Is it just me, or does anyone else think this country is totally **** now?

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Nugget

In fairness bud, if you're paying 700 quid tax a month, then you're earning far more than any immigrant who's come to the country to find work

I think his point is that he feels he's paying so much tax because of the costs associated with immigration (amongst other things) and doesn't feel he benefits proportionately. It's a common view.

[idi banashapan]

Originally Posted by chickendippers

Yes, it is just you.

I'm currently wracking up a nice £20,000 debt just to educate myself, but I'd still rather do it in the UK then anywhere else.

i think the point is that you probably wouldn't be in so much debt if you lived elsewhere....

[Nugget]

Originally Posted by Osem

I think his point is that he feels he's paying so much tax because of the costs associated with immigration (amongst other things) and doesn't feel he benefits proportionately. It's a common view.

It might be a common view, but that doesn't necessarily make it a correct one

I'd much rather pay income tax and national insurance to ensure I can get, for example, health care as and when required, as opposed to having to pay separate medical insurance...

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Nugget

It might be a common view, but that doesn't necessarily make it a correct one

I'd much rather pay income tax and national insurance to ensure I can get, for example, health care as and when required, as opposed to having to pay separate medical insurance...

Quite right and that's why I didn't say it was necessarily correct or state my opinion on the subject. The degree to which these issues affect people is variable according to many factors, however, common views need to be listened to by governments if they want to stay in power for very long.....

[Nugget]

Originally Posted by Osem

<snip>common views need to be listened to by governments if they want to stay in power for very long.....

*cough* 18 years of the Tories not listening

*cough* 11 years (so far) of Labour not listening

[BBKing]

It's a common view.

It's an incorrect view. The common cold is, er, common, but it's not a valid source of opinion.

Originally Posted by Bender

i think the point is that you probably wouldn't be in so much debt if you lived elsewhere....

He would be in America, and a lot of other countrys. Further Education is not usually free.

---------- Post added at 11:36 ---------- Previous post was at 11:28 ----------

Originally Posted by Osem

It seems to me that most of the problems in this country are in large part due to the increasing demand for services by an increasing population. Immigration and longevity are both factors in that - it's just a pity HMG didn't consider those things when making some of their major decisions.

In this respect we should look how other countrys manage their health services, France for example have higher tax rates and spend more on their health service, yet you need to 'top-up' your coverage to get the full level of service we get with the NHS.

When you get seen by a GP you have to pay them yourself, and then fill in the paperwork and claim the expenses back.

America has a lot lower tax, but you need to pay medicial insurance yourself. Which is expensive, not least because of lawsuits against doctors which requires them to pass their high insurance costs down to the patients. The high cost leaves millions without any medicial insurance at all

We tend to idolise other systems, all of them have flaws. But in both cases we spend less on our health service (per gdp) and yet expect a much wider coverage that is also free

---------- Post added at 11:43 ---------- Previous post was at 11:36 ----------

Personally, I would like to see us develop a system closer to the French. Bring our spending in line with European Levels and offer a option to go private that is subsidizedby the government (thus freeing up more resources for the standard NHS)

So you have Private medicial insurance, but a lot of paid by the NHS. You simply pay a top-up and you can go private. The NHS has a easy load of cope with as level as increased investement, not all your contributions into the NHS are used against the medicial insurance so they still get *Some* of your money as well.

The Torys had a similer idea at the last election but it needs to be better implemented.

Originally Posted by v0id

There was none of this political correctness *******s

There was very high unemployment,3 day weeks,nationwide power cuts,just about everyone was striking and then there were the punks and the decade ended with the iron B**** in charge.Just about the only thing that was good about this decade was that there was STILL a grants system.

I'd definitely say it was the crappiest decade since WW11.The 80's weren't much better either if you were unemployed or made redundant.

[Nugget]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

I'd definitely say it was the crappiest decade since WW11.The 80's weren't much better either if you were unemployed or made redundant.

Plus the music was chuffing awful - New Romantics anyone?

Originally Posted by Nugget

Plus the music was chuffing awful - New Romantics anyone?

Well some of it was awful but much of it was better than the majority of the punks were producing in the previous decade.

Now the Nineties were rather bleurgh for music..and the politics..but personally I was better off during the 90's and I think most people were.

[webcrawler2050]

Personally i feel this country will just drop dead shortly or there will be a public uproar

The cost of living I.E Tax's Poll Tax, Wage Tax, TV License, Road Tax thats before you even think about the mortage and food.

Personally something needs to be done, I know what but I shouldn't say.

[Mikey845]

Originally Posted by downquark1

Don't watch/read the mainstream news. Everything seems brighter when you don't.

Ignorance is bliss lol

[BBKing]

Bleaugh - 1978-83 was the most creative period in UK music since the mid-60s. Some great stuff around from that time. The rest of the 80s was total dreck, of course.

We tend to idolise other systems

I don't think anyone apart from the nutty right idolises the US medical system, which costs a phenomenal amount of money yet leaves millions without adequate care.

There was very high unemployment,3 day weeks,nationwide power cuts,just about everyone was striking

What, in the seventies? Unemployment went up in the early 80s recession, I seem to remember, before that the last time we had anything close to full employment was the early-mid 70s. Don't just take my word for it:

http://www.esrc.ac.uk/ESRCInfoCentre..._tcm6-6912.jpg

Of course, so many more people work now (due to women going out to work instead of staying at home).

Strikes, yes, 3 day weeks were from January-March 1974 only, until I got born and the country came to its senses, realising that their Ultimate Leader had arrived.

Now we have 10 hour days and never seeing the kids grow up. Also, the oil crisis in 1973 is usually overlooked in these comparisons (one of the major factors behind the inflation that led to the miners strike and three day week, in fact, The subsequent rise in North Sea Oil and Gas is one of the things that blunted the miners strike weapon and allowed Maggie's revenge. Now of course we have no miners, the oil and gas is running out and the gas tap is controlled by the KGB.

One major improvement is in racist and homophobic attitudes, we're way better now as a country. Still, some people aren't happy about it:

Originally Posted by v0id

There was none of this political correctness *******s

Oh dear.

[Nugget]

Originally Posted by webcrawler2050

Personally i feel this country will just drop dead shortly or there will be a public uproar

The cost of living I.E Tax's Poll Tax, Wage Tax, TV License, Road Tax thats before you even think about the mortage and food.

Personally something needs to be done, I know what but I shouldn't say.

Don't mention the TV Licence - they'll never shut up!!

Mind you, it's not a tax anyway

[webcrawler2050]

Originally Posted by Nugget

Don't mention the TV Licence - they'll never shut up!!

Mind you, it's not a tax anyway

Well it's not - but it may as well be they still take you to court and put your name in the paper if you dont pay it *waves fist* lol