Britain loses its AAA Credit Rating

Originally Posted by Mick Fisher

You're right Labour cocked it all up. But years later down the line and the Tories, in spite of austerity, are still cocking it all up.
!

In spite of austerity? What austerity? The country's still living way beyond its means and the national debt is still soaring.

The great big laugh here is that Ed Balls is tub-thumping over this and demanding action, when Moody has stated that it is downgrading the UK *for not dealing with the deficit quickly enough* . Moody thinks the chancellor should have done more, and should have done it more quickly. Funnily enough I could have sworn Ed Balls has spent the last two years demanding less, and more slowly.

[nashville]

Originally Posted by techguyone

I still can't get my head round the fact that despite banging on about all these 'years of austerity' and 'clawing back of benefits etc' to get us on track

yet we still just give away 6+ BILLION pounds each year on Foreign aid

Is it just me, or have I lost the plot

I agree with you. I feel it is a disgrace to give all this money away when we need it ourself, Charity does not begin at home in this country

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

In spite of austerity? What austerity? The country's still living way beyond its means and the national debt is still soaring.

The great big laugh here is that Ed Balls is tub-thumping over this and demanding action, when Moody has stated that it is downgrading the UK *for not dealing with the deficit quickly enough* . Moody thinks the chancellor should have done more, and should have done it more quickly. Funnily enough I could have sworn Ed Balls has spent the last two years demanding less, and more slowly.

Actually, unless I'm mistaken, the reason is the poor outlook in terms of economic growth, and that prospect isn't helped by cutting too hard.

Originally Posted by Chris

In spite of austerity? What austerity? The country's still living way beyond its means and the national debt is still soaring.

The great big laugh here is that Ed Balls is tub-thumping over this and demanding action, when Moody has stated that it is downgrading the UK *for not dealing with the deficit quickly enough* . Moody thinks the chancellor should have done more, and should have done it more quickly. Funnily enough I could have sworn Ed Balls has spent the last two years demanding less, and more slowly.

Agreed

We could do austerity like Greece or Italy .People think it's bad in this country when a few state freebies are cut or brought under control .The present government have and are continuing to minimize the effect on the population as a whole because in my opinion we have had no real austerity measures compared to other countries

---------- Post added at 18:49 ---------- Previous post was at 18:43 ----------

Originally Posted by danielf

Actually, unless I'm mistaken, the reason is the poor outlook in terms of economic growth, and that prospect isn't helped by cutting too hard.

and knowing that we are going to have to borrow an ever increasing amount increasing the deficit.Not cutting deep enough will have still meant we would lose the AAA rating but it would mean we could not regain it as quickly helping any recovery along

Originally Posted by Chris

In spite of austerity? What austerity? The country's still living way beyond its means and the national debt is still soaring.

The great big laugh here is that Ed Balls is tub-thumping over this and demanding action, when Moody has stated that it is downgrading the UK *for not dealing with the deficit quickly enough* . Moody thinks the chancellor should have done more, and should have done it more quickly. Funnily enough I could have sworn Ed Balls has spent the last two years demanding less, and more slowly.

The country is going to be living beyond it's means whilst the economy stagnates and dips in and out of recession. The level of cuts that would be required to balance the books would be far too drastic. I don't think Moody's is downgrading just because we're not cutting fast enough, you could just as easily say we're not growing fast enough either. A growing economy would help us increase the money coming in and balance it that way.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

Even the Tories ministers want rid of cock up king Osborne, Cameron has to do the right thing and sack Osborne.

At least if we have to have this crappy government for 5 more years, then he has to get rid of Ossie.

Originally Posted by Damien

The country is going to be living beyond it's means whilst the economy stagnates and dips in and out of recession. The level of cuts that would be required to balance the books would be far too drastic. I don't think Moody's is downgrading just because we're not cutting fast enough, you could just as easily say we're not growing fast enough either. A growing economy would help us increase the money coming in and balance it that way.

Some interesting commentary here:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/to...g-fast-enough/

[mertle]

martyh greece cuts done absolute nothing made things alot worse. All but totally killed them there problem is lax tax paying. Alot rich just fled country to find another nation to plunder.

