10 Meg Problem With Motorola Modem

[justamin]

okies MR monk,.lol.
.well the modem depends more on upstream levels being right as for signals well thats ok on paper minus 7 but at -10 or even 11 will still work not lose its lock, hell mine worked for over 12 months on rg6 over 200 mts with 2 dhts and at - 12 never dropped because of sigs but upstream levels went to 53 then went slow, got the upstream down to 45 no probs...



as for Pace , depends on where they come back from.. telford ouch...

4000 sa boxes that keep reseting, 4200 that won't hit in some areas..

when asked about my repeat rate being a little high due to those boxes last year and how to bring it down I said yep easy, I'll buy my own boxes that work and sell them to telewest..and sack the guy who should be looking after it..
for some reason it didnt go down to well nor did they take my offer up...

but with a repeat rate of under 2 percent for most of the year not bad...

..

Stu, yep when everyone turns everything on at night it can cause a drop in sigs...and because of ingress...same as the upstream will or can should I say change as well...now in a good area, with no probs this may not happen...

so if your customer is close to the max and you leave it, well slow performance, slow channels change, slow internet, get the pic..??


as for channels on the modem well thats normally set, but sometimes the channel their on gets full hense change the channel, see if the reroute makes an improvement...

PS.. wouldn't brag about being a tec here might get slated lol...

one post called us all ermm not very nice names.....


Okies the spelling on this post was correct at time of print, its MSN'S fault if it doesn't look right..

they do it to make blonds look clever.......

if your not happy with the post, or my answers or my work,
I'm blond what do you expect!!!!

and welcome to the mad house of ntl and telewest..

the new uniform is in stock complete with whistle..and a broom to sweep the leaves off the rails when were slack...

hmm now Ive sent you all to sleep.. better go...

[monkeyboy2222]

ok think of it this way - in a pc if u put 3 hardrives, a couple of CD-RW drives etc, floppy, all the gubbins and extras - then run a cpu and gpu intesive app running on it, the PSU is gonnna be put under heavy load and the 12volt rails are gonna fluctuate and most likely drop below 12v and not supply enough amperage.
ok now look at our network - if each house is a component, and they all switch on ur going to stress the PSU (tap in the pit, mux, yadda yadda, and all the way back to the headend). I know its a strenuous and simplistic comparison but it almost works lol. that kinda explains the RF drops.


upstreams - basically if a channel is clogged then our modems do try for a different channel but if there aren't enough unclogged channels what you gonna do? lol

any help?

(ps for gods sakes dont work in london if you get the option lol get in round southend and basildon lol much nicer network )

---------- Post added at 22:22 ---------- Previous post was at 22:05 ----------

lol 200 mts and a 3way splitter?! impressive hehehehe
telford eh? i'll remember that
pace in my area is every1s worst nightmare lol no matter what it is 1000, 1010, 2000, 4000 lol. i've got 3 faulty on board from yesterday, 1 for every CATV install i had hehhehe. ahh the joys of stock control. lol

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by justamin

Opp neally forgot nope ignition not you that makes me smile however send your pics over and Ill share with the lads at work, we need a new dart board... and yesss I'm joking honest...

Heh, bitch I'll remember that if you ever have the pleasure of working on a cabinet freshly decorated by someone's dog with it hammering with rain and the wind whistling while I sit in my nice air conditioned office

---------- Post added at 23:09 ---------- Previous post was at 23:03 ----------

Originally Posted by monkeyboy2222

ok think of it this way - in a pc if u put 3 hardrives, a couple of CD-RW drives etc, floppy, all the gubbins and extras - then run a cpu and gpu intesive app running on it, the PSU is gonnna be put under heavy load and the 12volt rails are gonna fluctuate and most likely drop below 12v and not supply enough amperage.
ok now look at our network - if each house is a component, and they all switch on ur going to stress the PSU (tap in the pit, mux, yadda yadda, and all the way back to the headend). I know its a strenuous and simplistic comparison but it almost works lol. that kinda explains the RF drops.


upstreams - basically if a channel is clogged then our modems do try for a different channel but if there aren't enough unclogged channels what you gonna do? lol

Hahaha

1) Not really true, the customers don't need to have their devices on, the RF power will happily go down the drop cables whether the devices on the other end are switched on or not. The variations in signal over the course of time are due to ingress and environment not due to people plugging and unplugging things signals are split the same regardless. Unless of course you're suggesting that what people do on RF taps affects what other customers are seeing considering signal is split equally between them and terminated where there's nothing connected.

2) Not really true either, modems don't magically migrate to a less congested upstream, they'll take whatever the uBR offers them and only if the channel is congested to the point where they can't acknowledge the upstream and complete the process will they give up and take another upstream channel offer (suggest you read up on UCD advertisements in DOCSIS).

