NTL promoting copyright infringement - Page 17

andygrif · 05-09-2003, 16:59

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
one thing your forgetting is if a person was not going to buy something yet they found it for free and took how would a company be losing profits ?

There is no such thing as a victimless crime.

I know someone who never rents or buys videos or DVDs, never goes to the cinema. Yet he downloads his movies from the net.

You're not seriously telling me that he wouldn't buy DVDs or go to the cinema if that option wasn't available to him are you?

Play it the other way. Imagaine everyone has fibre direct internet connections right to their house. You can download moves in 20 minutes. It's still illegal, but begause everyone has such fast connections the new breed of Kazza and Morpheus have evolved.

Now people are downloading 20/30 movies a day, all ripped from single DVDs or pre-release review copies.

There is a 70% reduction in DVD sales and a 50% reduction in cinema attendance.

Do you think there will be as many new movies coming out now, with the huge advances in CGI, immense scenery and sets, major stars?

How will they pay for that, as most of the studios will have gone bust - and that was just becuase no-one was buying classic back-catalogue movies anymore, becuase they were all on the net for free.

We're at the start of something potentially catastrophic for the movie industry as a whole. You can't see it yet, becuase all you see is something for nothin, and hey, everyone likes something for nothing (especially as they've been milking us for years right?)

Well that's great, so a bunch of overpaid yanks end up on the street. We'll be OK right?

Wrong! Cinemas will shut. CD & DVD pressing plants and distribution centres will shut. The lorry drivers will lose their jobs, haulage firms will close. HMV's profits will reduce to virtually nothing, shop assistants will lose their jobs.

Even supermarkets are basing huge contributions to their bottom line on entertainment media. Do you know someone who works in a shop?

All this becuase you don't see the bigger picture.

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
andygrif it is dodgey ground if you make a backup yes technically your not allowed to but it is accepted and i doubt anyone would care because you do own the original in the retail sense

As I said, it is accepted, but still technically you are in breach of the copyrights of the composer, publisher, artist and record label.

But I take your point.

Quote:

Originally posted by timewarrior2001
Well with that thinking lets abolish the internet because thats how a lot of paedophiles get their stuff.
Ban all ISP's destroy the whole internet and downt even allow online games.

after all the internet is aiding and abbetting the sick paedos isnt it?

Come on man, think real, thats all I ask.

Well lets take this argument to the next level.

Look at the bank robbery again.....

Robbers = Downloaders
Getaway Driver = NTL
Car = Internet

So do we ban all cars becuase they might be driven by getaway drivers?

Jonboy · 05-09-2003, 17:03

can we not close this thread ive passed meself twice now

05-09-2003, 17:07

Quote:

Originally posted by andygrif
Well lets take this argument to the next level.

Look at the bank robbery again.....

Robbers = Downloaders
Getaway Driver = NTL
Car = Internet

So do we ban all cars becuase they might be driven by getaway drivers?

Like I said, if NTL are operating in anything illegal so is every other ISP in the entire world. Lets just dissolve the whole internet, that way we can all obey the laws on whatever happens to go on online.
I guess technically because the way backbone systems are in place NTL may have even been to blame for terrorism, hell yeah lets all just wage a war on NTL HQ that'll teach them for allowing us to use the internet.

Imagine if it wasnt for this internet there wouldnt be anywhere near as much crime.

Wake up, live in the real world.

andygrif · 05-09-2003, 17:08

Quote:

Originally posted by timewarrior2001
Like I said, if NTL are operating in anything illegal so is every other ISP in the entire world. Lets just dissolve the whole internet, that way we can all obey the laws on whatever happens to go on online.
I guess technically because the way backbone systems are in place NTL may have even been to blame for terrorism, hell yeah lets all just wage a war on NTL HQ that'll teach them for allowing us to use the internet.

Imagine if it wasnt for this internet there wouldnt be anywhere near as much crime.

Wake up, live in the real world.

You're hillarious!

05-09-2003, 17:09

Quote:

Originally posted by andygrif
You're hillarious!

Ty I do try sometimes.

Shaun · 05-09-2003, 17:10

Quote:

Originally posted by timewarrior2001
Well with that thinking lets abolish the internet because thats how a lot of paedophiles get their stuff.
Ban all ISP's destroy the whole internet and downt even allow online games.

after all the internet is aiding and abbetting the sick paedos isnt it?

Come on man, think real, thats all I ask.

