Guns For Self-Defence

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by me283

However, if there were a chance of a householder shooting me, then I think it would be time for a career change.

Or more likely get a bigger more powerful gun. It would be interesting to know what the burgalry rates are in the USA? Whether there is a dramatic decrease in break-in rates, when gun laws are more liberal.
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Originally Posted by me283

Exactly. It will never happen to everyone; thus it is a ridiculous suggestion to say that you don't change the law because of something that only happens to some people.

This is getting repetitive. It wasn't some people but a small minority of people. Do we stop football matches becuase there are a small minority of trouble makers? Do we stop flying because a very tiny minority crash? No, we accept the small risk and get on with it. The same logic applies.

[me283]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

Or more likely get a bigger more powerful gun. It would be interesting to know what the burgalary rates are in the USA? Whether there is a dramatic decrease in break-in rates, when gun laws are more liberal.

I didn't mention the USA, although every person on this board who is anti-guns just seems to cite the USA as an example. They seem to forget that there are other countries much closer to hum where you can legally own a gun. Many of these have a society which may be deemed much closer to ours than the USA. As another poster says, let's see how things pan out in Italy.

People seem to think that if guns are legalised in this country then every criminal will have access to one. WAKE UP PEOPLE!!! Criminals can easily get guns now; it's the people who would use them properly that cannot get them easily. When guns were outlawed, the only result was that the only people to have guns are outlaws. And my word, haven't they obeyed the law and given up their guns too!

So you say criminals will get bigger guns... they would still be aware that they could end up being shot, which might make them think twice.

On a final note, there is a joke in the States about our police. In the States the police say "Stop, or I'll shoot!" In the UK the police say "Stop, or I'll shout "Stop" again".
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Originally Posted by SlackDad

This is getting repetitive. It wasn't some people but a small minority of people. Do we stop football matches becuase there are a small minority of trouble makers? Do we stop flying because a very tiny minority crash? No, we accept the small risk and get on with it. The same logic applies.

Not sure I follow the logic, but I really can't be bothered to go over salient points with someone who completely dismisses anything logical.

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by me283

Not sure I follow the logic, but I really can't be bothered to go over salient points with someone who completely dismisses anything logical.

Someone please tell me I'm not losing it. Please?

Originally Posted by SlackDad

Someone please tell me I'm not losing it. Please?

You're not losing it.
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I thought my post made perfectly logical sense and indeed SlackDad's responses. Looks like someone's trying to make out otherwise through selective editing. Not a very good way of conducting a reasoned debate.

[me283]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

Someone please tell me I'm not losing it. Please?

I'm sure someone will.
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Originally Posted by andyl

You're not losing it.

Ah, right on cue!

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by me283

On a final note, there is a joke in the States about our police. In the States the police say "Stop, or I'll shoot!" In the UK the police say "Stop, or I'll shout "Stop" again".

I thought always using the USA as an example was wrong?

And the truth behind that joke is such a bad thing is it?

[me283]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

I thought always using the USA as an example was wrong?

And the truth behind that joke is such a bad thing is it?

Well, if you look hard, you will see that the example actually pertains to the UK. And IMO the truth behind that joke is a bad thing.

Originally Posted by SlackDad

I thought always using the USA as an example was wrong?

And the truth behind that joke is such a bad thing is it?

The USA where you can buy a gun at the supermarket? Isn't Walmart the world's largest personal firearms retailer? Certainly a big selection here: http://www.walmart.com/catalog/catal...A4155%3A170080. Thankfully I can't see Walmart subsidiary ASDA following suit!

[me283]

Originally Posted by andyl

The USA where you can buy a gun at the supermarket? Isn't Walmart the world's largest personal firearms retailer? Certainly a big selection here: http://www.walmart.com/catalog/catal...A4155%3A170080. Thankfully I can't see Walmart subsidiary ASDA following suit!

Ah yes, fine example of the USA being used as an example again. Of course, no other country in the world has legal guns, do they?

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by me283

Ah yes, fine example of the USA being used as an example again. Of course, no other country in the world has legal guns, do they?

OK, let's move on from USA. How about Brazil:

"Every 15 minutes, someone dies from a gunshot wound in Brazil; that means over 100 gun deaths every day, some 38,000 every year, and 325,551 in the past decade

Most victims are young †“ aged between 15 and 24 years old

Firearms kill more than motor-vehicle accidents in Brazil

Firearms are the biggest single cause of death for young males."
Source: Control Arms

Guns for self defence work!

[punky]

Good posts Me283 (can't rep you yet though)

I would like to make another quick point. Crime almost always preys on the weak. The vunerable. Not always, but the vast majority of the time. If you are a rapist and your target might be packing a weapon, wouldn't it make you think twice?

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

Or more likely get a bigger more powerful gun.

Thats just silly. A small gun can kill you as easily as a big one in a burgulary situation....

Attack is the best form of defence kind of thing. The thought of people not just owning guns but walking around streets with them frightens me to death (ooh, better get a gun )

[me283]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

OK, let's move on from USA. How about Brazil:

"Every 15 minutes, someone dies from a gunshot wound in Brazil; that means over 100 gun deaths every day, some 38,000 every year, and 325,551 in the past decade

Most victims are young †“ aged between 15 and 24 years old

Firearms kill more than motor-vehicle accidents in Brazil

Firearms are the biggest single cause of death for young males."
Source: Control Arms

Guns for self defence work!

Very interesting, but let me ask you a direct question: if I could show you statistics that showed crime levels were lower in a country that had legal guns, would you suddenly think guns would be a good idea in the UK?
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Originally Posted by andyl

Attack is the best form of defence kind of thing. The thought of people not just owning guns but walking around streets with them frightens me to death (ooh, better get a gun )

Which is one of the reasons that I suggested guns might be best made legal PROVIDED they are kept in the home etc etc. That's the problem with putting people on ignore because you don't like their opinions... you miss out on the good points that they make.

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

Thats just silly. A small gun can kill you as easily as a big one in a burgulary situation....

Very true. I was making a rather lame semi-humorous point about my gun being bigger than yours, if you know what I mean.
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Originally Posted by me283

Very interesting, but let me ask you a direct question: if I could show you statistics that showed crime levels were lower in a country that had legal guns, would you suddenly think guns would be a good idea in the UK?

I know there are countries where this is the case, but show me nonetheless. As I have said in an earlier post in this thread, much boils down to the culture of fear that we live in. Putting guns in the hands of people already frightened by terrorist attacks, fear of crime etc. and how the media portray these issues, can only lead to more bloodshed and violence.

But even if we didn't live in such 'anxious' times my answer would still be no.