The state benefits system mega-thread.

Originally Posted by Hugh

Well reasoned, factual rebuttal...

(or was it an empty ad hominem jibe - difficult to tell the difference).

was that sarcasm or a ad hominem jibe in return?

[Qtx]

Statistically there is bound to be at least a few suicides directly linked to ATOS actions. One is too many.

At least the UK police can listen to music at work with the taxpayer picking up the £660k music licencing fee, have to get our priorities right http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23984386

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Qtx

Statistically there is bound to be at least a few suicides directly linked to ATOS actions. One is too many.

At least the UK police can listen to music at work with the taxpayer picking up the £660k music licencing fee, have to get our priorities right http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23984386

Any company that has TV's on the wall or radio's in there warehouses is supposed to pay for a license. The people who visit the company's act like the idiots from the Tv tax collections. Where my wife works they had to remove the radio from the warehouse because the owner of the business cannot afford the cost they demanded when the stormed into his warehouse. Yet another tax on the public, It used to be that the tv tax paid for it but they must of realised they could squeeze yet more tax out of us by having them separate.

http://www.ppluk.com/I-Play-Music/Bu...ness-type-114/

Then you wonder why people just tell them to go forth in short jerky movments

[TheDaddy]

Interesting site

http://atosvictimsgroup.co.uk/tag/suicide/

It's all well and good blaming labour but the coalition has had three years and a considerable offer of help on the welfare issue and has driven most of those with a lot more knowledge on the subject then IDS away with the agenda they are persuing which is cost cutting by any means. They have changed the rule's so that being able to walk 20 metres dismisse's you on a number of mobility points doesn't matter if your in pain at the end of the 20 metres doesn't matter can you repeat it within a certain time or is 30 or 40 more then you can handle do members on here really feel that's fair.

It's the tip of the iceberg on how genuine claimants have been hit by this coalition since they took power and continue to be hit. I have never denied the system needs reform it needs to be a system tightened up so that only those genuinely needing help get it and so that the taxpayer can feel the system is targetting the right people and is not a free ride but this process of reform is not going to deliver that. Keep blaming the past if you want it's what we have become good at in this country looking back and not dealing with those issues that will affect us in the future you can see it right across the spectrum from welfare to energy to education.

We deserve better from those we elect at the very least we deserve honesty from them on the issue's they claim to be dealing with not ridiculous blame for the country's problems not misrepresenting of statistics to justify an agenda. Why don't we demand more from them why do we let them off the hook everytime by turning on ourselves. We so often look down on politicians for the rubbish they get up too but i'm starting to realise it isn't them that's the problem it's us we allow them to turn us against each other and never actually nail them for what they do were the idiots.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

Interesting site

http://atosvictimsgroup.co.uk/tag/suicide/

not an easy read that site good spot

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

not an easy read that site good spot

One of the worst bits

Six per cent of doctors have experienced a patient who has attempted – or committed – suicide as a result of “undergoing, or fear of undergoing” the Government’s fitness to work test.

interesting to note that having read the full stories of 3 of the suicides 2 had life threatening illnesses and one was an unemployed helicopter pilot with a history of attempting suicide

just saying .

Originally Posted by martyh

interesting to note that having read the full stories of 3 of the suicides 2 had life threatening illnesses and one was an unemployed helicopter pilot with a history of attempting suicide

just saying .

Would seem obvious to ATOS that they are unfit for work then

just replying

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by martyh

interesting to note that having read the full stories of 3 of the suicides 2 had life threatening illnesses and one was an unemployed helicopter pilot with a history of attempting suicide

just saying .

I think most suicides aren't caused by a single issue but by many with one finally breaking the proverbial camels back, how many have to be pushed over the edge by these reforms before we say enough.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I think most suicides aren't caused by a single issue but by many with one finally breaking the proverbial camels back, how many have to be pushed over the edge by these reforms before we say enough.

i agree ,but what do we do ,the reforms are needed and will happen ,the chances are that if it wasn't the reforms that tipped them over the edge it would have been something else

---------- Post added at 23:00 ---------- Previous post was at 22:55 ----------

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

Would seem obvious to ATOS that they are unfit for work then

just replying

see that's the whole problem not all life threatening illnesses mean you cannot work ,plenty of people do with the correct medication

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

One of the worst bits

Six per cent of doctors have experienced a patient who has attempted – or committed – suicide as a result of “undergoing, or fear of undergoing” the Government’s fitness to work test.

So there shouldn't be any tests and there were no tests before?

BiB it is ironic that aspect would be from the bogus hysteria about ATOS and the tests.

Originally Posted by martyh

i agree ,but what do we do ,the reforms are needed and will happen ,the chances are that if it wasn't the reforms that tipped them over the edge it would have been something else

---------- Post added at 23:00 ---------- Previous post was at 22:55 ----------




see that's the whole problem not all life threatening illnesses mean you cannot work ,plenty of people do with the correct medication

no the problem is someone who has no knowledge of the individuals circumstances are performing a flawed medical and coming to judgements in a time limited interview. Said decisions then have massive impacts on the lives of those subjected to it

---------- Post added at 23:14 ---------- Previous post was at 23:13 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

So there shouldn't be any tests and there were no tests before?

BiB it is ironic that aspect would be from the bogus hysteria about ATOS and the tests.

what is your experience of the medicals?

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

what is your experience of the medicals?

I was referring to the suggestion that the fear of a possible examination might cause a suicide attempt. That fear would come from adverse comments and not an actual examination.

Originally Posted by nomadking

I was referring to the suggestion that the fear of a possible examination might cause a suicide attempt. That fear would come from adverse comments and not an actual examination.

oh right I understand