So again I ask, should they be allowed to do it, just because you or I may be affected by the punishment that is handed out.

No you come on, over dramatising the situation doesn't help anyone.

kronas · 05-09-2003, 17:10

Quote:

Originally posted by andygrif

You're not seriously telling me that he wouldn't buy DVDs or go to the cinema if that option wasn't available to him are you?

i dont know i doubt that he would seen as though he wasent going to the cinemas anyway.........

Quote:

Originally posted by andygrif

There is a 70% reduction in DVD sales and a 50% reduction in cinema attendance.

propganda what a tool to use read my links in the previous posts they still make millions its not as bad as they make out

Quote:

Originally posted by andygrif

Do you think there will be as many new movies coming out now, with the huge advances in CGI, immense scenery and sets, major stars?

thats what is happening these days anyway

Quote:

Originally posted by andygrif

How will they pay for that, as most of the studios will have gone bust - and that was just becuase no-one was buying classic back-catalogue movies anymore, becuase they were all on the net for free.

i think they should think of making decent storylines with decent actors its not about flashy footage onscreen for me

i have seen one or 2 movies as a rare thing and they are still crap these days compaired to 5-6 years ago T3 was the only one that got me really interested because its terminator

Lord Nikon · 05-09-2003, 17:11

One last post....

Movies are downloaded via peer to peer applications.
People using p2p software download accross, not from NTL's infrastructure.
The news report mentioned how many movies had been downloaded, but did NOT say how or where from.

NTL are a bandwidth provider, the CUSTOMER decides what to do with the bandwidth.

The only way NTL would be culpable is if they hosted the movies people were downloading.

FACT and the RIAA / MPAA can go **** themselves really, as NTL are no more responsible for people downloading movies from p2p than the Royal Mail are responsible for people importing films / porn that would be illegal to sell in the UK.

th'engineer · 05-09-2003, 17:15

but they are suggesting and encouraging it

Shaun · 05-09-2003, 17:16

Quote:

Originally posted by timewarrior2001
so is every other ISP in the entire world.

But they aren't using it as a feature or benefit of having their service, can you see no wrong 'timewarrior2001?

Other ISP's I know of are actively trying to stop us from d/l illegally.

Lord Nikon · 05-09-2003, 17:19

I could suggest or encourage people to utilise mod chips for the XBox... but unless I happen to sell them, fit them or potentially OWN one, I am not guilty of any offence... your point is?

Besides... it looks more like a statement of what has happened since the inception of BB... Not a statement of NTL's activities.

duncant403 · 05-09-2003, 17:21

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord Nikon
NTL are no more responsible for people downloading movies from p2p than the Royal Mail are responsible for people importing films / porn that would be illegal to sell in the UK.

True, NTL are not responsible for what their customers do with the service. Does that mean they should be using an illegal action as an example of why you should subscribe to their service?

What if Royal Mail printed an advert that said "x thousand hard porn films are imported into the UK every day. <<insert name of popular illegal film>> is available to buy from the US. Send your mail by Royal Mail"? Under your analogy, is that any different from what NTL are doing? If Royal Mail did produce such an advert and your ordered an illegal film, would you think it fair if Royal Mail then sent you a letter saying they'd confiscated the film? How would this be any different from NTL sending copyright infringement cease-and-desist letters?

Duncan

Shaun · 05-09-2003, 17:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord Nikon
the CUSTOMER decides what to do with the bandwidth.

The customer decided what to use a gun for but you don't see any manufacturers saying 'Our x4564 was used in the Dunblane massacre' do you?

05-09-2003, 17:24

Quote:

Originally posted by dellwear
The customer decided what to use a gun for but you don't see any manufacturers saying 'Our x4564 was used in the Dunblane massacre' do you?

No But certain manufacturers are happy to say the SWAT teams etc use their firearms.

Heckler and koch being one.
Berretta another i beleive.

And hey come to think of it, werent the french well impressed and started bragging when the Argies used Exocet missles on British ships?

Shaun · 05-09-2003, 17:25

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord Nikon
NTL are no more responsible for people downloading movies from p2p than the Royal Mail are responsible for people importing films / porn that would be illegal to sell in the UK.

Again, Royal Mail don't imply 'you can send Anthrax to people you don't like through our service' do you? If you did you would be in uproar about it. This is exactly the same. It is not about who is responsible but who is taking advantage of a situation to make money immorally.