[hoofner]

Even if what was said before was true, that would mean every customer has had everything turned on for over a year, not likely! The majority of phone calls to TW I discover that ALL the channels are at over 85%, and this has been pretty much like this in my area in Bristol for nearly a year now. From being a member on these forums I'm quite sure this isn't the only place affected like this, so anyone patronising us about everyone turning their taps or pcs on at the same time is really just taking the p!$$ with their eyes firmly shut. I think we'd be much more accepting if it was occaisional, but not every day. And if I did want to put 50 harddrives in my pc i'd buy a power supply powerful enough to support it!

[monkeyboy2222]

The amount of ingress and Egress isn't going to change that drastically at peak times though? arnies don't fall off of taps at 5.30 then screw themselves back later on! as for the environment, at the moment the weather doesn't change dramatically enough for it to affect the levels at peak times.
With my basic knowledge of physic cold weather will lower the resistance in the copper core of the cabling (lower temp = less atomic vibration = easier movment of electrons) so in theory *cough cough* levels should be better now that in summer.
but also at this time of year there is a loooot of moisture which is never a good thing.
and the upstream - modems do change upstream if the cant get a lock - you just said they do lol.

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by monkeyboy2222

The amount of ingress and Egress isn't going to change that drastically at peak times though? arnies don't fall off of taps at 5.30 then screw themselves back later on! as for the environment, at the moment the weather doesn't change dramatically enough for it to affect the levels at peak times.
With my basic knowledge of physic cold weather will lower the resistance in the copper core of the cabling (lower temp = less atomic vibration = easier movment of electrons) so in theory *cough cough* levels should be better now that in summer.
but also at this time of year there is a loooot of moisture which is never a good thing.
and the upstream - modems do change upstream if the cant get a lock - you just said they do lol.

It's not about what happens in the network, people get home and start turning their TVs on, using their microwaves, talking on their DECT phones, etc, etc, etc. The network doesn't necessarily get any more or less resilient to noise, there's just more of it around at these times, fact.

The cabling isn't the main cause of environmental variance it's the amplifiers and the lasers, both tend to be more efficient in cooler weather and so deliver higher power which can be every bit as bad as low depending how network is running. Higher doesn't necessarily equal better. Some amps have temperature detection circuits which adjust gain to compensate for the weather. It's not a major issue in this country at this time of year however inside cabinets can get really hot in summer.

You claimed that modems change on a clogged upstream, that's not necessarily true it has to be *really* clogged and not with normal traffic but modems trying to get a lock as there are dedicated slots provided as part of the upstream MAPs for UCD acknowledgement and for the unsolicited traffic that modems initially send to request a SID. Modems tend to be rather attached to upstreams and can take hours to give up on one if they do at all. Depending on segmentation they may not even have another upstream to choose from.

[justamin]

Hmm hate to admit but ignite boy is mostly right, however signals do drop when the load increases as and when ppl come home, same as if someone has dodgy equipment conected, and by that I dont mean funny boxes but anything from a faulty TV or video can knock out the entire street, or area...

yep take that from a tec who spent 3 hrs when we worked on Sundays, called the network guys out and found 1 little old ladies TV was causing a buzzing noise on 50 phone lines..

or a guys video who only recorded after 7 pm for about 30 mins was interfering with the guy next doors TV.. ( that 1 was found by a guy who now works for NTL..) so its easy for someone to complain we didnt do this but if its working at the time we get there, where do we go ..?

modems well yep they will stay where there told to be unless changed..BY can change it, on some modems we can, not really sure if they have a search bulit in.. but there again we are told 1 thing in training another when you say nope not my prob..

The TV drive well told on training we will NOT be fitting hdmi cables, the customer buys them and will have to fit them.. hmm the book says tecs will bring the cables and fit them..

no idea where I.m going with this but been a long week and as the best half went to bed, yes she keeps teling me she's the best, someone had to suffer so you all got it..

and ignite boy, as for the remark about hey bitch and warm office,
you know that nice warm feeling you get in that chair in that nice office , yess, well I sent the dog to lift his leg on the chair.. thats why its soooo warm................
and next time remeber your MY bitch................

have a real good weekend guys/girls...

[Ignition]

Meh so signals don't 'drop' just the ingress increases as I said above

Originally Posted by me

It's not about what happens in the network, people get home and start turning their TVs on, using their microwaves, talking on their DECT phones, etc, etc, etc. The network doesn't necessarily get any more or less resilient to noise, there's just more of it around at these times, fact.

[Stu038]

Sorry I've not rejoined this discussion sooner but unlike Ignition I got a life beyond the forum

Much as it hurts I got to agree with him here though, I just don't see how more people using the RF can make the carriers reduce in power.

