of the people who are abusing the service and restrict their usage? They are taring everyone with the same brush.

Actually the only reply I have to that concerns the films - and I have to admit that the restrictions in place actually encourage people to illegally download, e.g. from usenet, rather than purchase/hire legitimate copies e.g. from live, so you do have a point. I also entirely agree that the 'unlimited' description should be removed from their marketing blurbs.

[broadbandbug]

Originally Posted by TraxData

Overnight STM trials have now started.

It's a waste of time trying to download if your going to get 75% of your connection taken off you

Trax mate, There really are no overnight STM Trials running..

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by LostintheNW

The way Virgin are at the moment, I can't play online games properly as my connection is STM'd when they feel like it, if I download a demo I am STM'd, I daren't download an xbox original as they are over 1gig, films that I could want to rent from live are also a no no as they are 5gig for the HD version. This is not unlimited internet by a longshot its a restrictive version of what they once had as unlimited.

I've yet to hear of anyone exceeding the STM thresholds by playing a game. And I'd guess that most games would work okay if played while under STM.

Could you not download a 5GB HD movie from Live overnight to watch the next day?

I feel your frustration but the only thing that VM are limiting is your connection *speed* -- the amount you download is not limited. You may not feel there's much difference but the ASA think otherwise.

Originally Posted by hardtarget

so i can uplaod asmuch as i want during 10am and 3pm then without being stmed?

Yeah, but also 14 hours before 10am too.

You're not getting this are you!

Limits are between 3pm & 8pm.
ANYTHING uploaded outside those hours will not get you managed.
So between 8pm in the evening until 3pm the next day - 19 hours.

[slowcoach]

Is this the price we have to pay for having 151 Tech Support.

Originally Posted by slowcoach

Is this the price we have to pay for having 151 Tech Support.

It hasn't been officially confirmed, but I believe the 'price' of the forthcoming free 151 tech support is redundancies for the employees currently providing tech Support in the UK via the newsgroups...

[Rik]

Originally Posted by ceedee

How many reasonably-demanding users do you think your <£39/month connection ought to be able to cope with 24/7?

Would it be reasonable for me to setup multiple wifi access points and expect that all 60 households in my complex can stream TV and download games at the same time of day?



Do your five users accept that only one of them can get (at best) 20Mb/s at any one time?
And that if two of them start fast downloads at the same time, they are likely to only get around 10Mb/s each?

That's contention in action -- multiple users sharing the same bandwidth.

Do you accept that all ISPs need to use contention at the UBR or exchange to offer domestic connections at an affordable price?
If not, then your five users (requiring in the region of 4Mb/s each) need to be thinking of paying a lot more than £39/month each for their dedicated connections.

In an ideal network we'd barely notice the contention when demand for bandwidth was high but much of VM's network is oversubscribed and the only solution is to provide greater capacity. This is precisely what VM's DOCSIS3 programme will do albeit 'following' the demand curve rather than in anticipation of it.

Oh, and please don't make personal attacks on other posters: it's offensive and diminishes your argument.

Spot on matey