teacher shut autistic girl a tiny room

Originally Posted by Osem

In the borough in which I live there are very many autistic children in mainstream schools both at primary and secondary level. Of course the more severely affected children tend to be in special units or special schools but as these continue to close, so it will be the case that more mainstream teachers come into contact with autistic pupils. Given the severe lack of SEN resources I wouldn't be surprised to learn that a school with no autistic pupils didn't have any staff trained to deal with them. Having said that anyone dealing with autistic children in the classroom ought to have received information about that child and have the basic skills sufficient for them to be able to cope with and adapt to their needs.

Agreed but if teacher training is to be cut back then you are likely to get less fully trained staff than at present.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Agreed but if teacher training is to be cut back then you are likely to get less fully trained staff than at present.

I don't disagree about that at all.

[piggy]

Originally Posted by Osem

In the borough in which I live there are very many autistic children in mainstream schools both at primary and secondary level. Of course the more severely affected children tend to be in special units or special schools but as these continue to close, so it will be the case that more mainstream teachers come into contact with autistic pupils. Given the severe lack of SEN resources I wouldn't be surprised to learn that a school with no autistic pupils didn't have any staff trained to deal with them. Having said that anyone dealing with autistic children in the classroom ought to have received information about that child and have the basic skills sufficient for them to be able to cope with and adapt to their needs.

is this a recent policy? i ask because in my experiance as a schoolchild and a parent i have never seen a autistic person in mainstream school.

[Flyboy]

Originally Posted by Taf

Being a father of an autistic lad, I can tell you that Special Schools are now rare... New Labour decided to "integerate" them into mainstream schools but forgot to give enough training to teachers... and it's even worse at Secondary level where pupils change teachers several times a day.

The physical and mental effects of autism are so varied that it is very difficult to know how to deal with each affected person without a LOT of training and experience.

Another one with no idea of history. It was the Tories who started the "integration" process, in the late eighties and early nineties.

---------- Post added at 02:28 ---------- Previous post was at 01:56 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

She wasn't put in the room for behaving in a calm manner.

Melanie-Rose thought she would get into trouble because she had not done her homework and began crying and waving her arms.

Wow, she must have been a huge danger then. Waving her arms? That would have been very difficult to have dealt with then.

Perhaps an attempt at reasoning, or leading her to place of safety (and no, locking her in a small windowless room is not a place of safety), or using calming, soothing words, with a consolatory approach. But it is, realistically, impossible to answer your question, because each child and each situation is different. Certainly the actions of this LSA was wholly inappropriate. Tearing up a good behaviour certificate, in front of her and the whole class, shows that this woman is a bully, nothing more and nothing less. It contributes to a pattern of attitude and behaviour on her part. That action alone should have been enough to prompt disciplinary action, if nothing else.

The school, as a whole, is at fault here. They have ignored their responsibilities as educators and have denied this child a safe place to learn.

---------- Post added at 02:37 ---------- Previous post was at 02:28 ----------

Originally Posted by piggy

its not the teachers fault, if she wasnt trained to deal with autistic children then she or the child should be removed from the classroom, and some of the comments in this thread are extremely ott, you would think the child had been murdered!

Then the LSA should have raised this issue before she found herself in this situation. This is a situation that has been caused by the school, as much as the LSA, for either not providing the resources, or for starting the statementing process, in order to get the resources. The fact that she humiliated the child in front of the whole class, says an awful lot about her.

I am going to suspect that you have no experience with any special needs children, otherwise you would be making such silly comments.

---------- Post added at 02:40 ---------- Previous post was at 02:37 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

The child was already distressed.

And distressing her even further really helped, didn't it?

---------- Post added at 02:43 ---------- Previous post was at 02:40 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

But even the experts indicate that there was no way of predicting that.

???????

What "experts?"

---------- Post added at 02:50 ---------- Previous post was at 02:43 ----------

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Well I haven't had any such training and neither have most of the average teachers I come into contact with..in fact I've never come across an autistic student in any secondary school.

What, never? How many schools have you worked in then?

There is nothing stopping you from asking for more training. In fact, you would earn more money for it.

Originally Posted by Flyboy

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What, never? How many schools have you worked in then?

There is nothing stopping you from asking for more training. In fact, you would earn more money for it.

As a teacher of 34 years I've a lot of experience,and as a supply teacher I've been in most of the local secondary schools..and there ARE NO AUTISTIC CHILDREN in mainstream education here and no one who is trained to teach autistic children..

