Brexit discussion

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by denphone

Prove that we will not be poorer? as even most Brexiteers have said we will be worse financially.

Given that we will get a tariff free trade deal and the customs issues are resolved sensibly, as I believe they will, I think it is for you to prove that we will be poorer.

The people who are saying we will be poorer take the view that we will not get the deal the government wants. If you assume we will, you get a different answer.

As I said before, continued trade with no tariffs between the UK and the EU, plus new trade deals that we will agree with other countries, amounts to a plus, not a minus, for Britain.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Dave42

I predict the Brextremists are first ones to moan when country is much worse off

lets give it 40 years and then see how it's hanging .

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Dave42

I predict the Brextremists are first ones to moan when country is much worse off

Spot on, Dave. Some like BoJo are moaning now despite winning so God knows what they'll be like when the penny drops!

---------- Post added at 18:33 ---------- Previous post was at 17:48 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Given that we will get a tariff free trade deal and the customs issues are resolved sensibly, as I believe they will, I think it is for you to prove that we will be poorer.

The people who are saying we will be poorer take the view that we will not get the deal the government wants. If you assume we will, you get a different answer.

As I said before, continued trade with no tariffs between the UK and the EU, plus new trade deals that we will agree with other countries, amounts to a plus, not a minus, for Britain.

That we'll be proved worse off outside the EU has been proved by Theresa May's own Government. Den doesn't need to do it again. The cross-department analysis indicates we'll be worse off even if the Government gets the deal it wants.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

That we'll be proved worse off outside the EU has been proved by Theresa May's own Government. Den doesn't need to do it again. The cross-department analysis indicates we'll be worse off even if the Government gets the deal it wants.

I don't agree with that at all, but I guess it won't be proved until it happens.

---------- Post added at 18:59 ---------- Previous post was at 18:56 ----------

Originally Posted by papa smurf

lets give it 40 years and then see how it's hanging .

Well, I don't think countries like New Zealand, Singapore, etc are poor simply because they are not members of the EU.

What is it about that undemocratic bureaucracy that the establishment figures like? Oh, I get it...

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

I don't agree with that at all, but I guess it won't be proved until it happens.

Why don't you agree with the cross-department expertise that the Brexit-orientated British Government has employed? Do you think your Brexit Government has deliberately picked an incompetent bunch of pessimists when they could have easily chosen a bunch of people with your outlook but would firm up some calculations to support such wildly optimistic views?
Or do you think that they've actually got a great bunch of experts who've looked into things deeply, crunched the numbers exhaustively and come up with some very probable scenarios which to Brexiters like BoJo are an uncomfortable truth.

---------- Post added at 23:13 ---------- Previous post was at 23:10 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Well, I don't think countries like New Zealand, Singapore, etc are poor simply because they are not members of the EU

Wrong continent, Old Boy.

---------- Post added 11-06-2018 at 00:25 ---------- Previous post was 10-06-2018 at 23:13 ----------

Meanwhile, have Putin's useful idiots have been revealed? Nope. Not Jeremy Corbyn, Putin would not waste his time there. We're talking about Aaron Banks and side-kick Andy Wigmore.You know it must be bad when Nigel Farage is distancing himself from it

Mr Banks had a total of three meetings with Alexander Yakovenko in the build-up to and after the EU referendum in June 2016, according to emails seen by two Sunday newspapers.
He had previously admitted only to a “six-hour boozy lunch” in November 2015 with the Russian ambassador in his book The Bad Boys of Brexit.
The emergence of apparently closer contact between Mr Banks, his Leave.EU aide Andy Wigmore, and senior Russian state officials will increase suspicions that the Kremlin sought to influence and disrupt western electoral processes. It is also likely to add spice to questioning of him and Mr Wigmore by a committee of MPs this week...
An ally of Nigel Farage, the former UK Independence party leader, Mr Banks has donated £1.3m to Ukip since 2014. During the referendum campaign he set up his own group, Leave.EU, to which he lent £6m. Leave.EU was a rival set-up to Vote Leave, the official campaign.

https://www.ft.com/content/6a49782c-...d-d8b934ff5ffa

He [Aaron Banks] is under investigation by the Electoral Commission over his donations to pro-Brexit campaigns. Its inquiry started in November and is examining whether the businessman “was the true source of loans” made by him to Leave.EU, and whether Better for the Country Ltd, a company he controlled, was “the true source of donations made to referendum campaigners in its name”.
Banks has also now been told by Companies House that he must publish the accounts of the offshore holding company ICS Risk Solutions, which he uses to finance his activities.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...e-russia-links

Yawn.

Still going on about the non-Russia issue that didn't influence mine or the other 17.4 Million people who voted leave.....?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Mick

Yawn.

Still going on about the non-Russia issue that didn't influence mine or the other 17.4 Million people who voted leave.....?

What makes you so sure no one was influenced one way or the other? Was it perhaps a Twitter poll from your Corbyn-admiring mate?

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by Mick

Yawn.

Still going on about the non-Russia issue that didn't influence mine or the other 17.4 Million people who voted leave.....?

It only had to influence 634,751 voters to swing to leave, half +1 of the majority leave had.

---------- Post added at 09:39 ---------- Previous post was at 09:21 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Given that we will get a tariff free trade deal and the customs issues are resolved sensibly, as I believe they will, I think it is for you to prove that we will be poorer.

The people who are saying we will be poorer take the view that we will not get the deal the government wants. If you assume we will, you get a different answer.

As I said before, continued trade with no tariffs between the UK and the EU, plus new trade deals that we will agree with other countries, amounts to a plus, not a minus, for Britain.

Given that the government does not want a customs union, then non-tariff barriers will exist, even it it's simply rules of origin declarations. These have a cost for either exporters to the EU or in enforcement for imports from the EU. I believe we will also leave the single market so there will also be regulatory barriers (CE marking, veterinary, phytosanitary, etc.)

Er. Your 600K figure is very inaccurate. Over a Million more people voted leave than Remain.

This pathetic desperation to invalidate a legitimate democratic result, is getting tiresome.

[daveeb]

Originally Posted by Mick

Er. Your 600K figure is very inaccurate. Over a Million more people voted leave than Remain.

This pathetic desperation to invalidate a legitimate democratic result, is getting tiresome.

So a 600K swing would send the vote the other way

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by daveeb

So a 600K swing would send the vote the other way

What he said ^^^

Leave 17,410,742-634,751 = 16,775,991
Remain 16,141,241+634,751 = 16,775,992

Should have shown my working as I was told at school

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Mick

Er. Your 600K figure is very inaccurate. Over a Million more people voted leave than Remain.

This pathetic desperation to invalidate a legitimate democratic result, is getting tiresome.

Did you find maths lessons tiring Mick ?

Either way it’s still a Million more majority. There was no Russian influence. It’s another pathetic attempt by some Remainers to thwart the legitimacy of the vote. Get it in to your heads, we are leaving the corrupted EU that was democratically decided in 2016.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by jonbxx

What he said ^^^

Leave 17,410,742-634,751 = 16,775,991
Remain 16,141,241+634,751 = 16,775,992

Should have shown my working as I was told at school

2 losers don't make a winner game set and match to brexit

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Mick

Either way it’s still a Million more majority. There was no Russian influence. It’s another pathetic attempt by some Remainers to thwart the legitimacy of the vote. Get it in to your heads, we are leaving the corrupted EU that was democratically decided in 2016.

So what would you think if we remained in some sort of customs union with the EU ? With no definite date of leaving it ? Does that count as 'Brexit' ? Or just a complete waste of time all round ?