'Muslim Plot' To Take Over Schools Investigated

[rhyds]

Originally Posted by Chris

I think you may have difficulty backing that somewhat prejudicial post with facts ...

http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/20...ce-exam-papers

Originally Posted by rhyds

A positive environment where accepted scientific concepts such as evolution aren't mentioned because the school's preferred big book of magic stuff disagrees with it?

If the religious want religious schools then they can pay for them out of their own funds. The CofE/Judaism/Catholocism etc. aren't short of a bob or two.

And I'm willing to bet that the biggest bonus of "faith" status for a school isn't its "positive environment", more the "positive vetting" it can then apply in its admissions policy.

I think that's a bit of an exaggeration ,evolution is taught as part of the national curriculum in both faith schools and state schools .

---------- Post added at 16:28 ---------- Previous post was at 16:23 ----------

Originally Posted by Gary L

I can't believe that some Muslims would want to take over non Muslim schools. and force their ways on non Muslim people. in a non Muslim country,

well when I say non Muslim country..

I think this is more about radical Muslims trying to force a more strict form of Islam on those moderate Muslims rather than forcing infidels into Islam

[Gary L]

And their own people have grassed them up. and foiled their plans.

Originally Posted by rhyds

http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/20...ce-exam-papers

Any school attempting to do that has been told in no uncertain terms not to do it

---------- Post added at 16:33 ---------- Previous post was at 16:32 ----------

Originally Posted by Gary L

And their own people have grassed them up. and foiled their plans.

Which speaks volumes imo.

[rhyds]

Originally Posted by martyh

Any school attempting to do that has been told in no uncertain terms not to do it

Only after being caught and it being made public.

The state, and those things operated and funded by it, should not get involved in religion, as this leads to one faith or a select few faiths being given special privilege over other faiths, or those who have no faith.

I have nothing against independent religious schooling or home religious schooling, but state education must be separate from this.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by rhyds

A positive environment where accepted scientific concepts such as evolution aren't mentioned because the school's preferred big book of magic stuff disagrees with it?

Why was I taught about science and evolution in school?

---------- Post added at 17:34 ---------- Previous post was at 17:33 ----------

Originally Posted by rhyds

I have nothing against independent religious schooling or home religious schooling, but state education must be separate from this.

The fact there is so much religious ignorance in the world indicates the education of it is paramount.

Originally Posted by rhyds

http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/20...ce-exam-papers

Your generalised prejudice isn't supported by a single specific news report whose facts aren't in dispute. - even in Birmingham, where there is clearly an endemic problem.

[rhyds]

Originally Posted by Chris

Your generalised prejudice isn't supported by a single specific news report whose facts aren't in dispute. - even in Birmingham, where there is clearly an endemic problem.

http://www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storyCode=6078734

The Rt Revd John Pritchard, Bishop of Oxford, said that admissions policies favouring religious children should be changed, even if accepting a broader range of pupils damaged results.

<snip>

Revd Pritchard conceded the change might lead to lower exam results. “We may not get the startling results that some church schools do because of getting some very able children, but we will make a difference to people’s lives,” he said.

Is that enough evidence? Or is a Bishop of the Church of England not credible?

---------- Post added at 18:14 ---------- Previous post was at 18:12 ----------

Originally Posted by Russ

The fact there is so much religious ignorance in the world indicates the education of it is paramount.

I've nothing against teaching children about other religions than their own (indeed, as you say, it's pretty vital), but if the school's one with a "religious" ethos, are the pupils really going to get to see a balanced view?

Always, the atheists think that their belief in the non-existence of a deity is the only balanced one ... the lack of self-awareness is hilarious.

I must say your faith in the words of a bishop of the Church of England are touching, if naive. That said, I'm not sure how his words support your generalised prejudice against religious schools, as places where "accepted scientific concepts such as evolution aren't mentioned because the school's preferred big book of magic stuff disagrees with it"?

My contention is that schools that teach equivalence between the ideas of intelligent design and evolution are rare in the UK, schools that elevate ID above evolution still rarer, those that don't mention evolution at all - well, you have your one example, and as I said, the facts in that case are not in doubt. Beyond that, if you have evidence to back your assertion, let's have it. Otherwise let's just accept that you have a baseless prejudice against schools with a religious input because you disagree with their beliefs, and leave it at that.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by rhyds

I've nothing against teaching children about other religions than their own (indeed, as you say, it's pretty vital), but if the school's one with a "religious" ethos, are the pupils really going to get to see a balanced view?

Erm...I did, and this was in the late 80s to early 90s. I'm getting the impression your views are based on conjecture.

On BBC News there was something about the plot not being real or the document not being authentic but the investigation was being continued because of concerns expressed after this story was made public.

So let's be careful here. It's a bit up in the air.

Oddly enough, those who have been blogging and drawing attention to this for months were amongst the first to predict that the BBC would try to play it down, now that the story has risen high enough up the news agenda they can't simply go on ignoring it - it really doesn't chime with the approved multi-culti agenda down at New Broadcasting House. If you're playing "buzzword bingo" with the news this evening, make sure you have the phrase "isolated incidents" on your card.

That it has no place except to study religion as a whole subject in a subject based lesson and that students study comparative religious education.I don't think the ethos of one religion only should be allowed in any school..I think education should remain secular.

Morality however should definitely be on the curriculum..

The State does not own children, nor does it have legal guardianship of them. That is the parents' responsibility and privilege. If parents wish their children's education to take place in an environment whose ethos is informed, for example, by Roman Catholic belief and practice, then that is their absolute right and it would be chilling to think that anybody in a liberal democracy such as ours might attempt to push for anything else.

Beyond the absolute right of the parents to choose the manner of their children's upbringing, they have the right to State assistance in that, via the State funding of Aided schools, which recognises both the place religion had in pushing for universal education in the UK and also recognises the high cost of education due largely to the extensive nature of education to the age of 16 or 18.

Aside from that, it is asinine to believe that a "secular" school is capable of mixing and balancing the ethos of multiple religions, or even none at all, in attempting to set the tone against which living and learning in that environment will take place, or that whatever ethos a secular school devises must by definition be superior.

Well you are entitled to that view point Chris but as an educator of 30+ years I have to disagree.