The 2017 General Election

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by ianch99

She is practising her negotiating technique for next week

At this rate, the Conservatives will be negotiating an alliance with the DUP concurrently with Brexit. You couldn't make it up!

Meanwhile, a summary of why the Conservatives failed to win a majority and why the £ and stock market did not plummet after the results:

“The election delivered two messages to the government: the electorate is fatigued with continuing austerity, and there was a rejection of the confrontational approach to Brexit negotiations,” said Mike Amey, a managing director at the funds giant Pimco. “That’s how the markets interpret it and we interpret it.”

(The Sunday Times via, paywall, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/b...exit-lcwm7mjng)

---------- Post added at 10:02 ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

But Corbyn is weaker without Diane Abbott by his side to help him calculate the cost of his policies.

Is May stronger or weaker without Tim and Fiona by her side?
http://news.sky.com/story/who-are-ni...isers-10911080

[Dave42]

Kevin Maguire‏
Verified account
@Kevin_Maguire 2m
2 minutes ago

Sinn Fein's 7 abstentionist MPs next week in Westminster to warn DUP-Con deal jeopardises the Good Friday Agreement and N Ireland peace

People are sick of austerity no doubt myself 1% or 0% pay increases in the public services are a joke.

This result means that May probably has not got a mandate for a hard Brexit IE us leaving the single market and customs union so it remains to be seen what happens when negotiations start.

She had better hurry though she triggered article 50 quite some time ago . The clock is running down.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Meanwhile, a summary of why the Conservatives failed to win a majority and why the £ and stock market did not plummet after the results:
(The Sunday Times via, paywall, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/b...exit-lcwm7mjng)[COLOR="Silver"]

Just his opinion.

Other opinions are available.

Everything changed when the manifestos came out. The Tories totally shot themselves in the foot with the social care policy, school dinners etc etc.

They should have focused on Brexit and issued a "steady as she goes" manifesto.

Nothing in any manifesto from any party is deliverable if Brexit goes tits up.

They also mis-calculated that the good will being shown to May for her Brexit handling to date, would transpose onto other policies. Nope.

---------- Post added at 13:52 ---------- Previous post was at 13:41 ----------

Originally Posted by richard1960

This result means that May probably has not got a mandate for a hard Brexit IE us leaving the single market and customs union so it remains to be seen what happens when negotiations start.

Why after all this time do people not realise there is no such thing as a hard Brexit/soft Brexit.

There is only Brexit or not Brexit, and that has already been decided.

If you want to stay in the single market then you are not leaving the EU, you will still be bound by the EU rules, regs, freedoms and ECJ.

Originally Posted by Pierre

Just his opinion.

Other opinions are available.

Everything changed when the manifestos came out. The Tories totally shot themselves in the foot with the social care policy, school dinners etc etc.

They should have focused on Brexit and issued a "steady as she goes" manifesto.

Nothing in any manifesto from any party is deliverable if Brexit goes tits up.

They also mis-calculated that the good will being shown to May for her Brexit handling to date, would transpose onto other policies. Nope.

---------- Post added at 13:52 ---------- Previous post was at 13:41 ----------



Why after all this time do people not realise there is no such thing as a hard Brexit/soft Brexit.

There is only Brexit or not Brexit, and that has already been decided.

If you want to stay in the single market then you are not leaving the EU, you will still be bound by the EU rules, regs, freedoms and ECJ.

No you are correct.

Well its like this a hard Brexit to me is just walking away without a deal and reverting to WTO rules.

But staying in the single market does mean being bound by EU rules and for me as a trade union rep that's no bad thing , TUPE is European backed , as are maternity rights, and a case went to the European court a couple of years ago which was lost in UK courts, which meant people had to be paid full wages whist on holiday including an premiums they would otherwise had been paid , had they not been on holiday.

As identified a lot of our infrastructure is European Run as well Train companies (Franchised) Water companies utility companies ,as well as large employers Nissan and Honda who have only committed to the UK in the short term at the moment.

To be honest I want to stay in the single market or customs union.

So really do not want to exit anyway as if it all goes belly up we have an awful lot to lose.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Why after all this time do people not realise there is no such thing as a hard Brexit/soft Brexit.

There is only Brexit or not Brexit, and that has already been decided.

