TV licence non payment could be made a civil offence

I suspect TVL have found, from their vast experience of running this operation, that most people who simply ignore them, are trying to avoid paying for a licence that they should have, and that most people who don't need a licence are happy to confirm this with them.

That's a generalisation, of course. There are bound to be people who object on principle to being treated as a potential criminal and therefore ignore all communications from TVL, and are uncooperative should one of their staff pay a visit. However TVL would not take this approach if they believed they were mostly pursuing people who didn't owe them anything. Their operation costs money to run. That expenditure can't be justified if it doesn't result in licence fees being paid.

Originally Posted by Gary L

Regardless of what this is for. (a TV)

Would you mind if Tescos were to send an employee around to search your home for a tin of their beans. would you still allow them in even if they don't believe that you buy your beans from Sainsbury's?

Yes it is the same thing.

The most stupid post you ever posted and not even remotely the same thing

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by martyh

The most stupid post you ever posted

I disagree. the one with the woman. the 2 dogs and a coke bottle was my stupidest.

and not even remotely the same thing

That's only because it doesn't happen.
because there's no criminal element involved going through your mind.
and because you made it so. so you don't have to say you wouldn't let them in your home.

would you let them in your home if they did knock your door wanting to see if you have that tin of beans of theirs?

Originally Posted by Gary L

I disagree. the one with the woman. the 2 dogs and a coke bottle was my stupidest.



That's only because it doesn't happen.
because there's no criminal element involved going through your mind.
and because you made it so. so you don't have to say you wouldn't let them in your home.

would you let them in your home if they did knock your door wanting to see if you have that tin of beans of theirs?

If Tesco had reason to believe you had £140 worth of unpaid for goods stashed in your house (I.e. something similar to the value of your TV licence - a tin of beans really is a very silly example), then they would most likely tell the police, who wouldn't do you the courtesy of sending you a letter asking you to pay for them before coming round with a warrant.

[Gary L]

So it's all about the value then?
the comparison is silly because it's not of the same value.

but the point still stands.
to prove your innocence. and the assumed guilt. would you allow anyone into your home to satisfy themselves that you are not lying or stupid?

I know someone's going to rush to post something about the law.

so send the police to knock your door and say I want to satisfy myself that you are not breaking the law.
not a salesman.

Originally Posted by Gary L

So it's all about the value then?
the comparison is silly because it's not of the same value.

but the point still stands.
to prove your innocence. and the assumed guilt. would you allow anyone into your home to satisfy themselves that you are not lying or stupid?

No Gary ,it's all about the legal obligation TVL have to enforce the licencing laws ,surprisingly nothing to do with beans

Originally Posted by Gary L

So it's all about the value then?
the comparison is silly because it's not of the same value.

but the point still stands.
to prove your innocence. and the assumed guilt. would you allow anyone into your home to satisfy themselves that you are not lying or stupid?

They don't assume you're guilty. Based on a range of factors, they assume you can be treated as a suspect, which is exactly what the police do in any other criminal investigation. And as with the police, how far you cooperate with them, as they treat you as a suspect, is up to you. Right up to the point where they decide to kick your front door in.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by martyh

No Gary ,it's all about the legal obligation TVL have to enforce the licencing laws ,surprisingly nothing to do with beans

There's that law thing out the way.

have TVL brought a warrant?

Originally Posted by Gary L

So it's all about the value then?
the comparison is silly because it's not of the same value.

but the point still stands.
to prove your innocence. and the assumed guilt. would you allow anyone into your home to satisfy themselves that you are not lying or stupid?

I know someone's going to rush to post something about the law.

so send the police to knock your door and say I want to satisfy myself that you are not breaking the law.
not a salesman.

Yes ,most people would, i seem to remember you have the same objection to gas men

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Chris

They don't assume you're guilty. Based on a range of factors, they assume you can be treated as a suspect, which is exactly what the police do in any other criminal investigation. And as with the police, how far you cooperate with them, as they treat you as a suspect, is up to you. Right up to the point where they decide to kick your front door in.

I think you're subconsciously making a connection with TVL and the police. Chris.
must be all them scary words they use in their letters

TVL will just walk away without touching your door.
even the police think twice about kicking doors in now.

---------- Post added at 22:11 ---------- Previous post was at 22:10 ----------

Originally Posted by martyh

Yes ,most people would

So most people would let Tescos in to search for a tin of beans.

I knew you would.

Originally Posted by Gary L

I think you're subconsciously making a connection with TVL and the police. Chris.
must be all them scary words they use in their letters

TVL will just walk away without touching your door.
even the police think twice about kicking doors in now.

---------- Post added at 22:11 ---------- Previous post was at 22:10 ----------



So most people would let Tescos in to search for a tin of beans.

I knew you would.

Your obsessed with beans ,get help

Originally Posted by Gary L

I think you're subconsciously making a connection with TVL and the police. Chris.
must be all them scary words they use in their letters

TVL will just walk away without touching your door.
even the police think twice about kicking doors in now.

I'm consciously making a connection between TVL and another organisation responsible for investigating criminal behaviour. You don't have to have a warrant card to pursue criminals. RSPCA inspectors do it all the time.

They may not literally kick your door in, but if they gather sufficient evidence to justify a search warrant, they can certainly do a number on your front door locks.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by martyh

Your obsessed with beans ,get help

Swap the beans for a 50" plasma.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by Chris

I suspect TVL have found, from their vast experience of running this operation, that most people who simply ignore them, are trying to avoid paying for a licence that they should have, and that most people who don't need a licence are happy to confirm this with them.

That's a generalisation, of course. There are bound to be people who object on principle to being treated as a potential criminal and therefore ignore all communications from TVL, and are uncooperative should one of their staff pay a visit. However TVL would not take this approach if they believed they were mostly pursuing people who didn't owe them anything. Their operation costs money to run. That expenditure can't be justified if it doesn't result in licence fees being paid.

The problem is that hey make it very difficult to inform them that you don't need a licence, this is only apparent when you try to follow their misleading links on their website. I believe that whatever my views on wether the licence is a good or a bad way of paying to view television is irrelevant, I was polite to the TVL salesman and he seemed happy that I was telling the truth. Their salesmen work on commission so it wasn't in his interest to waste any more time, although I will not be surprised if I have had the last communication from them.

I live on my own and out of personal choice I do not invite anyone uninvited in my house. The only time I have relaxed this rule over the past 9 years is twice allowing the electricity company in because they insisted by law that they had to check the installation to the meter and to check that the meter has not been tampered with. the last time it happened they explained that the meters were being upgraded and I did suggest to them that the meter should be external to the property to avoid access issues in the future.

The only reason that I allowed them access is (a) they would cut my supply off and (b) they would obtain a warrant. I am more than happy for TVL to cut off my TV supply!

---------- Post added at 17:53 ---------- Previous post was at 17:49 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

Right up to the point where they decide to kick your front door in.

Well the police did that to my house within the past 18 months and made themselves look like incompetent fools. If they do it on behalf of TVL I will certainly be seeking as much publicity as I can, and instead of letting it go because I am busy I would put in the time effort getting them to pay for the damage they cause.

Originally Posted by Escapee

The problem is that hey make it very difficult to inform them that you don't need a licence, this is only apparent when you try to follow their misleading links on their website..

It really is very simple to fill out the online form 3 clicks from the home page and you are filling the form out

I will not be surprised if I have had the last communication from them.

Of course not ,do you really expect them to take your word that you will never ever need a licence in the future ,they will continue checking your status ,or "harrassing" as some say on a regular basis