Anybody who aint in that super rich would not even be considered something so insane. Crash and burn ala scorched earth would cause massive unemployment. Middle england would be highly effected when they see there jobs or businesses go up in puff of smoke.

Dont matter damn anyway if do enough digging. Rothchilds & co calling all the tunes.

We all up creek only those with gold reserves and silver will be laughing. They manuvered world into position make Money worthless. They think too much money is circulation want it reduced.

Any those might one watch this vid. It quite interest how they hood winked all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=oK-ydMVEoZM

Originally Posted by Chris

Some interesting commentary here:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/to...g-fast-enough/

But I don't think the report quite says what he says. For example..

http://www.moodys.com/research/Moody...Aaa--PR_266844

More specifically, projected tax revenue increases have been difficult to achieve in the UK due to the challenging economic environment. As a result, the weaker economic outturn has substantially slowed the anticipated pace of deficit and debt-to-GDP reduction, and is likely to continue to do so over the medium term.

He used that line in debt-to-GDP ratio to support this argument but Moody's do not seem to be saying one or the other. Just that the debt combined with the low income mean the Government will miss their target.

At the top of the report they give their three reasons:

The key interrelated drivers of today's action are:

1. The continuing weakness in the UK's medium-term growth outlook, with a period of sluggish growth which Moody's now expects will extend into the second half of the decade;

2. The challenges that subdued medium-term growth prospects pose to the government's fiscal consolidation programme, which will now extend well into the next parliament;

3. And, as a consequence of the UK's high and rising debt burden, a deterioration in the shock-absorption capacity of the government's balance sheet, which is unlikely to reverse before 2016.

Actually, in Greece, tax evasion was prevalent throughout all levels of the economy, working class to the super rich...

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

Some interesting commentary here:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/to...g-fast-enough/

Which says absolutely nothing about how fiscal consolidation should be achieved. It certainly doesn't rule out stimulating the economy by cutting less hard and deep.

[mertle]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Actually, in Greece, tax evasion was prevalent throughout all levels of the economy, working class to the super rich...

indeed thats what there issue was it needed to be fixed. Goldman & sachs used greece and greek people seeing whats going off.

Incidently listening to another vid. This talks about possible future as energy.

It talks mainly america but he talks some sense.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKBMG-v0j08

28 mins was scary stuff. If you saw initial vid I posted the bloke showed how M3 money which been hidden with excuse expensive to calculate the world money has shronk over trillion.

Now the europe cant recover as it cant unite that money will disapearance in six months into blackhole. That what worked dont work anymore. He thinks greek people sussed whats going off. First one said Gold, silver currently undervalued will shoot.

He talks about the cheating, lieing, deception we been told the banking systems so overcomplex its not sustainable. He believes there will be people turn on science and technology.

To be fair its probable there already suspicious why mechinism has turned are jobs to machines. That some miricles would creat that new inovision to create next job boom. He believes its slowing down thats when people will get negative towards.

Its amazing vid like the other both give insight to issues NO government can solve it.

[Mick Fisher]

Our Chancellor has the mentality of a Bean Counter and we all know what happens to Companies or Countries that are run by Bean Counters.

The chronic short termist approach of just cutting enough expenditure to avoid bankruptcy just leads to a downward spiral of even more cuts ad infinitum until the final humiliation of a full scale sterling devaluation followed by a bail out from the IMF.

George has had his chance and has blown it. Unless someone with some extraordinary fiscal expertise and a little more imagination can be found I fear we are on a slippery slope to find out what real austerity means. Maybe we will see a return to the ration book as food, power and fuel spiral forever upward in cost and our buying power dwindles.

[techguyone]

As things mostly seem to be cyclical, have we been in this position before in the past?

If so, what caused it, and what did we do to get out of it.

I vaguely remember the 70's were tough, but only being a kid not the detail, I also remember the mass unemployment of the early 80's (though not any jobseekers/benefits bullying stigma like now)

Anyone cast any light on the past, and what they did
to get out of the mess?

Here is the actual Moody's information.