[MERGED] Windows 8 discussion

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by Sirius

But the Ipad and iphone interfaces has not been implemented in OSX has it ???

Anyway here's a good review of the next 8.1 update of the update

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLiIKmCidVw

they making it so you don't have to see the metro though if you don't want to so they listened to them customers and who know what apple will do with OSX in future it never gonna have the user base of windows though is it

all Micosoft is doing is unifying there OS for all their devices

---------- Post added at 17:58 ---------- Previous post was at 17:51 ----------

Originally Posted by techguyone

Heh that's funny

I don't know a single person who cried over the loss Windows 3xx it was shocking compared to 95


I suppose some gamers when their DOS orientated games didn't play so nice perhaps...

I used both in business, and whilst the 95 series didn't properly settle down until W2K even the earlier versions were miles better than the Win 3xxx

We mostly used NT4 anyway in the end, had the 95 look but absolutely rock solid under that - unless you were a gamer I suppose.

yes windows 95 was far better than windows 3.11 but that didn't stop lots people complaining because it was different the point I was making people don't like change

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Dave42

they making it so you don't have to see the metro though if you don't want to so they listened to them customers and who know what apple will do with OSX in future it never gonna have the user base of windows though is it

all Micosoft is doing is unifying there OS for all their devices

---------- Post added at 17:58 ---------- Previous post was at 17:51 ----------



yes windows 95 was far better than windows 3.11 but that didn't stop lots people complaining because it was different the point I was making people don't like change

i don't mind change when its an improvement, since when has metro or what ever its called this week been an improvement for a desktop machine. As a mobile interface on a phone or touch screen its fine but as a keyboard and mouse interface its jokingly stupid. It does not take a lot of intelligence to see that they should have allowed the start menu to be selected if wanted on desktops as a CHOICE. But hey that's Microsoft all over to be honest force anything they feel is correct even if wrong onto people then sack the guy who implemented it when it all goes spectacularly wrong. Now they are in a position where they are back peddling faster that a nun who walked into a brothel by mistake.

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by Sirius

i don't mind change when its an improvement, since when has metro or what ever its called this week been an improvement for a desktop machine. As a mobile interface on a phone or touch screen its fine but as a keyboard and mouse interface its jokingly stupid. It does not take a lot of intelligence to see that they should have allowed the start menu to be selected if wanted on desktops as a CHOICE. But hey that's Microsoft all over to be honest force anything they feel is correct even if wrong onto people then sack the guy who implemented it when it all goes spectacularly wrong. Now they are in a position where they are back peddling faster that a nun who walked into a brothel by mistake.

yes sirus mate Microsoft didn't handle the change the best way and maybe should have changed slowly rather that big change straight away I use mouse and keyboard and no intention of getting a touch screen and find it works fine with windows 8 but think even you agree the changes they are making to windows 8 is better and we know the start menu is coming back either later this year or next year in windows 9.

as you well know I prefer the new UI over the start menu but I totally agree with you there should been a choice that's the biggest mistake Microsoft made on 8

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Dave42

yes sirus mate Microsoft didn't handle the change the best way and maybe should have changed slowly rather that big change straight away I use mouse and keyboard and no intention of getting a touch screen and find it works fine with windows 8 but think even you agree the changes they are making to windows 8 is better and we know the start menu is coming back either later this year or next year in windows 9.

as you well know I prefer the new UI over the start menu but I totally agree with you there should been a choice that's the biggest mistake Microsoft made on 8

Agree with you fully

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

Windows suffers this every other release since win 98 irrelevant because people do not like change

The vast majority were happy with windows 95 do you think we should all still be on that?

People were happy with VHS, Audio Tape and CRT televisions does that mean we should stop trying to improve?

People are happy with change if
a) it doesn't happen too quickly, and
b) it brings a real advantage to them.

You mention VHS, Audio Tape and CRTs.. Those were all technologies where the replacements brought definite and real advantages to the user. Usually quality of reproduction (although I still think CRT produces better colours than either LCD or LED).

Actually I'm glad you mentioned VHS and Audio Tape, because the replacements for them are good examples of where people readily accepted change. In both cases, people spent (in some cases) a lot of money on media they already had just to get the advantages of the new format (be it CD or DVD). In both cases, CD and DVD (particularly DVD) eventually killed the technology they were replacing.

