The Youth of Today...

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by andyl

The demonisation of youth does nobody any favours, not least those who perceive they are going to be victims of crime committed by young people because of the image they have of them. And, as that Barnardos link points ot the young are actually more likely to be the victims of crime and most do not get into trouble.

There is too little done in terms of preventative measures because of lack of resources. There's a lad in my youngest's class. His mum was a prostitute who was murdered, his dad a child abuser in nick. He lives with his nan (who is ill equipped to look after him) and brother (who's not exactly a good role model). When this kid was 5 the school reported concerns about his welfare (wandering the streets alone etc) to Social Services who said they could not do an assessment for 18 months to 2 years. He's now 9 and there is still no support from the authorities. The lad has good support from us and other families but he needs proper intervention because you can see he's primed to go on a downward spiral. This kid is not to blame for his situation but I can see he will soon be labelled as a 'yob', '****' etc when his life story has been so desperate.

He will only get those lablels of "Yob", "****" etc of he does something to deserve them!

If he stays on the straight and narrow, no decent person would label him as such.

[Russ]

I often find it interesting how, when teens get in to serious trouble and end up killing others (like that Columbine massacre a few years back) we get so many people saying "Well where was your God that day?", even though it's usually the very same parents who have fought to keep religious studies out of their kids' schools in the first place.

This borders slightly on the other topic about RE. If the only thing that kids will learn from such classes is love and tolerance for all then I can't see it being a bad thing. I'm not saying all kids should be brought up as Christians (even though I'd prefer the world that way, I'm not naive enough to think that would be the instant cure for everything) but the traits which should be basic tenets of all faiths (love, patience, understanding) IMO are essential to all forms of schooling.

Originally Posted by Escapee

He will only get those lablels of "Yob", "****" etc of he does something to deserve them!

If he stays on the straight and narrow, no decent person would label him as such.

His upbringing is likely to mean he is more likely to fall off the straight and narrow than those who benefit from more stable family backgrounds. Kids like him need help before they get in trouble, not labelling afterwards. Prevention, as the good doctor said, is better than cure - especially when the cures we have (most notably prison) are so hopelessly ineffective.

Originally Posted by andyl

His upbringing is likely to mean he is more likely to fall off the straight and narrow than those who benefit from more stable family backgrounds. Kids like him need help before they get in trouble, not labelling afterwards. Prevention, as the good doctor said, is better than cure - especially when the cures we have (most notably prison) are so hopelessly ineffective.

I hope the youngster you described in your previous post does get the help he needs before he goes off the rails.

At the same time I can quote from personal experience two friends who IMO both fell of the straight and narrow.

The first friend live across the street from me untill I joined the army. His parents had always been too fond of the drink, and as such grew up in a disfunctional family environment. In the end my friend was sent down for 12 years (I believe), for membership of a ''Loyalist'' terrorist organisation, possession (explosive and firearms) and conspirecy to commit murder.

So did his sh***y family background make him become a possible terrorist and murderer?

Second friend came from a stable family background, but still ended up becomming a member of a proscribed terrorist organisation. So what made him become a *******?

No easy answers to either senario I think.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by andyl

His upbringing is likely to mean he is more likely to fall off the straight and narrow than those who benefit from more stable family backgrounds. Kids like him need help before they get in trouble, not labelling afterwards. Prevention, as the good doctor said, is better than cure - especially when the cures we have (most notably prison) are so hopelessly ineffective.

I think it's good that he's getting guidance to keep him on the straight and narrow.

If however he sways off the straight and narrow, you can't say any of his victims are wrong to label him as a "Yob" or "****" if he earns that title.

As far as I'm concerned, call a spade a spade. Why didn't I turn to a life of crime, sexual assault, drink, drugs and end up in prison like a few of my school friends.

Perhaps it's because I made the choice to leave that route alone!

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Escapee

If however he sways off the straight and narrow, you can't say any of his victims are wrong to label him as a "Yob" or "****" if he earns that title.

I agree - if I went out each weekend and got totally off my face on lager, regardless of my upbringing I'd rightly be called a drunk.

Originally Posted by Earl of Bronze

I hope the youngster you described in your previous post does get the help he needs before he goes off the rails.

At the same time I can quote from personal experience two friends who IMO both fell of the straight and narrow.

The first friend live across the street from me untill I joined the army. His parents had always been too fond of the drink, and as such grew up in a disfunctional family environment. In the end my friend was sent down for 12 years (I believe), for membership of a ''Loyalist'' terrorist organisation, possession (explosive and firearms) and conspirecy to commit murder.

So did his sh***y family background make him become a possible terrorist and murderer?

Second friend came from a stable family background, but still ended up becomming a member of a proscribed terrorist organisation. So what made him become a *******?

No easy answers to either senario I think.

