Legal files

[roseandjim]

Hi Folks
I'm a tight old so and so that would like to get a music and video collection - but legally. Most of the stuff I want is ancient by todays standards so is there anywhere I can find out if stuff is out of copyright before I download it?
Thx

[Bifta]

The copyright length's are normally the life of the artist + 50 years.

[Halcyon]

Hi, and welcome to the forums.

Most music on the net is put there illegaly and anyone downloading it is doing so illegaly.
Even some pieces of classical music from a dead composer such as Beethoven will have an aspect of copyright to it.
The only legal way is by purchasing tracks for download. These are however most of the time very new tracks dating back no longer than the last 2 years maximum.

There may be some companies that offer older albums for download, but Im sure they will be at a price.
Sorry I cant be of any more help.

[andygrif]

Originally Posted by roseandjim

Hi Folks
Most of the stuff I want is ancient by todays standards so is there anywhere I can find out if stuff is out of copyright before I download it?
Thx

Pretty much anything that has been televised, recorded to CD and placed on the internet is subject to copyright....as you will see below.

Originally Posted by Bifta

The copyright length's are normally the life of the artist + 50 years.

Well...sort of, and this is not going to be an exhaustive list but:

Copyright varies in the length of time before it can become 'public domain'. There's some worry right now about the Elvis collection which will begin to fall into the public doman later this year in the USA - but of course the law will be changed to cover this, like it was with Disney's earlier work - that's the power of the big corporations in the USA.

However, even though a composition might fall into the public doman (such as Beethoven) the arrangement is subject to a new copyright. For example if I was an arrogant illiterate ****** who played the violin and happened to 'copy' one of Nigel Kennedy's arrangements in my own recording the I would be in breach of his copyright, but not Vivaldi's.

If I couldn't play the violin at all so decided to copy Nigel Kennedy's recording then I would be in breach of his arrangement of composition AND his recording copyright.

Some popular myths about copyright:

1. I own the cassette/LP/single, I can copy it on to a CD/iPod/hard drive.

Nope. You are permitted to own and play the copy you bought only. You do not have a dubbing licence, you do not have permission from the record company to dub to another format. Didn't your parents tell you that home taping was killing music?!?!?! Of course if you're using it for your own use then there's no big deal here, but it is technically (in this country) a breach of copyright...oh and so is borrowning your mates' CDs and ripping those to your iPod too.

2. I am allowed to make back up copies of my CDs.

Nope. You might technically be allowed to make and ISO image of a CD (something that is not playable once copied) but making a CD-DA 'back-up' is covered by myth 1 above.

3. If I pay a subscription to an MP3 site then it is a legal download.

Hmmm....possibly, but doubtful. There are a few sites claiming to be illegal under some odd Russian copyright technicality. Whilst they may be correct there is no provision for importation of copyright, therefore only a service operating legally (i.e. servers and subscriptions) within the EU would be legal for you to download the content from. Whilst no-one's going to break down the door if you pay for a download from one of these sites, you're technically in breach of copyright - oh, and did someone mention links with the Russian Mafia?

4. There was no copyright message, so it is public domain.

Nope. Copyright exists automatically, it doesn't need to be stated - so just becuase you download an image from a website that doesn't have a copyright note on it is still copyright theft.

Back to music for a moment before I bore myself to tears......

One nice link I stumbled over the other day was a free copyleft style download site at http://www.archive.org/audio/ which has thousands of live performances (don't get too excited you won't have heard of any of the acts...apart from the Grateful Dead seem to have released some of their live shows on there). They're good quality MP3's too and it's 100% legal (under US law anyway).

[Gareth]

Good post, andygrif.

Many, many years ago when I used to think LA Law was cool, my law lecturer taught me about the so-called "Betamax Case" which took place in the US in 1984. This precedence is still being referred to today although you have to replace Betamax by MP3 , in an attempt to argue the reasoning for having back-ups of legally owned pieces of music...

Briefly, it can be summed up as...

The Supreme Court's verdict in the 1984 case between Sony and Universal was that it is legal to make copies of TV shows on your VCR and view them later, even fast-forwarding through commercials.

...oh, and the Grateful Dead have, I believe, denounced their copyright rights for their bootlegged copies.

[andygrif]

Originally Posted by Gareth

Good post, andygrif.

Thank you sir!

Originally Posted by Gareth

my law lecturer taught me about the so-called "Betamax Case" which took place in the US in 1984. This precedence is still being referred to today although you have to replace Betamax by MP3 , in an attempt to argue the reasoning for having back-ups of legally owned pieces of music...

You're absolutely right, however this applies in the US, but not the UK. I can't quite remember what the law was amended to in this country regarding TV broadcasts, I seem to remember something like you can tape something off the telly as long as you destroy it within 30 days or 90 days or something. That doesn't though apply to another other recording media - although the new EU Copyright Directive does make some extremely wooly provisions for downloads, hard-drives and back-ups.

Originally Posted by Gareth

...oh, and the Grateful Dead have, I believe, denounced their copyright rights for their bootlegged copies.

Ah yes, now you've said that it does ring a bell - fair play to them as well...I was grooving to A Touch of Grey live in 1984 the other day.

[roseandjim]

Ah well -- Thanks for the info Guys , I'd better stick to my discs and tapes then

[iadom]

Originally Posted by Gareth

...oh, and the Grateful Dead have, I believe, denounced their copyright rights for their bootlegged copies.

Was that due to the poor quality or did they renounce their rights ?

[Gareth]

Heh, well spotted.... in my defence, it was posted at a quarter to 4 this morning