Please tell me the advantages that the start screen brings over the start menu. The only one I can see is Tiles, but that doesn't give me anything I need when using my desktop PC, and even when I do need information it can provide, it's far easier to access on my phone. In fact, I'd even go so far as to say that the way Microsoft have implemented them in Windows 8, Tiles even get in the way of how I want to use my PC. That's not a good thing for any user interface element.

Also Microsoft forced the change upon their users. If they have offered it as an option, I don't think people would be avoiding Windows 8 as much (bearing in mind that has some real advantages over Windows 7 under the bonnet).

As for Windows 8 not being a failure (which is a point you made the other day) with 10% of the market. It has attained that market share after over a year of sales. This is, I believe, the slowest rate of adoption for windows ever.

It's also worth remembering that Microsoft are currently in the same position in the corporate markets that IBM were 40 years ago, which means that pretty much anything they sell is guaranteed to sell well in corporate markets. Based on their previous performance, I would be surprised if they didn't at least expect Windows 8 to have a larger market share than XP (which is still 29% apparently).

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Stuart

People are happy with change if
a) it doesn't happen too quickly, and
b) it brings a real advantage to them.

You mention VHS, Audio Tape and CRTs.. Those were all technologies where the replacements brought definite and real advantages to the user. Usually quality of reproduction (although I still think CRT produces better colours than either LCD or LED).

Actually I'm glad you mentioned VHS and Audio Tape, because the replacements for them are good examples of where people readily accepted change. In both cases, people spent (in some cases) a lot of money on media they already had just to get the advantages of the new format (be it CD or DVD). In both cases, CD and DVD (particularly DVD) eventually killed the technology they were replacing.

Please tell me the advantages that the start screen brings over the start menu. The only one I can see is Tiles, but that doesn't give me anything I need when using my desktop PC, and even when I do need information it can provide, it's far easier to access on my phone. In fact, I'd even go so far as to say that the way Microsoft have implemented them in Windows 8, Tiles even get in the way of how I want to use my PC. That's not a good thing for any user interface element.

Also Microsoft forced the change upon their users. If they have offered it as an option, I don't think people would be avoiding Windows 8 as much (bearing in mind that has some real advantages over Windows 7 under the bonnet).

As for Windows 8 not being a failure (which is a point you made the other day) with 10% of the market. It has attained that market share after over a year of sales. This is, I believe, the slowest rate of adoption for windows ever.

It's also worth remembering that Microsoft are currently in the same position in the corporate markets that IBM were 40 years ago, which means that pretty much anything they sell is guaranteed to sell well in corporate markets. Based on their previous performance, I would be surprised if they didn't at least expect Windows 8 to have a larger market share than XP (which is still 29% apparently).

Good post sir

Originally Posted by Stuart

People are happy with change if
a) it doesn't happen too quickly, and
b) it brings a real advantage to them.

You mention VHS, Audio Tape and CRTs.. Those were all technologies where the replacements brought definite and real advantages to the user. Usually quality of reproduction (although I still think CRT produces better colours than either LCD or LED).

Actually I'm glad you mentioned VHS and Audio Tape, because the replacements for them are good examples of where people readily accepted change. In both cases, people spent (in some cases) a lot of money on media they already had just to get the advantages of the new format (be it CD or DVD). In both cases, CD and DVD (particularly DVD) eventually killed the technology they were replacing.

Please tell me the advantages that the start screen brings over the start menu. The only one I can see is Tiles, but that doesn't give me anything I need when using my desktop PC, and even when I do need information it can provide, it's far easier to access on my phone. In fact, I'd even go so far as to say that the way Microsoft have implemented them in Windows 8, Tiles even get in the way of how I want to use my PC. That's not a good thing for any user interface element.

Also Microsoft forced the change upon their users. If they have offered it as an option, I don't think people would be avoiding Windows 8 as much (bearing in mind that has some real advantages over Windows 7 under the bonnet).

As for Windows 8 not being a failure (which is a point you made the other day) with 10% of the market. It has attained that market share after over a year of sales. This is, I believe, the slowest rate of adoption for windows ever.

It's also worth remembering that Microsoft are currently in the same position in the corporate markets that IBM were 40 years ago, which means that pretty much anything they sell is guaranteed to sell well in corporate markets. Based on their previous performance, I would be surprised if they didn't at least expect Windows 8 to have a larger market share than XP (which is still 29% apparently).

in all fairness all you need to do with newui is spend a few minutes researching how to use it and keyboard shortcuts to access everything. It does not really take anything other than the program list we were used to away all the programs are still available in list form if you just spend a few seconds looking for it

so what if its the lowest uptake? and its took a year? again so what ? how long has Mac and Nix had ?