As we seem to be into dodgy comparisons

If 200 people are listening to Radio 1 everything is ok if 250 are listening then the signals poor? Sorry but RF doesn't work that way.

Both the signal and the carrier can be affected by many things, distance from source, transmission medium, interference in many shapes & forms but not by capacity of usage.

While Monkey maybe partially right with the temperature bit, Ignition may be as well. The problems there are generally related to the fact that the thermal AGCs are normally designed for the American market where everything hangs on poles. What they do is sense the increase or decrease in the temperature of the amplifier and then increase or decrease the RF level accordingly working on the basis that the attenuation of the cable is also increasing or decreasing. The problem though is that in the UK the majority of the cabling is in underground ducting so therefore is not affected by the weather.

Hence you end up over or under driving your amplifiers which not only creates level fluctuations but also horrendous distortions.

The majority of the franchises I've dealt with worked that one out in the early 90s.

Please reassure me that the Telewest network is not overhead or that its not still using thermal AGCs incorrectly.

Originally Posted by Ignition

Modems tend to be rather attached to upstreams and can take hours to give up on one if they do at all. Depending on segmentation they may not even have another upstream to choose from.

Frequency hopping mate, we had lots of problems with it in the early days, that's why the flaplists were a god send.

[Eowo]

Ok first off Iâ₠¬ÃƒÆ’¢â€žÂ¢m no engineer, but youââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re radio1 RF is kind of a totally different matter altogether.

Broadcast RF is nothing like RF through a cable. It's broadcast through the air.

Ok letââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s take that a step further, once the FM RF signal is is received by an aerial it is sent to a stereo. Fine but what happens if you add another, and another to the same aerial. The signal gets weaker, and youââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re sound quality ends up crap.

Just my 2 cents

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by Eowo

Ok first off Iâ₠¬ÃƒÆ’¢â€žÂ¢m no engineer, but youââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re radio1 RF is kind of a totally different matter altogether.

Broadcast RF is nothing like RF through a cable. It's broadcast through the air.

Ok letââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s take that a step further, once the FM RF signal is is received by an aerial it is sent to a stereo. Fine but what happens if you add another, and another to the same aerial. The signal gets weaker, and youââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re sound quality ends up crap.

Just my 2 cents

No the signal you get on radio 1 stays as strong as it was before it's the noise of other unwanted signals that causes the degredation. SNR on radio 1 drops as noise level increases.

[Stu038]

Originally Posted by Eowo

Ok first off Iâ₠¬ÃƒÆ’¢â€žÂ¢m no engineer, but youââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re radio1 RF is kind of a totally different matter altogether.

Broadcast RF is nothing like RF through a cable. It's broadcast through the air.

Ok letââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s take that a step further, once the FM RF signal is is received by an aerial it is sent to a stereo. Fine but what happens if you add another, and another to the same aerial. The signal gets weaker, and youââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re sound quality ends up crap.

Just my 2 cents

it was meant as a comparison not a direct reference

The point mate is that a cable network is made up of a combination of fibre and coaxial cable and designed in such a way that it doesn't matter whether 1 or 100 people are connected to it they'll all still receive the same level of signal that they were originally set up with baring a fault.
It therefore becomes your transmitter, be that a radio station transmitter or a TV transmitter. Oh and by the way you'll find that when you get down to the basic RF and IF without the carriers you'll find there less difference than you think

Once we leave the street cabinet though its a whole different ball game, the cable from the cab to your house becomes your aerial and yes if you connect too many STB's, modems etc you will get problems with signal levels.

hth

[SuperHans]

The power levels on your cable modem are excellant. What are you downloading at? I do not know of any sites that will let you download at 10MB. They will cap it for bandwidth reasons. Speedtests are useless so forget them. If you can download from an FTP site at 900KB upwards that is good.

[justamin]

err Hans what you mean his power levels are excellent.. wow you must not have looked at the upstream.. or have we suddenly changed it...

[SuperHans]

Originally Posted by justamin

err Hans what you mean his power levels are excellent.. wow you must not have looked at the upstream.. or have we suddenly changed it...

Yeh upstreams very good. Anywhere between 42 - 59. Also depends on what region he is in. it varies from region to region. You are right they may have changed it since the NTL buy out, but in my day those where the levels I worked to and I wouldnt have rolled out a tech for that.

That 5101e is 1 of the newer modems however there are alot of Sync failures in the logs. To be honest Just im guessing you are service tech so cable modems are your expertise. SO I could be wrong. I was 2nd line suport but now im in a proper IT job as a Novel network adminstrator. So PCs are my thing.