Muslims to march in London

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Bone idleness?

If someone attacks this nation then should they go unpunished?
What does Sharia law say about treason?
How about financial theft?

That probably doesn't apply to our laws because we are kaffirs (which, where I come from is a very insulting term)

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

I've made my feelings on living in Britain pretty clear before. Apart from the weather I love it. As a muslim I can attend one of many local mosques, I can go for Friday prayers, there is an economy where I can buy halaal meat, I can eat out (even 3 of my local Nandos sell halaal chicken). There are even state funded muslim schools where as well as studying the national curriculum, pupils can study about Islam too. I could be living in a different non muslim country where non of this would be possible.

I, and ALL the muslims I know, do not feel that we need to convert Britain to Islam, or Islamacise any other part of the western non muslim world to live as first, a decent human being (which is what my religion teaches me) and subsequently as a good muslim. Additionally I dont see why Shariah law should be implemented in a non muslim country.

I don't have to participate in any of the non muslim things which I feel are negative to me practising my religion, after all we have freedom of choice.

As far as Xaccers points, I have not lived in a country where Shariah law is implemented. The point I will make is that people always pick up on what they see as the negative/barbaric points of shariah law and hence get scared of it or demonise it. There are other aspects of Shariah law which might be seen as favourable to this very same group. I doubt if anyone likes ALL the law in the UK.

A lot of muslim countries who adopt some form of Shariah law have bended rules to suit westerners and non muslims. For example you can drink in certain areas in Saudi, and there are churches in Pakistan. I am sure there are other examples too but the point Im trying to make is that we are always comparing extremes.

Throughout this thread there is an opinion that the actions of those placard carrying idiots represtents the majority of Islam in the UK, and now we hear of how all muslims want to Islamacise Britain. Well as a muslim I don't buy it. No headline on the front page of the Sun, or the spouting of a**holes such as Abu Hamza or some other Al Majroun cronies will convince me that this is the case, because I know too many muslims who think otherwise.

---------- Post added at 11:58 ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 ----------

Originally Posted by Ramrod

That probably doesn't apply to our laws because we are kaffirs (which, where I come from is a very insulting term)

The term Kaffir is an arabic term meaning non believer.

Anyway what you say as this 'doesnt apply to our law', I know many muslims who use that argument. That is, we don't live in a muslim country and therefore we can do what we want. However the Koran and teachings of the Prophet make it clear that you have to obey/respect the law of the country you live in. Those engaging in such activities in my opinion are just hypocrites.

[basa]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

........... and now we hear of how all muslims want to Islamacise Britain. Well as a muslim I don't buy it. No headline on the front page of the Sun, or the spouting of a**holes such as Abu Hamza or some other Al Majroun cronies will convince me that this is the case, because I know too many muslims who think otherwise.

It may not be something that you and the majority of UK muslims are working towards, but just as many laws and other changes to the way this country works are not put to a public vote, it will possibly be implemented without your consent. The silent majority (of muslims) are not heard because they don't speak out.

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

Originally Posted by basa

It may not be something that you and the majority of UK muslims are working towards, but just as many laws and other changes to the way this country works are not put to a public vote, it will possibly be implemented without your consent. The silent majority (of muslims) are not heard because they don't speak out.

Can you explain how this would be done then. And what is it that you think going to be implemented? I for one dont see a muslim leadership ever coming into the Uk, so are you saying this will be an underground movement? Am I going to wake up one day and ever woman in Britain will be forced to wear a Burkha (and FYI this is not a requirement of Sharia Law). I am a bit confused as to what you're afraid of, or concerned about?

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

Throughout this thread there is an opinion that the actions of those placard carrying idiots represtents the majority of Islam in the UK, and now we hear of how all muslims want to Islamacise Britain. Well as a muslim I don't buy it.

The chap who did the study was a muslim himself, and it isn't the majority of muslims who want sharia law but a significant minority (it seems)
....and it was for the telegraph, not the sun.

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

So whats the excuse for non muslim benefit cheats doing the same? Are they not attacking Britain too, maybe we should group them into the same people as above.

I think the point was that it is suggested that the benefit cheating mentioned is specifically orchestrated as an 'attack'.

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

The chap who did the study was a muslim himself, and it isn't the majority of muslims who want sharia law but a significant minority (it seems)
....and it was for the telegraph, not the sun.

Yeah I know the survey was in the telegraph. Its the one conducted after the march on Saturday, right? And 400 muslims gave their views? One of the commentators in the news this morning was saying that the muslims questioned were saying they wanted some aspects of Shariah law. Anyway thats beside the point. The point is that 400 people dont represent the views of everyone, and if we take the sample population for the survey, there mindset might already be influenced by the fact they were already on a demo criticing the west. The Sun did have an editorial and a lot of column space to this as well.