There's not a causal link between background/upbringing and criminality but there is a clear correlation. Your right, it's not an easy thing to determine why people choose certain paths but a lack of moral guidance certainly doesn't help and at the end of the day kids aren't to blame for getting the sh*tty end of life's stick. I would simply like to see more invested in preventing kids getting into trouble so that less needs to be invested in cleaning up the mess after they've got in trouble.

If a young kid (say 9-10) gets in bother because his parent's are not caring, disciplining or controlling him/her properly I'm not sure it's right to label that child a yob or whatever. They're simply too young, impressionable and easy led at that age - they need help, not labelling. And I speak as someone who spends a fair amount of time helping care, control and discipline (well, shouting at) various kids around here - it's like breakfast and after school club around here (and I work from home too!!). Hope this has got me a sympathy vote! Actually, annoying and cheeky as the local kids can be, generally they keep me smiling.
__________________

Originally Posted by Russ D

I agree - if I went out each weekend and got totally off my face on lager, regardless of my upbringing I'd rightly be called a drunk.

Probably not. You'd just blend in nicely with everyone else in the pubs and clubs of Britain I reckon (although you'd blend in even better if you were off your face on WKD or JD

[AndrewJ]

What ever happened to a quiet mature party at the house, watching the game if one is one, having some movies on or the playstation, and some beers and ordering a pizza?

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by Russ D

I agree - if I went out each weekend and got totally off my face on lager, regardless of my upbringing I'd rightly be called a drunk.

No, we would either say you had won the lottery, or on benefits.

[Tezcatlipoca]

And another story....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4347567.stm

'Youngest' rape accused in court
A boy thought to be the youngest person in the UK to have been charged with rape has appeared in court.

The 14-year-old, who was 10 at the time of the alleged offence, is also charged with having "sexually touched" his alleged victim - a younger girl.

10 years old at the time of the alleged offence!!

What is going on with this country, we seem to be in self destruct.

Originally Posted by Tuftus

What is going on with this country, we seem to be in self destruct.

IMHO, we (the west), are on the downward slope that many historical civilisations have gone through. It happened to the Greeks, Egyptians, Romans, Aztecs, Incas, Ottomans etc. You get a period of growth and scientific achievement, followed by a painful slow fall into decidence and decay.

Note - The same cannot be said for all of the civilations (how they ended), but all civilisations do follow a roughly similar cycle of growth-stagnation-decay.

I thought this was a good link

http://www.bartleby.com/65/sh/SheppardJ.html

I have read the 'Road to Tyburn' book mentioned, believe me, if true, it was much scarier then, than now ....

I dont think theres any links to the behaviour of the kids these days.
We go around looking for the stupidest things the parents may have done instead of spending money on sorting out the justice system, and creating one that:-
a) works
b) will put the fear of god into them
c) stop prosecuting the adults that brain these little ****s

I admit on more than one occasion I have commited common assault on a teenager. And actually yes I am quite proud of it, because the litte **** needed a lesson in humility.

I have no time for the tarquin has a behavioural problem brigade, what tarquin needs is a bloody good thrashing off someone.
******** to all this, you cant smack your kids, I do and I will.
Does it not strike you as odd that since this ban smacking campaign started we find children younger and younger committing more and more serious crimes?
I was well pleased that the 13 year old was jailed at teesside crown court for life. He deserved it, the PC brigade tried to make excuses for him, but he was nothing more than a savage little ****.
Perhaps once he's had a few good beatings in prison he will start to learn, thats if he survives prison, either way I shant shed a tear for him.
I heard that he was upset at the sentence, i assumed that was the reporters attempt a comedy, was he supposed to be celebrating?
There is one bad side to the sentence, and thats this.

Life in prison isnt protecting the public from him, its protecting him from the public.

we hear on the news everday about kids being involved in serious crime, jail them. Get tough, make them fear the thought of prison, make them realise they WILL be jailed. Lets be sensible, if a 13 year old is big enough to try and mug me, he's big enough to suffer the consequences from me for trying to mug me. Lets not prosecute the victims or intended victims, lets get the criminals and those with criminal intent.

Lets stop wasting money on giving them social workers and counselling, what they need is bloody lobotomies.

Arrghhh I swear the next little scrote that walks past me with his trousers tucked in his socks, covered in filth stinking to high heaven and talking like retard is gonna get kicked. Why?
Because we all know, and its from experience that its these little scrotes that go out nicking stuff and being anti social, well I for one am sick and I'm going to be damned ****ing hostile towards them.

Parents get the blam for all sorts these days, most are working and finding it hard to make ends meet. To do so they work all the hours they can. You will often find, or rather I have often found, its the kids with working parents that are the worst.


/end rant

[paulyoung666]

you aint far wrong my mate , you aint far wrong