Football Season 2014/15 - Page 197

thenry · 10-03-2015, 18:55

Pep at Bayern Munich began on a total high until he was brought back down to earth by demands he didn't change the club and instead adapt. Similar calls were made to Moyes. Similar calls made to LVG?

Shadow Demon UK · 10-03-2015, 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenry

Question for the Utd fans... Does LVG and Man Utds DNA match or come close to matching?

DNA of winning? The style of play United are used to isn't there at the moment but for me thats because he is setting up not to lose matches, mainly because of our poor defence and key players not performing (RVP, Falcao, Di Maria). Thats why he should be given another season. Sort the defence out, get the attacking players on form and the better style of play will follow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

Highlights that Moyes got a raw deal in my view. Moyes had a much more stressful inheritance and wasn't giving the money LVG was.

I agree to a point, but i think Moyes had lost the dressing room. Half the players didn't want to play for him. Theres a much better team spirit now which will help in the long run. I'm not sure if it was more stressful for Moyes, he got a team that just won the league rather than finished 7th. You have to remember a lot of the money spent under LVG were signings the club had already agreed before he arrived.

thenry · 10-03-2015, 19:33

DNA of winning is a tad arrogant but I guess that is to be expected from Man Utd supporters.

Shadow Demon UK · 10-03-2015, 19:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenry

DNA of winning is a tad arrogant but I guess that is to be expected from Man Utd supporters.

How is it arrogant? Its fact. The club has been used to winning trophies for the past 20 years. Its what the club, fans, media, everyone expects the new manager to do and its how he will be evaluated at the end of the season.

thenry · 10-03-2015, 20:12

Manchester United have been around longer than 20 years. There have been periods in which they won naff all. The point I was making on the DNA front was playing style, the fear. What amazed me most looking at Man Utd yesterday was LVG has changed things to a state where Man Utd didn't even turn up for a match vs Arsenal which is unthinkable. Arsenal deserve credit for the win but there is no getting away from the fact Man Utd didn't turn up. That says a lot. 3 points for Man Utd at The Emirates in the league was unconvincing, Arsenals own bullcrap failings.

Man Utd have a style of play in its DNA. It will be extremely difficult to pull away from it. You can talk of reinforcements all you like. It is a bit like Wenger trying to prove his square peg round hole game works when it doesn't no matter who he buys. Football doesn't have to be a complicated game. Making unnecessary changes is shooting yourself in the foot.

Shadow Demon UK · 10-03-2015, 20:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenry

Manchester United have been around longer than 20 years. There have been periods in which they won naff all. The point I was making on the DNA front was playing style, the fear. What amazed me most looking at Man Utd yesterday was LVG has changed things to a state where Man Utd didn't even turn up for a match vs Arsenal which is unthinkable. Arsenal deserve credit for the win but there is no getting away from the fact Man Utd didn't turn up. That says a lot. 3 points for Man Utd at The Emirates was unconvincing, Arsenals own bullcrap failings.

Yes and i'm one of those that realises that, i don't think we have a given right to win trophies which is why I think he should be given time, as I did Moyes. I thought we did ok in the first half last night. Both goals we gave away were poor individual mistakes by us, especially the second goal, goals which were easily avoidable. Like i said, sort our defence and i think the playing style will improve a lot.

Russ · 10-03-2015, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

Highlights that Moyes got a raw deal in my view. Moyes had a much more stressful inheritance and wasn't giving the money LVG was.

Moyes has zero experience at the level required at United and not once did he comes across as being big enough for the role. Put simply the job was too much for him. Sure give him a team like Everton and he'll get them in to europe a few times but win anything? Not a hope.

thenry · 10-03-2015, 20:41

I agree it was too much for Moyes. It didn't have to be though. He could have steadied the ship.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Demon UK

Yes and i'm one of those that realises that, i don't think we have a given right to win trophies which is why I think he should be given time, as I did Moyes. I thought we did ok in the first half last night. Both goals we gave away were poor individual mistakes by us, especially the second goal, goals which were easily avoidable. Like i said, sort our defence and i think the playing style will improve a lot.

All the goals were individual mistakes.

I wouldn't hold my breath on the reinforcement front. With or without them the flaws will be there.

**Damien** · 10-03-2015, 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Demon UK

How is it arrogant? Its fact. The club has been used to winning trophies for the past 20 years. Its what the club, fans, media, everyone expects the new manager to do and its how he will be evaluated at the end of the season.

I always wonder how the psychology of success impacts upon a team. That's really what we're talking about when using the term 'DNA of winning' I think, a team which is used to winning.

Is it about confidence in the dressing room that helps them dig in at key moments, take that audacious shot, make that ambitious pass, run that extra mile? I would say that exists. I think we can all empathise with the notion of confidence helping us to achieve more and a lack of confidence undermining us. Then you have the fact that success generates more revenue which allows you to buy better players attracted by the success which allows you to win even more.

On the other hand I don't think it's really something that exists deep within a club that cannot be lost. Look at Liverpool who could have been said to have that 'DNA' before it abandoned them in 1989 and is yet to really return. The current United team do not have to arrogance and confidence they had previously. The famous 'ability to win' seems to have been lost somewhat. United's spending power means this won't last and they won't do a Liverpool but still.

thenry · 10-03-2015, 21:27

Depending on how long this 'drought' lasts spending power could decrease.

denphone · 11-03-2015, 05:00

If they don't get into the CL that's about £50 million a season less.

thenry · 11-03-2015, 10:42

They do have the new sponsorship deals though so they should balance out vs other teams although there is no getting around a loss of CL money which will have an impact on them not being able to flex as much in the window.

denphone · 11-03-2015, 20:24

More poor refereeing in Europe.

Mr Pharmacist · 11-03-2015, 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

More poor refereeing in Europe.

But for once it never affected the result. Fully deserved for PSG. We weren't at the races.

MalteseFalcon · 11-03-2015, 22:32

YYYYYEEEEEHHHHHHAAAAAWWWWW!

Excellent Paris, take that the arrogant one. Hopefully end up with no trophies at the end of the season.