Wonder what the new Pope thinks of this!!

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Nemesis

OK, back to your corners please ....... this is *NOT* a religious argument thread ....

With the greatest of respect Nem, that's exactly what it is. OB the OP didn't just launch a thread about gay marriage being legalised in Spain, she launched a thread with the question 'wonder what the new Pope thinks of this!' That is explicitly inviting religious opinion on the matter.

[NitroNutter]

Well to compare this law to something like single parent families which has resulted from some serious misfortune, ie a catostrophic breakdown in a relationship or even worse death, which you can only agree the end result is far from a perfect situation, really makes the comparison itself invalid, but also validates to some extent the anti sentiments of same sex maraiges with child adoptions

Originally Posted by scastle

TBH, that arguement could be applied to single parents as well.

I personally think that *if* the people involved are good parents and they love their child(ren), it doesn't matter what gender they are, or whether they are single or in a couple.

You could. And there is a growing body of evidence to support the argument that children brought up in a single-parent environment are disadvantaged when compared to those who have a mother and a father at home.

Now that I think about it, This is wrong. I have no problems with gay people or letting them getting them get legally recognized as a couple. But marriage thats different. Isn't that a religious term? Defining it as between a man and a woman? Correct me if i am wrong

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Chris T

You could. And there is a growing body of evidence to support the argument that children brought up in a single-parent environment are disadvantaged when compared to those who have a mother and a father at home.

So what do you do, make it illegal for those in bad marriages to split up? Make abortion compulsory for women who fall pregnant that are not in a steady relationship? No - because a lot of this is not through concious choice. Ant neither is homosexuality IMO.

[Nemesis]

Originally Posted by Damien

Now that I think about it, This is wrong. I have no problems with gay people or letting them getting them get legally recognized as a couple. But marriage thats different. Isn't that a religious term? Defining it as between a man and a woman? Correct me if i am wrong

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=marriage

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Damien

Now that I think about it, This is wrong. I have no problems with gay people or letting them getting them get legally recognized as a couple. But marriage thats different. Isn't that a religious term? Defining it as between a man and a woman? Correct me if i am wrong

Marriage is a religious or a civil ceremony. Dependin entirely on what you do or don't believe.

Then screw it, I am staying outta this one

Originally Posted by orangebird

So what do you do, make it illegal for those in bad marriages to split up? Make abortion compulsory for women who fall pregnant that are not in a steady relationship? No - because a lot of this is not through concious choice. Ant neither is homosexuality IMO.

Clearly you don't make any of those things illegal. But, armed with the knowledge that children who grow up without both a male and a female resident role model are relatively disadvantaged, neither should you seek to deliberately place children in those situations, surely? This has nothing to do with whether or not homosexuality is a choice, and to be honest it's not about what a homosexual couple might want either, it's about what is best for the children.

Except of course that this is a little OT as you were asking what the Pope would think about legalisation of gay marriage, not the pro and cons of gay adoption.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Damien

Now that I think about it, This is wrong. I have no problems with gay people or letting them getting them get legally recognized as a couple.

Excellent! Sensible posting from the other side at last!

Originally Posted by Damien

But marriage thats different. Isn't that a religious term? Defining it as between a man and a woman? Correct me if i am wrong

I'm quite old-fashioned when it comes to marriage - my opinion is that it should be between a man and a woman. If a gay couple want to be in a committed monogomous relationship then that's none of my concern - just please, don't call it marriage. A partnership, civil union or whatever - just not marriage.

[NitroNutter]

Originally Posted by orangebird

Marriage is a religious or a civil ceremony. Dependin entirely on what you do or don't believe.

either way afaik in mans history same sex marraige has never been a legally recognised or binding union.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Damien

Then screw it, I am staying outta this one

[punky]

A couple of points I didn't make earlier.

Firstly, a marriage is a purely religious thing, which as most religions prohibit gay relations, I can't see how any gay marriage can ever be legal in the eyes of God. What we know to be marriage, like signing the license, the tax benefits, and spousal rights, is a purely civil aspect we humans created away from marriage, but happen to allocate at the same time. It is, and should be, sexuality independent.

With regards to the adopting children:

Bit different with the adopting children. There's nothing wrong with gay people adopting children, but there is often a lack of gender balance, with 2 males, 2 females, as in the traditional family set, mothers and fathers have unique opposite, but complimentry roles. It's exactly the same with a single mother adopting, I think. People really do need positive role models on both sides.

I don't think gays and single mothers/fathers should be excluded from adopting, but I think there needs to be an extra check on that to make sure adopters are aware of the lack of gender balance and can allow for it. For example, in the case of 2 gay men, to have a strong maternal influence in there, such as one of the parent's sisters, or a brother of the single mother. If the gay people are both only children, then I still think they should be able to adopt (single mothers and fathers bring kids up alright), but I think they should be taught how to emulate the two traditional parental positions.

[Shaun]

Originally Posted by Russ D

I take it that smilie was aimed at me.

It was that or I got banned with some comment about you thinking your religous beliefs should influence the lives of millions of gay people in this country. To be fair the smilie just summed the comments up and avoided a confruntation with Simon via PM.

*goes off to take yet another deap breath