[basa]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

Can you explain how this would be done then. And what is it that you think going to be implemented? I for one dont see a muslim leadership ever coming into the Uk, so are you saying this will be an underground movement? Am I going to wake up one day and ever woman in Britain will be forced to wear a Burkha (and FYI this is not a requirement of Sharia Law). I am a bit confused as to what you're afraid of, or concerned about?

There are already a number of Asian / Muslim politicians in local and central government.

As more immigrants enter the country there are more people who will vote for an asian / muslim representative in government, more islamic friendly laws are pushed through. Even white britons may wish to attract the muslim vote to stay in post and push for muslim friendly laws ... so it goes on.

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

There are other aspects of Shariah law which might be seen as favourable to this very same group.

I look forward to having the positive aspects of sharia law explained.

---------- Post added at 12:25 ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 ----------

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

The term Kaffir is an arabic term meaning non believer.

And the term 'kaffer' in south Africa is considered a very insulting swear word. (As it is in Dutch.)

Hence, despite it's 'innocent' Arabic origin, whenever I read it in Muslim/Islamic text, I can't help but feel insulted.

However, I won't be organising a protest rally...

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

and if we take the sample population for the survey, there mindset might already be influenced by the fact they were already on a demo criticing the west.

I'm confused, where did it say that the sample population was taken from the people on the march? I thought it was a random sample of Muslims....

---------- Post added at 12:28 ---------- Previous post was at 12:26 ----------

Originally Posted by ScaredWebWarrior

And the term 'kaffer' in south Africa is considered a very insulting swear word. (As it is in Dutch.)

Exactly! Whenever I hear it used to describe me I am incredibly insulted (it's such a bad word that it's use was banned in apartheid era south africa!)

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

Originally Posted by basa

There are already a number of Asian / Muslim politicians in local and central government.

As more immigrants enter the country there are more people who will vote for an asian / muslim representative in government, more islamic friendly laws are pushed through. Even white britons may wish to attract the muslim vote to stay in post and push for muslim friendly laws ... so it goes on.

Are you saying that all immigrants coming into the UK will be muslim? And that such a large number will come in to over take the 'non muslim' vote. Im just simplifying this into a non muslim vs muslim vote to make the discussion easier to follow.

As far as Im aware Leicester is one of the only cities in the UK where whats classed as ethnic has overtaken the English population. And this included 'etnicc' muslims as well as non muslims. I think their are more Hindus in Leicester than muslims.

CAn you elaborate on the muslim laws that you are worried about? To be honest I feel too many people are influenced by a lot of the tabloid scaremongering, without thinking about the feasibility of such a siutuation actually happening.

---------- Post added at 12:32 ---------- Previous post was at 12:29 ----------

Originally Posted by Ramrod

I'm confused, where did it say that the sample population was taken from the people on the march? I thought it was a random sample of Muslims....

---------- Post added at 12:28 ---------- Previous post was at 12:26 ----------

Exactly! Whenever I hear it used to describe me I am incredibly insulted (it's such a bad word that it's use was banned in apartheid era south africa!)

I thought the survey was conducted after the march? MAybe Im wrong. Still I think we agree that the small number can not represent the views of a majority of muslims in the UK

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

The point is that 400 people dont represent the views of everyone, and if we take the sample population for the survey, there mindset might already be influenced by the fact they were already on a demo criticing the west.

How do you know that the views of these 400 are not representative? Are your assertions based on those of you and 399 other like-minded individuals?

The fact is, a large number of the people on that protest were in favour of the idea of sharia law - you say that's not the view of the majority of Muslims.

That must mean that the protest was by the 'minority' - i.e. the ones blamed for all the misunderstanding we have about Muslims.

[Xaccers]

Adultary: only committed if there's a witness or confession. Hence why a woman can be stoned to death while man gets off scot free (if she confesses and he doesn't)
Theft: Removal of hand. Certainly no tabloid scaremongering there, I've seen it.
Murder: Removal of head. Again, no tabloid scaremongering there either, I've seen the block.

Where's OB with her quotes stating that if a woman leaves the protection of a man, he should beat her to remind her he's there for her own protection etc?

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

I thought the survey was conducted after the march? MAybe Im wrong.

I don't know either but I assume that if it was just the marchers polled, they would have said so

Still I think we agree that the small number can not represent the views of a majority of muslims in the UK

Agreed, they need a larger survey....

[basa]

Originally Posted by ScaredWebWarrior

...........However, I won't be organising a protest rally...

Why the hell not !!!???

If you're insulted then I'm insulted .. hell we're ALL insulted !!!!!



"Briton's insult at being termed 'Kaffir'. Calls for new laws protecting British atheists"