Pro or Anti NTL? The Truth

[Tricky]

I voted PRO(!)

I've never really had any problems with NTL (they fixed my lost BB connection (within 45 minutes on the phone!!))
They installed and then charged me at a cheaper rate for longer than I signed up for.
Telephone service is OK now I get line rental for £5
My MAJOR gripes are:
the CAP - I often download linux software and the 1gb is just not enough!
newsservers - See previous point - files are just not there long enough to download 999mb per day
mail system - constant outages
but it beats my old dialup via freeserve!!!

Originally posted by towny
So you're anti-NTL then?

That might be the view of Pro NTL morons but it's not so, I'm only concerned that NTL is governed by a poor executive management.

[carlingman]

Well as I consider this topic to be unjustified I voted somewhere else.

The use of "pro" and "anti" only gives rise to lame people who cannot form their own unbiest opinions and gives them a perfect opportunity to tar people with the slogan "pro" or "anti".

My own opinion is I have a fair idea how this "pro" and "anti" NTL began and to me it needs to stop right now, especially as many have commented it is having an affect on the site.

If you think the divide is affecting the site as I do then why not report it as I have although it never got me nowhere not even a response.

To me it is nothing short of name calling and to me this has to stop.

I personally hate this "anti" and "pro" NTL group labelling and agree that as long as discussion is kept to within the site Terms Of Service, it should be permitted to continue and without the need to start name calling.

This site contains people from many walks of life and ages and there is no doubt going to be disagreements etc. but we all should be adult enough to allow people to take part in the discussion, and god forbid if they are happy with their NTL services then why resort to calling them "pro" NTL.

On the other side of the coin why choose to go straight for the "anti" NTL option if their grievance is justified as this does allow the thread to flow, be patient and let the people have their opinion.

Surely if they are just slating and getting personal and ranting then surely the Mods will step in.

Creating a divide between "pro" and "anti" will only incite people and cause a problem to the site and the thread.

I dont want to come here and see constant arguments between people and constant intervention by Mods with threads being closed and members being banned etc.

All this is about to me surely is healthy discussion without the need for "pro" or "anti" NTL labelling or personal insults being hurled back and forth.

We are all members here but not all are customers, employees etc a mixture of both maybe or even ex employees like myself or maybe even none of the above but it would be nice for everyone to get on and participate in a reasonable level of discussion.

I cannot see why there is a need to create a "pro" or "anti" NTL divide and continue with this name calling.

Thanks for listening.

Originally posted by carlingman
Well as I consider this topic to be unjustified I voted somewhere else.

The use of "pro" and "anti" only gives rise to lame people who cannot form their own unbiest opinions and gives them a perfect opportunity to tar people with the slogan "pro" or "anti".

My own opinion is I have a fair idea how this "pro" and "anti" NTL began and to me it needs to stop right now, especially as many have commented it is having an affect on the site.

If you think the divide is affecting the site as I do then why not report it as I have although it never got me nowhere not even a response.

To me it is nothing short of name calling and to me this has to stop.

I personally hate this "anti" and "pro" NTL group labelling and agree that as long as discussion is kept to within the site Terms Of Service, it should be permitted to continue and without the need to start name calling.

This site contains people from many walks of life and ages and there is no doubt going to be disagreements etc. but we all should be adult enough to allow people to take part in the discussion, and god forbid if they are happy with their NTL services then why resort to calling them "pro" NTL.

On the other side of the coin why choose to go straight for the "anti" NTL option if their grievance is justified as this does allow the thread to flow, be patient and let the people have their opinion.

Surely if they are just slating and getting personal and ranting then surely the Mods will step in.

Creating a divide between "pro" and "anti" will only incite people and cause a problem to the site and the thread.

I dont want to come here and see constant arguments between people and constant intervention by Mods with threads being closed and members being banned etc.

All this is about to me surely is healthy discussion without the need for "pro" or "anti" NTL labelling or personal insults being hurled back and forth.

We are all members here but not all are customers, employees etc a mixture of both maybe or even ex employees like myself or maybe even none of the above but it would be nice for everyone to get on and participate in a reasonable level of discussion.

I cannot see why there is a need to create a "pro" or "anti" NTL divide and continue with this name calling.

Thanks for listening.

HEAR,HEAR!

Incog who has not even voted because I hate to give this pro,anti thing any encouragement what so ever.I was hoping that this thread would be CLOSED.

Originally posted by Incognitas
HEAR,HEAR!

Incog who has not even voted because I hate to give this pro,anti thing any encouragement what so ever.I was hoping that this thread would be CLOSED.

I wrote in post #28 "Nah, I'm not voting on this silly topic."

Your appeal for closure represents much of what is wrong on the nthw.com site: CJ shuts threads when he doesn't like what's being said. Me, I m in favour of free speech and against the Stalinist style of running sites.

Let people say what they wish and let them get it off their chests! If it makes them feel better.

[th'engineer]

I voted Pro.

[Undisputedtruth]

Originally posted by Incognitas
HEAR,HEAR!

Incog who has not even voted because I hate to give this pro,anti thing any encouragement what so ever.I was hoping that this thread would be CLOSED.

As I said earlier.