If you want to stay in the single market then you are not leaving the EU, you will still be bound by the EU rules, regs, freedoms and ECJ.

You may not like it but hard and soft Brexit have become accepted popular terminology. My understanding is:
Hard Brexit = leave the EU, Customs Union, Single Market.
Soft Brexit = leave the EU but potentially re-join the Customs Union and/or Single Market.

Cambridge University Press's definitions are:
Hard Brexit: a Brexit in which the United Kingdom stops being a member of the European single market and gets full control of its own law-making and immigration
Soft Brexit: a Brexit in which the United Kingdom's relationship with the European Union is a close as possible to what it was before Brexit: In a "soft Brexit", Britain would be out of the EU but would retain strong economic ties, make budgetary contributions, and allow free movement of people.

Originally Posted by Dave42

Kevin Maguire‏
Verified account
@Kevin_Maguire 2m
2 minutes ago

Sinn Fein's 7 abstentionist MPs next week in Westminster to warn DUP-Con deal jeopardises the Good Friday Agreement and N Ireland peace

Can they take their seats in Westminster and vote against the Government?

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

You may not like it but hard and soft Brexit have become accepted terminology.
Hard Brexit = leave the EU, Customs Union, Single Market.
Soft Brexit=leave the EU but potentially re-join the Customs Union and/or Single Market.

---------- Post added at 14:36 ---------- Previous post was at 14:35 ----------


Can they take their seats in Westminster and vote against the Government?

Not likely as the MPs wont swear alleigence to the Queen so will not take their seats.

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

You may not like it but hard and soft Brexit have become accepted popular terminology. My understanding is:
Hard Brexit = leave the EU, Customs Union, Single Market.
Soft Brexit = leave the EU but potentially re-join the Customs Union and/or Single Market.

Cambridge University Press's definitions are:
Hard Brexit: a Brexit in which the United Kingdom stops being a member of the European single market and gets full control of its own law-making and immigration
Soft Brexit: a Brexit in which the United Kingdom's relationship with the European Union is a close as possible to what it was before Brexit: In a "soft Brexit", Britain would be out of the EU but would retain strong economic ties, make budgetary contributions, and allow free movement of people.


Can they take their seats in Westminster and vote against the Government?

they will never take there seats in parliament

[GrimUpNorth]

Originally Posted by Dave42

they will never take there seats in parliament

They don't need to take their seats to put pressure on. It's all going to come down to how much Mrs May cares about peace (maybe a bit strong) in NI. At the very least she risks stalling the political process in NI for many years which can't be a good thing.

It's like 2010 all over again - nobody voted for the government we've ended up with so you have to question its legitimacy. The coalition didn't end well for the Liberals and I don't think this will end well for the DUP (and by inference NI).

I reckon we'll be voting again before the years out, probably September.

Cheers

Dave

[Kursk]

Hmm, a choice between Steptoe as PM and attaining a Government majority. Mrs May is caught between the Devil and the DUP.

[Ken W]

Originally Posted by Kursk

Hmm, a choice between Steptoe as PM and attaining a Government majority. Mrs May is caught between the Devil and the DUP.

I think that Steptoe would be a bettor PM than Teresa May, the sooner she goes the better.

[Kursk]

Originally Posted by Ken W

I think that Steptoe would be a bettor PM than Teresa May, the sooner she goes the better.

Steptoe lost Ken.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Ken W

I think that Steptoe would be a bettor PM than Teresa May, the sooner she goes the better.

Albert or Harold?

[Kursk]

Originally Posted by Osem

Albert or Harold?

Hercules

[Osem]

Originally Posted by denphone

Yes he is a loser but a bigger loser is this country as we are stuck with a lame duck prime minister propped up by the DUC and from my experience its not if she goes but when as the infighting has already started to kick off within her party and its going to be very hard to douse the fires of discontent now within her party from my experience.

---------- Post added at 09:32 ---------- Previous post was at 09:30 ----------



All it needs is a couple of by-elections now and that majority with the DUC support is gone probably.

... and those dissenters will be having to consider how far they push her and the party because in the event of another election they could find themselves out of a job. Far easier for the likes of Osborne to snipe away like a childish brat from the office of his London newspaper. He has pages to fill and nothing to lose anymore.