M&S tells Muslim staff they CAN refuse to serve customers buying alcohol or pork - Page 7

Russ · 24-12-2013, 23:12

Ah yes Richard Dawkins, that well-known champion of respect and tolerance.

Sigma · 24-12-2013, 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ

Ah yes Richard Dawkins, that well-known champion of respect and tolerance.

Dawkins is intolerant of religious beliefs, because they are not based on anything that evidence can back up. If I said that aliens were behind 9/11, I would probably be laughed off the forums because I couldn't provide any evidence to back that claim up, but if I said that I believe man was made out of dust, woman out of man's rib, that we're all immortal and when I die I'll be up in Heaven with Elvis and 2Pac, people will say "yes, we must be tolerant of such beliefs" rather than saying "that's utter bollocks - there's no reason to believe that!".

The world would be a better place if people were taught how to think critically and be less tolerant of ********. That doesn't mean we have to be cruel to people though and force them out of a job just because they won't handle alcohol or pork, when they were hired on the basis that they would not have to do those things.

Jimmy-J · 24-12-2013, 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ

Ah yes Richard Dawkins, that well-known champion of respect and tolerance.

Respect and tolerance for religion has gone on for far too long, some of us are fed up of seeing what barbarism, stupidity and nonsense religion really is.

Sigma · 24-12-2013, 23:45

There is absolutely no reason to respect religious beliefs, in the same way that you wouldn't respect any grand claim that has zero evidence to back it up. The only reason people do respect them is either because they are religious themselves, because of societal norms/tradition, because of "safety in numbers", or because they're told that it's good to respect them, but none of those are good reasons to do it.

Take the claim, examine the evidence, come to a conclusion - just like you would with any other claim. Religion deserves no special "exemption status" in that respect.

Happy Christmas BTW.

Russ · 24-12-2013, 23:49

lol The irony!

Dawkins is intolerant of something he disagrees with and wants other people to follow his views, hopefully at the sane time losing their own beliefs. If that's what flicks his switch then I'm happy for him but the very least he could do is acknowledge his hipocrisy.

Unlike normal tolerant people he is not happy for there to be room for all views and beliefs in the world - he wants religion removed from it. Nothing wrong with disagreeing with a religion but wanting it's complete removal is arrogance and ignorance personified.

Jimmy-J · 24-12-2013, 23:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sigma

There is absolutely no reason to respect religious beliefs, in the same way that you wouldn't respect any grand claim that has zero evidence to back it up. The only reason people do respect them is either because they are religious themselves, because of societal norms/tradition, because of "safety in numbers", or because they're told that it's good to respect them, but none of those are good reasons to do it.

Take the claim, examine the evidence, come to a conclusion - just like you would with any other claim. Religion deserves no special "exemption status" in that respect.

Happy Christmas BTW.

Yes, all the very best to one and all.

Sigma · 24-12-2013, 23:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ

Dawkins is intolerant of something he disagrees with and wants other people to follow his views, hopefully at the sane time losing their own beliefs.

I think your understanding of this is somewhat weak.

Dawkins = "Rationality! Scepticism! Critical thinking! Scientific method! Examine evidence!"

Religious = "What it says in this largely anonymous collection of scriptures is 100% fact and nothing can ever change that!"

If you think that both of those things are opposite sides of the same coin then do say so, because that means I'm wasting my time replying to you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ

Unlike normal tolerant people he is not happy for there to be room for all views and beliefs in the world - he wants religion removed from it. Nothing wrong with disagreeing with a religion but wanting it's complete removal is arrogance and ignorance personified.

Explain to me why it's arrogant and ignorant.

If I make a grand claim to you without any evidence at all, but I say that you should believe it regardless because I know that I'm right - is that not the very height of intellectual arrogance? That's what theists do all the time! It's not what Dawkins has ever done though.

Russ · 25-12-2013, 00:11

If you think Christianity dictates that everything it teaches is 100% fact then you have fallen at the very first hurdle of understanding what 'faith' means.

It is arrogant and ignorant because my beliefs do not impact on Dawkins' life at all yet he still wants me to lose my faith. And if you can demonstrate anywhere on this forum where I have told anyone what they should believe then you're a better man than I.

Halcyon · 25-12-2013, 07:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sigma

They were hired on the basis that they would not be asked to serve customers with certain products and the only reason that they were is because of a one-off failure in company policy. If you have any issue, surely it has to be with M&S and all of the other stores that have similar policies, not with the Muslim who politely refused to serve the customer.

OK, that makes more sense. Company policies are to blame.

Mr Angry · 25-12-2013, 09:39

Proof of god.

Sirius · 25-12-2013, 09:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Proof of god.

I am now a converted believer

25-12-2013, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmy-J

Respect and tolerance for religion has gone on for far too long, some of us are fed up of seeing what barbarism, stupidity and nonsense religion really is.

so none believers have never killed anyone then? or been barbaric ? look at what the world of science has brought? global warming pollution Nuclear weapons do I need to continue?

dilli-theclaw · 25-12-2013, 11:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Proof of god.

More likely proof of a good publicist

The bleiber will return, although sadly not in two thousand years I suspect

Sirius · 25-12-2013, 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

so none believers have never killed anyone then? or been barbaric ? look at what the world of science has brought? global warming pollution Nuclear weapons do I need to continue?

I remember being told by the Chaplin "GOD will be with you" just before we headed off to blow crap out of the republican guard tanks.

They teach us do not kill every Sunday, until it suits them and then we are told we are doing it with god at our side. which one is it ???????

Jimmy-J · 25-12-2013, 13:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

so none believers have never killed anyone then? or been barbaric ? look at what the world of science has brought? global warming pollution Nuclear weapons do I need to continue?

As you already know tiz, there are wicked people out there who do wicked things, usually because they're just bad or have some sort of mental illness... but it's when a normally sane, good person does wicked things in the name of religion, now that upsets and saddens me to no end.