Britain outside the EU

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

What like we'd have sovereignty? We won't be governed by Brussels?

Could you provide some tangible examples where this Sovereignty has benefited the British people, please?

Originally Posted by Hugh

Could you provide some tangible examples where this Sovereignty has benefited the British people, please?

That’s the wrong question. The correct question is whether it is right, on a point of principle, for certain legislative decisions to be taken by a supra-national body over which we have (had) extremely limited democratic influence.

Your question speaks to the competence (or otherwise) of those who have held re-patriated powers for the past 3 years (give or take), which is an interesting, but quite different, party political discussion.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by denphone

It all ties in with the huge plethora of lies they told the public.

Unless you have not noticed, nothing is working anymore, public services are in deep never ending crisis, the NHS, social care and community primary services are incredibly hard to access, etc, etc, etc.

You can have your sovereignty but it does not make this a better country for the vast majority of its population.

True we are outside the EU. True you are describing Britain correctly.

But your anti-Brexit rant is the same old whingeing rubbish that remaining would not have avoided.


---------- Post added at 12:09 ---------- Previous post was at 12:05 ----------

Originally Posted by Hugh

Could you provide some tangible examples where this Sovereignty has benefited the British people, please?

It's a principle. No need to translate that into any tangible benefit other than we no longer take orders from Brussels. All we need now is a government that can take the UK forward

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

True we are outside the EU. True you are describing Britain correctly.

But your anti-Brexit rant is the same old whingeing rubbish that remaining would not have avoided.


---------- Post added at 12:09 ---------- Previous post was at 12:05 ----------



It's a principle. No need to translate that into any tangible benefit other than we no longer take orders from Brussels. All we need now is a government that can take the UK forward

No not a rant, but the plain old truth...

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Well, I’m intelligent. I voted remain. Since then I’ve digested and assessed everything and if there was a referendum tomorrow I would vote stay out.

So would I, the country has gone through all this only to go back in with our tail between our legs tomorrow, no thanks, I'll just retain the right criticise it at every opportunity

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

By then, the EU might have imploded.

Blimey, some people have been waiting/relying/wishing for that for 30 odd years and counting

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

What’s that got to do with Brexit? That said, it’s easy to see why the Government is seen in the light you’ve painted. But solid evidence is another matter.

Had we remained in the EU, that would have been the same situation as in Eastern European workers.

Oh yes nothing to do with brexit, I mean it's not like we had the right to return illegals to the country they entered from under it or return EU citizens who committed crime or were work shy, they were cheap labour and I was actually a committed kipper in the 90's when all the lower end jobs were minimum wage because of them but things had changed, they didn't want to live 6 to a house and do 300 hours a month anymore from what I could tell and because of it the wages were going up.

Originally Posted by Chris

That’s the wrong question. The correct question is whether it is right, on a point of principle, for certain legislative decisions to be taken by a supra-national body over which we have (had) extremely limited democratic influence.

Yeah I'm not sure it's been worth it for a point of principle.

Originally Posted by Hugh

Could you provide some tangible examples where this Sovereignty has benefited the British people, please?

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

True we are outside the EU. True you are describing Britain correctly.

But your anti-Brexit rant is the same old whingeing rubbish that remaining would not have avoided.


---------- Post added at 12:09 ---------- Previous post was at 12:05 ----------



It's a principle. No need to translate that into any tangible benefit other than we no longer take orders from Brussels. All we need now is a government that can take the UK forward

That’s a "NO”, then…

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Had we remained in the EU, that would have been the same situation as in Eastern European workers.

I doubt it. Countries like Poland are now catching up with us economically. With a lack of house-building in the UK under the Conservatives driving housing costs upwards, the attraction of relocating to the UK from the EU has reduced. And no, Turkey hasn't joined the EU despite what Nige may have suggested.

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Originally Posted by Hugh

That’s a "NO”, then…

Yeah but blue passports.

[Ms NTL]

Can we take some orders from Belgium ASAP? Our banks are leaking information to USA and EU.

https://news.bloombergtax.com/daily-...americans-data

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Ms NTL

Can we take some orders from Belgium ASAP? Our banks are leaking information to USA and EU.

https://news.bloombergtax.com/daily-...americans-data

UK GDPR protects bank customers from disclosure of their personal information.

Where is the evidence of UK banks breaching these customer rights?

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Chris

That’s the wrong question. The correct question is whether it is right, on a point of principle, for certain legislative decisions to be taken by a supra-national body over which we have (had) extremely limited democratic influence.

Your question speaks to the competence (or otherwise) of those who have held re-patriated powers for the past 3 years (give or take), which is an interesting, but quite different, party political discussion.

What you are doing, like Seph before you, is celebrating the questionably advantageous gain in sovereignty without the context of said gain against a backdrop of massive damage to the country.

The merit or not of said gain can only be valued when you look at the entire journey. History will judge that there is no advantageous gain, quite the opposite.

---------- Post added at 15:03 ---------- Previous post was at 15:01 ----------

Originally Posted by denphone

No not a rant, but the plain old truth...

I'd ignore him, he only cares about the ideology, nothing more.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by ianch99

What you are doing, like Seph before you, is celebrating the questionably advantageous gain in sovereignty without the context of said gain against a backdrop of massive damage to the country.

The merit or not of said gain can only be valued when you look at the entire journey. History will judge that there is no advantageous gain, quite the opposite.

What 'massive damage to the country' has been caused by Brexit as distinct from the well-known government shitshow?

[Ms NTL]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

UK GDPR protects bank customers from disclosure of their personal information.

Where is the evidence of UK banks breaching these customer rights?

My son. He was born in Indiana, USA.

Santander leaked the info.

Try to create a fake account with Santander with a USA birthday address. They will report it to IRS.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Ms NTL

My son. He was born in Indiana, USA.

Santander leaked the info.

Try to create a fake account with Santander with a USA birthday address. They will tell you that they will report it to IRS.

Presumably your son has reported Santander to the ICO.
Right?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

What 'massive damage to the country' has been caused by Brexit as distinct from the well-known government shitshow?

This November 2023 paper by the Centre for Inclusive Trade Policy looks at the impact of Brexit on UK import prices and finds the “referendum outcome raised UK import prices by 11 per cent..."

And last week the National Institute of Economic and Social Research published an updated estimate of the Brexit hit, which it said “Our estimates indicate that the negative impact of Brexit gradually escalates, reaching some 5-6 per cent of GDP or about £2,300 per capita by 2035. The reduction in real incomes resulting from the fall in the UK terms of trade associated with changes in trading relations with the European Union and the fall in productivity are the largest contributors to the estimated reduction in real GDP, with each accounting for over 2.5 percentage points."

And Tesla and BYD ruled out investing in new car plants in the UK due to Brexit.

We've been fortunate that existing manufacturers have reinvested but the possibility of future divergence is acting as an investment constraint.

[Sephiroth]

Is that 'massive'? The referenced article said (and you didn't) that the impact on consumers was 0.6%.

We estimate the referendum outcome raised UK import prices by 11% and consumer prices by 0.6% through trade policy uncertainty alone.

And might that not be part of the price of sovereignty? You Remainers seem to see everything Brexit in the light of economics.

Covid & Ukraine have completely eclipsed the economic effects of Brexit.