[Update] The UK votes to leave the EU

Originally Posted by Damien

Also the companies that trade with the EU will still be bound by their regulations.

Around 60-70% of British economic activity has nothing at all to do with the EU. Releasing the vast majority of British buinesses from ridiculous Euro-regulation will be an extremely good thing.

Originally Posted by Osem

Which is what I meant - right now all UK businesses are bound by rules regardless of whether they trade with the EU and that must impose additional costs etc. which they'd otherwise be free of.

K, Sorry.

That's true although it's worth mentioning that soon those regulations will also allow trade with the US and Canada soon enough. It's a fact of trade you need to abide by the regulations of the nation you're important too but for domestic only businesses then that would be a unwelcome intrusion, assuming the UK government would be more lax anyway.

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Originally Posted by Chris

Around 60-70% of British economic activity has nothing at all to do with the EU. Releasing the vast majority of British buinesses from ridiculous Euro-regulation will be an extremely good thing.

I misread his post as saying they wouldn't have to abide by it even if they traded with the EU but I was mistaken. Should have known what he meant though since it's unlikely Osem didn't know that.

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Yet the "stay in" camp are being accused of "Project Fear"...

That wasn't fearmongering. It was a statement of fact

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by jonbxx

When I stated we are like Scandinavians, I meant our general outlook is similar to European countries. I feel that we are getting further and further away from the US in our societal outlook. Others may feel different, it could be the environment I work in (a US company with a big UK based headquarters)

I feel that if we are getting further away from the US it's because they are moving to the right more quickly than we are, rather than our moving away from them and towards Europe.

Look at how extreme many think Jeremy Corbyn's economic policies are. Those wouldn't raise an eyebrow in Scandinavia.

The government want to lower taxation to less than 36.5% of GDP, currently at about 39%. In Sweden that number is 45.8%, 49% in Denmark, 43.6% in Norway.

We don't tolerate taxation above about 40% of GDP in the UK. The idea of paying 45% or 49% is anathema.

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European harmony at work.

[tweedle]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

I feel that if we are getting further away from the US it's because they are moving to the right more quickly than we are, rather than our moving away from them and towards Europe.

Look at how extreme many think Jeremy Corbyn's economic policies are. Those wouldn't raise an eyebrow in Scandinavia.

The government want to lower taxation to less than 36.5% of GDP, currently at about 39%. In Sweden that number is 45.8%, 49% in Denmark, 43.6% in Norway.

We don't tolerate taxation above about 40% of GDP in the UK. The idea of paying 45% or 49% is anathema.

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European harmony at work.

The EU has its head in the sand when it comes to problems, even when it admits to a problem it's never the EU at fault.

Like when someone is shot in the head and the autopsy report says (admits) they were shot in the head but then then says they didn't die from the gun shot wound , it was the blood loss that killed them. Yet if they hadn't been shot in the head they wouldn't of died, it's he same with the EU.

Ok if that doesnt make sense..... I KNEW WHAT I MEANT!!!! Lol

[Hom3r]

I wonder what would happen if we left and in 5/10 years after our economy is booming how many other will jump the sinking EU ship.

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Hom3r

I wonder what would happen if we left and in 5/10 years after our economy is booming how many other will jump the sinking EU ship.

I could see a UK, Germany and France trading bloc. Devil take the rest.

[Hom3r]

By then well have a huge market in China and the US

[Big Brian]

Originally Posted by Hom3r

I wonder what would happen if we left and in 5/10 years after our economy is booming how many other will jump the sinking EU ship.

I think if we leave it won't take 5-10 years. Netherlands and I think Denmark are murmuring about having referenda. If we leave the floodgates will open and the lame duck will die. 5 years at the most IMO.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by jonbxx

It is a big deal when you ship over 100,000 orders per year - 50,000 hours

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Hey, we can agree to differ, that's democracy. You made some good points but unless we could have a control group in science terms, it's difficult to say for sure that things would be different if we weren't in the EU. I can only work on the evidence I have in front of me. I will try and answer your points;

One the peace front, it's not just me, the Nobel Peace Prize committee agree (awarded from Oslo of course)

Do we need a formal framework for international co-operation? No, but it's easier if we group together with common aims. See United Nations

When I stated we are like Scandinavians, I meant our general outlook is similar to European countries. I feel that we are getting further and further away from the US in our societal outlook. Others may feel different, it could be the environment I work in (a US company with a big UK based headquarters)

On the technical side, 'it depends' is not a convincing answer for me. We do have our own medicines agency (MHRA) but it aligns and influences the European Medicines Agency. See also british standards, etc.

I would be interested to see the 40 proposals rejected if you have them, I wasn't aware of this. It's unusual for one country to 'go solo' and agreements are usually reached at the COREPER stage.

Getting near the end now.... In a global market, and I fail to see any sign of globalisation reducing, decisions made in Brussels, Germany or anywhere else will affect the UK, whether we are a member of the EU or not. See the global financial crisis which kicked off with dodgy mortgage lending in the US. Being in the EU, we can influence as part of a larger trading bloc. We can't influence the Euro and neither should we if we aren't a member of the eurozone.

Finally, aren't all voting decisions at least partially self serving? I wouldn't believe anyone would vote completely altruistically and make themselves significantly worse off. Voting decisions surely are influenced a) by facts and b) by beliefs. I believe that the EU is a force for good. I will be voting in.

If someone wants to vote out, then that's cool, this is a democracy. I just hope that all the facts are presented well in the run in instead of some of the rubbish you see in the press (bendy bananas, banned toasters, etc.)

Gonna drop out of the conversation for now, just wanted to say my piece

Some interesting reading for you. http://forbritain.org/MEPs%20votes.pdf

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Some interesting reading for you. http://forbritain.org/MEPs%20votes.pdf

Thanks for this, interesting reading! I have tried to find an apolitical explanation for this as the figures look well sourced. The best I could find was this - http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/20...an-parliament/ His follow up blogs at the bottom of this blog are interesting too

[Big Brian]

Latest Poll of Polls has the Leave slightly ahead in the run up to the big day and some are even showing a 2 point lead for a Brexit! Let's hope they don't make a B***s of it like they did in the GE. Haven't posted links cos I've looked at so many. The YouGov one I Believe shows Leave 51% Stay 49% though they have it 50+1 for Leave and 50-1 for Stay.

[Osem]

I'm not going to take any notice of the polls until just before the referendum. They won't change the way I vote in any event, it'd take a miracle centred on Brussels to do that.

[Big Brian]

Originally Posted by Osem

I'm not going to take any notice of the polls until just before the referendum. They won't change the way I vote in any event, it'd take a miracle centred on Brussels to do that.

Indeed me too but I can't see that happening.

[Mr K]

I suspect most in the 'don't know' category, will choose 'no change' on polling day as the safe option. This is what happened in the GE and Scots referendum.

Bit lousy of the out campaign to try and use the Brussels attacks to their advantage.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35879670
Desperate politics which could backfire.