Autism is dealt with differently around here..it's recognised as a syndrome that needs very careful teaching and a far quieter environment than is possible in an average primary or secondary school.Aspergers and the like are dealt with as are the physically disadvantaged but that is mostly in newly built schools(academies) because facilities can be provided as par for the course in newly built schools

[Flyboy]

I cannot believe that any teacher would be so naive as to believe that there are NO autistic children in mainstream schools. You have either worked in very few schools with limited experience, or are burying your head in the sand. ASD does not necessarily need "very careful teaching," what it does need is teachers and schools to be proactive, in its approach, when providing a balanced and compassionate learning environment. As a parent of a child, who has ASD, ADHD, APD, Dyslexia, Dyspraxia and other related conditions, I would be appalled at this attitude that he should be shoved away in a special school. Being separated from and ignored by the rest of society. He is thriving at the mainstream school he is in, because he is treated as an individual and given the support, guidance, understanding and respect he is entitled to. Are you seriously trying to tell me that ALL autistic and disabled children, in your LEA/Local Children's Services area, are in special schools and there are no trained teachers, anywhere. No SENCOs, no children with statemnents and no special facilities in any school, except newly built ones? The whole notion and concept is just absurd. I work with national groups, concerned with the education of children with SEN and the way that SEN provisional strategies are implemented in schools. I have never come across a local education authority, without ANY disabled children in mainstream schools. Your local area must be so unique, I am surprised it hasn't come to their attention before now.

Originally Posted by Flyboy

I cannot believe that any teacher would be so naive as to believe that there are NO autistic children in mainstream schools. You have either worked in very few schools with limited experience, or are burying your head in the sand. ASD does not necessarily need "very careful teaching," what it does need is teachers and schools to be proactive, in its approach, when providing a balanced and compassionate learning environment. As a parent of a child, who has ASD, ADHD, APD, Dyslexia, Dyspraxia and other related conditions, I would be appalled at this attitude that he should be shoved away in a special school. Being separated from and ignored by the rest of society. He is thriving at the mainstream school he is in, because he is treated as an individual and given the support, guidance, understanding and respect he is entitled to. Are you seriously trying to tell me that ALL autistic and disabled children, in your LEA/Local Children's Services area, are in special schools and there are no trained teachers, anywhere. No SENCOs, no children with statemnents and no special facilities in any school, except newly built ones? The whole notion and concept is just absurd. I work with national groups, concerned with the education of children with SEN and the way that SEN provisional strategies are implemented in schools. I have never come across a local education authority, without ANY disabled children in mainstream schools. Your local area must be so unique, I am surprised it hasn't come to their attention before now.

Sorry I can only recount what I have seen...and there are many LEAs that do not provide all that is required in the way of resources and trained staff.Seems like where you live has a good LEA..Lucky you and lucky special needs pupils.

Also did I say there were no physically handicapped children attending local schools?No I didn't.I merely said that there are very little provision for autistic children and not every school in the area has provision for physically handicapped.Did I say there were no statemented children?No I did not...Did I say your child should be shoved away in a special school?No I did not..I merely said that provisions of facilities and resources are extremely poor and I know of no provision for autistic children in this area..

You are very lucky that your child has been diagnosed and provided with a good learning environment.Not every child gets that provision.

This girl obviously did not...I'm quite happy to see such children in mainstream schools PROVIDED the teaching staff and resources are available..but the truth is that not every such child gets all the support they require.

Now have I been forgiven?.I'm really not the enemy..

[Flyboy]

Sorry Maggy, I tend to get very defensive, when I think people are making invalid assumptions.

That said, of course you can always participate in training and there are supplements for working with children with statements. Perhaps, as there seems to be so few SEN trained teachers, it might be something worth looking into, any new skills wil be very sought after and as a supply you might find the phone hardly stops ringing.

[piggy]

Originally Posted by Flyboy

I cannot believe that any teacher would be so naive as to believe that there are NO autistic children in mainstream schools. You have either worked in very few schools with limited experience, or are burying your head in the sand. ASD does not necessarily need "very careful teaching," what it does need is teachers and schools to be proactive, in its approach, when providing a balanced and compassionate learning environment. As a parent of a child, who has ASD, ADHD, APD, Dyslexia, Dyspraxia and other related conditions, I would be appalled at this attitude that he should be shoved away in a special school. Being separated from and ignored by the rest of society. He is thriving at the mainstream school he is in, because he is treated as an individual and given the support, guidance, understanding and respect he is entitled to. Are you seriously trying to tell me that ALL autistic and disabled children, in your LEA/Local Children's Services area, are in special schools and there are no trained teachers, anywhere. No SENCOs, no children with statemnents and no special facilities in any school, except newly built ones? The whole notion and concept is just absurd. I work with national groups, concerned with the education of children with SEN and the way that SEN provisional strategies are implemented in schools. I have never come across a local education authority, without ANY disabled children in mainstream schools. Your local area must be so unique, I am surprised it hasn't come to their attention before now.

you are to close to the situation to make a valid judgement, this is not a critisism just a observation, and there are many many schools without any disabled children.

[Flyboy]

How do you know?

I was talking to the mother of the autistic twins today about this and she informs me that schools with any special needs children should have someone trained for these circumstances. She also tells me however that the special needs school her daughters go to has an isolation room which they use only when the child flips to such a point that others are at risk of injury. She also informs me when they flip they dont half flip but I am guessing anyone this severly effected would not be in mainstream schooling