Starmer’s chronicles

[Russ]

Ah I get it. Point out Labour's unpopular policies? Acceptable.
The Tories' unpopular policies? Boring.

Well it least you finally understand how boring you become.

The Tories are not in power, you just like to live in the past since you cannot see past Labour Good, Tory Bad.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Paul

Well it least you finally understand how boring you become.

You got there years before me - it's nothing for people of our generation. I wouldn't want you to think I'm bothered by what you think of me, though.

Originally Posted by Paul

The Tories are not in power, you just like to live in the past since you cannot see past Labour Good, Tory Bad.

They're not in power, but the effects of the austerity years are still felt today. Apologies if that's an inconvenient fact.

Originally Posted by Russ

You got there years before me

If you say so.

Originally Posted by Russ

I wouldn't want you to think I'm bothered by what you think of me, though.

Fear not, I dont.

Originally Posted by Russ

TApologies if that's an inconvenient fact.

Its not an "inconvenient fact", just an excuse for you to constantly live in the past.

Everyone on the forum can predict that as soon as someone says anything bad about your beloved Labour, you're be there posting the old "what about the Tories 5/10/15 whatever years ago". Its as predictable as the seasons. Much like the fact you'll just keep arguing until I get bored of it.

Talking of pensions, the OBR report today is dire: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cy7nv3pdgr4o

The OBR said the cost of the state pension has risen steadily over the past eight decades, from around 2% of the UK economy to a current 5%, equating to £138bn.

It is forecast to increase to 7.7% of the economy by the early 2070s.

Spending on the state pension has steadily risen, the OBR said, because the triple lock and a growing number of people above the state pension age.

It added: "Due to inflation and earnings volatility over its first two decades in operation, the triple lock has cost around three times more than initial expectations."

It isn't sustainable. We can't keep cutting from elsewhere to underwrite ever-increasing pensions. There won't be a state pension left if it continues like this.

The triple-lock will eventually have to go or the whole thing collapses, it's only a question of if this Government or the next one dares to do it.

Originally Posted by Damien

The triple-lock will eventually have to go or the whole thing collapses, it's only a question of if this Government or the next one dares to do it.

Which part of the lock is the issue ? and what will they replace it with ?

Originally Posted by Paul

Which part of the lock is the issue ? and what will they replace it with ?

I am not an economist, but the link with wages essentially means the state pension will always outpace the wage growth of the working population that funds it.

If inflation is higher than wage growth, then the state pension will grow faster than the tax base that pays it.

If wage growth is higher, then the state pension will match wage growth.

If neither wage growth nor inflation is that high, then the state pension will still go up 2.5%.

It will just always become a bigger and bigger part of the budget. The only time it won't is if we see low inflation and very high economic growth but that seems a long way off.

You replace it by getting rid of the link to earnings, so that when wage growth finally exceeds inflation, there is a chance for the income of the working population to catch up with the pension bill it has to pay.

I would also say it's not fair that the government has to keep finding money to fund increasing pensions when there are other groups that could use some increase in benefits as well. The price of the triple lock could easily have covered the PIP payments, lifting the child credit cap and free school means.

We're not talking about cutting pensions here, or even not increasing them so they don't match inflation, but stopping them from always have the biggest increase possible every year.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Damien

Talking of pensions, the OBR report today is dire: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cy7nv3pdgr4o



It isn't sustainable. We can't keep cutting from elsewhere to underwrite ever-increasing pensions. There won't be a state pension left if it continues like this.

The triple-lock will eventually have to go or the whole thing collapses, it's only a question of if this Government or the next one dares to do it.

well that should please the younger generations, they seem to think pensions are a new thing that's unfair to them, so by 2070 they'll be happily up shyte creek and penniless

Originally Posted by papa smurf

well that should please the younger generations, they seem to think pensions are a new thing that's unfair to them, so by 2070 they'll be happily up shyte creek and penniless

I think young people are well aware that pensions may be gone by 2070. That's why it's unfair. The current pension system isn't about fairness or sustainability.

It seems unlikely they will be gone, but worth a lot less in relative terms.
I am very unlikely to still be around in 2070 to know either way, my kids would be in their mid 70's (if still alive).
Perhaps they will link them to work place pensions in some way.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Paul

Much like the fact you'll just keep arguing until I get bored of it.

Thought you indicated you were bored with it earlier

Labour isn't my beloved anything. Pointing out the shitty financial position we're in right now as well as the shitty policies being made stemming greatly from the economy that was inherited from the last lot is not "living in the past".

Labour is going to make a lot of turncoat decisions moving forward, as something needs to be done about the economy, and until they go after the real villains (billionaire tax dodgers), things won't improve.

The problem is the tax-dodgers have a history of being allowed to do that, so they carry on as normal, but of course I'm not allowed to discuss that in case it bores you even more.

[Itshim]

Originally Posted by Russ

Thought you indicated you were bored with it earlier

Labour isn't my beloved anything. Pointing out the shitty financial position we're in right now as well as the shitty policies being made stemming greatly from the economy that was inherited from the last lot is not "living in the past".

Labour is going to make a lot of turncoat decisions moving forward, as something needs to be done about the economy, and until they go after the real villains (billionaire tax dodgers), things won't improve.

The problem is the tax-dodgers have a history of being allowed to do that, so they carry on as normal, but of course I'm not allowed to discuss that in case it bores you even more.

Sorry they made a lot of promises, having no idea were the money would come from. If you haven't got it you can't spend it . Should start living within the countries means. For one stop overseas aid. Weird idea borrowing to give away

Originally Posted by Paul

It seems unlikely they will be gone, but worth a lot less in relative terms.
I am very unlikely to still be around in 2070 to know either way, my kids would be in their mid 70's (if still alive).
Perhaps they will link them to work place pensions in some way.

I think so too. That's the state pension will be lower relatively. I hope they don't means test it against what else you've saved for pensions, because I would feel pretty cheated if the money I put away each month for my private pension is reason not to give me the state one.

The Tories' introduction of the workplace pension is going to be one of their best policies in the long term. It will be huge help later if/when the state pension reduces.

This generation and the ones that follow are going to have to get used to paying towards their own pensions, I think.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Damien

I think so too. That's the state pension will be lower relatively. I hope they don't means test it against what else you've saved for pensions, because I would feel pretty cheated if the money I put away each month for my private pension is reason not to give me the state one.

The Tories' introduction of the workplace pension is going to be one of their best policies in the long term. It will be huge help later if/when the state pension reduces.

This generation and the ones that follow are going to have to get used to paying towards their own pensions, I think.

the problem is they tax it because the tax threshold is ridiculously low

Originally Posted by papa smurf

the problem is they tax it because the tax threshold is ridiculously low

Well, yes, but applies to any scenario where you're getting income above the state pension. Soon even the state pension will be taxed as the increases on it each year are going to take it above the threshold. Maybe a good to time to revisit the triple lock?