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
Where I draw the line is when the pro NTL mobs attacks other customers for expressing anti NTL feelings. They would bunch up on them, make personal remarks about them and demand threads to be closed down where pro NTL mobs has lost control.

[th'engineer]

UDT, do not know what you are on about in respect of pro or anti remember i am pro ntl

[Undisputedtruth]

Originally posted by th'engineer
UDT, do not know what you are on about in respect of pro or anti remember i am pro ntl

Just to reinterate what I've said earlier on in the thread. I have no problems with customers praising NTL for genuine good service.

I coined 'the proNTL mob' phrase beacause I recognised there are some hardliners (mostly employees of NTL) out there that would attack people expressing antiNTL feeling, demand threads to be closed when the thread goes against them.

'Engineer' I wouldn't class you as part of the proNTL mob.

[th'engineer]

the interesting thing is that some people that work for the company could actually be the anti NTL mob.

Not listening and not acting on customer feedback, therefore not doing the company any good .

I want NTL to grow and be profitable to do this stakeholders comments should be welcomed and changes implemented

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by th'engineer

the interesting thing is that some people that work for the company could actually be the anti NTL mob.

Not listening and not acting on customer feedback, therefore not doing the company any good .

I want NTL to grow and be profitable to do this stakeholders comments should be welcomed and changes implemented

That's correct about some people working for ntl being anti-ntl, or would it be better to say they are people with their eyes open who will not defend ntl's actions.

I know many ntl employees who these days would not lift a finger to do an ounce of extra work than they have to, many of these people were commited to the job until they became treated so badly. Now they go to work for the money and can't wait to get back home and doing as little as possible in the process. These people however don't post about ntl because the last thing they want to do is waste their own time thinking about ntl and depressing themselves even further.

I think the amount of so called "pro-ntl" employees are a very small number, the ones that gang up as UDT claim are the minority and dont make much of a dent in the dwindling 13000 or so employees at ntl these days.
I just dont take much notice myself because I know they are outnumbered by at least 10-1 by employees who think the company is s**t and have no loyalty because of the rough treatment they have been receiving.

[dialanothernumb]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

HEAR,HEAR!

Incog who has not even voted because I hate to give this pro,anti thing any encouragement what so ever.I was hoping that this thread would be CLOSED.

I have now realised that the disadvantage of long threads is that people (perfectly understandably) tend to react to the most recent posts and not look at the first post.

Those who say it's a silly wee thread are right...........

The post I made in starting this thread was trying to hint at the shallowness of labelling oneself (or even worse, other people) as pro- or anti-ntl.

The truth is we're all INTERESTED in ntl, because they provide (or are supposed to provide) various telecom services, and sometimes these go wrong or change. Some are here as they have expertise, some are here as they have a fixable problem and some are here because they want to change an aspect of how ntl provide (CS, TS, networks, BB in London etc.)

The idea of setting up the thread was to demonstrate how many people for whom the labels pro and anti are inappropriate and to let those who have a major grievance or loyalty declare themselves.

As the thread starter, I guess I can suggest to the mods the thread be closed, but:
For those who didn't like the question being asked, but still posted to express an opinion... thanks, that's what discussion is about.

For those who declared their position, whether pro- or anti and explained why, well done.. respect.

Would a kind mod please close this thread? thanks

[Escapee]

I am obviously not pro-ntl, then on the other hand I am not anti-ntl!

I guess most would label me as anti-ntl because I have a go at ntl, but I worked for ntl and received some rough treatment along with many others who are still working for the company and being treated even worse now.

My main issues with ntl are not customer related but with poor management, useless people getting on in the company and the big niggle of non-technical people ie: CS types now taking control of all the technical issue at regional level and ex-CS people being given technical management positions and making a hash of it in the process!

I think most ntl employees who visit this site would probably not even know about the issues that I am talking about because the majority of ntl posters appear to be from CS or other desk jobs, the only technical/network ones that I can think of are from national teams and not local ones.
Very often the national peoples views and apparent happyness are very different from the guys at a local level.

I still have some friends in ntl and the volunteers they had for the recent redundancies in one department says it all really.

[Undisputedtruth]

I think everyone has recognised there is a proNTL mobs camp. It is reassuring to hear that many people are not willing to take sides or be involved in such squabbles. It is also important to note, not to label the customers who are outspoken as antiNTL. They are a voice of reason and many of the things they have been saying are still true today. I also think it is apparent to everyone that the proNTL mobs goes around attacking everyone who speaks out against NTL and the very same people are not happy in the use of proNTL language as this exposes their activities. Luckily, the proNTL mobs are few in numbers and I appeal to the mods to watch their behaviour. I am also willing to supply names for a watch list.

[Nemesis]

Originally Posted by Undisputedtruth

I think everyone has recognised there is a proNTL mobs camp. It is reassuring to hear that many people are not willing to take sides or be involved in such squabbles. It is also important to note, not to label the customers who are outspoken as antiNTL. They are a voice of reason and many of the things they have been saying are still true today. I also think it is apparent to everyone that the proNTL mobs goes around attacking everyone who speaks out against NTL and the very same people are not happy in the use of proNTL language as this exposes their activities. Luckily, the proNTL mobs are few in numbers and I appeal to the mods to watch their behaviour. I am also willing to supply names for a watch list.

Am I on that list then ??