[Sirius]

More evidence Microsoft are back peddling fast.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/04...sktop_updates/

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by Sirius

More evidence Microsoft are back peddling fast.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/04...sktop_updates/

no it more like they making it work with what system you got if you got touch ect you go to start screen and if your on desktop pc you boot straight to desktop which what happens on update 1 it a good thing they making it work better with whatever system your using surely you agree on that and when the start menu comes back im sure you will only find it on desktop pc and not tablets

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Dave42

no it more like they making it work with what system you got if you got touch ect you go to start screen and if your on desktop pc you boot straight to desktop which what happens on update 1 it a good thing they making it work better with whatever system your using surely you agree on that and when the start menu comes back im sure you will only find it on desktop pc and not tablets

I did not say i disagreed, it just that they should have done it from day one and they might have had a winner instead of ****ing of there customers who pay there wages

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by Sirius

I did not say i disagreed, it just that they should have done it from day one and they might have had a winner instead of ****ing of there customers who pay there wages

yes totally agree would be so much better if done from day one but they are getting there that what matters most even though it taking longer than should have

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

in all fairness all you need to do with newui is spend a few minutes researching how to use it and keyboard shortcuts to access everything. It does not really take anything other than the program list we were used to away all the programs are still available in list form if you just spend a few seconds looking for it

I have. I support a lot of Windows users as part of my job, and I get all the Microsoft development stuff (including OSes) for free, so I've had Windows 8 on my home PC since release, because regardless of my own opinion of it, I will have to answer questions on it at work, so it's in my interest to keep up to date with new OS releases.

so what if its the lowest uptake? and its took a year? again so what ? how long has Mac and Nix had ?

You really don't understand, do you? Microsoft are not directly competing against OSX or any of the Unixs or Linuxs. What they are competing against is the rise of Android and iOS in the workplace. As tablets get ever more powerful, an increasing amount of companies are replacing PCs with them, which is reducing Microsoft's target market. Combine that with Microsoft's apparent inability to sell tablets (which is odd, as the Windows based tablets I've used have been good), and you have a recipe for problems. It's also worth remembering that in the light of the success of iOS, Apple are also seeing increased sales of the Mac in it's various forms. To both home and commercial users.

Problems not helped when Microsoft introduce a new version of the OS with a new UI. Company staff will require training and any software may require updates. Combine that with the cost of testing and deploying Windows to hundreds of PCs and it stops being so expensive to switch to a new OS. Thus, they are running the risk that a lot of their existing customers will switch.

Originally Posted by Stuart

I have. I support a lot of Windows users as part of my job, and I get all the Microsoft development stuff (including OSes) for free, so I've had Windows 8 on my home PC since release, because regardless of my own opinion of it, I will have to answer questions on it at work, so it's in my interest to keep up to date with new OS releases.



You really don't understand, do you? Microsoft are not directly competing against OSX or any of the Unixs or Linuxs. What they are competing against is the rise of Android and iOS in the workplace. As tablets get ever more powerful, an increasing amount of companies are replacing PCs with them, which is reducing Microsoft's target market. Combine that with Microsoft's apparent inability to sell tablets (which is odd, as the Windows based tablets I've used have been good), and you have a recipe for problems. It's also worth remembering that in the light of the success of iOS, Apple are also seeing increased sales of the Mac in it's various forms. To both home and commercial users.

Problems not helped when Microsoft introduce a new version of the OS with a new UI. Company staff will require training and any software may require updates. Combine that with the cost of testing and deploying Windows to hundreds of PCs and it stops being so expensive to switch to a new OS. Thus, they are running the risk that a lot of their existing customers will switch.

But Microsoft are not in trouble plenty of places have avoided windows 8 and chose to install 7 instead a lot of these who have been happy and not spending money on operating system because they were happy with XP. While M$ are still selling OS's then they are not in trouble. I do agree with the mobile side of things though and imo Windows 8 should be perfectly usable in the mobile market but people have stuck with what they know and guess what that does?? yes it bares out my point that people are afraid of change

[Dave42]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=QKTlOYjmiZo

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Dave42

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=QKTlOYjmiZo

Thats what i posted above

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35685837-post984.html