BBC News cuts: 140 posts to go.

[Media Boy UK]

Radio 4, BBC2's Newsnight and BBC News Channel to be affected by 'Delivering Quality First' cost savings.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012.../bbc-news-cuts

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

Cuts at the Bloated Broadcasting Company?

About time, but then I don't pay for the rubbish anyway.

So you dont use there services what so ever ?

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

A few minutes of radio 4 maybe but nothing else. It's just so banal.

BTW I'd be quite happy to pay a small contribution to R4 but the rest is trash.

Have you ever posted a link from the BBC news site on this forum or do you EVER go to any BBC website ???

BTW here's a hint

YOU DO

And you state in your info you have TV so you are getting the BBC whether you like it or not. Pay your tax like the rest of us

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

A few minutes of radio 4 maybe but nothing else. It's just so banal.

BTW I'd be quite happy to pay a small contribution to R4 but the rest is trash.

The BBC caters for a wide audience but Radio 4 is good. BBC 1 and 2 have their moments, Newsnight and Panorama are pretty good. The odd drama and comedy show etc. The Website and iPlayer are also good quality.

[carlwaring]

Exactly. We all use the BBC as much as we want to. Some simply use it more than others. To show pleasure that anyone is now unemployed is not very nice at all.

[toonlight]

Originally Posted by Media Boy

Radio 4, BBC2's Newsnight and BBC News Channel to be affected by 'Delivering Quality First' cost savings.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012.../bbc-news-cuts

Good riddance to an over paid, over staffed + over funded publically body. They had taken the devils shilling so now have bear what come with it, by paying with there not needed job in the first place... just like the soon to be formal TVL agents! Cost savings my left foot, the BBC radio operation has more staff than it ever needed compared to a private radio operation on the open market, which delivers a better more leaner quality programme format on a much smaller crew normally 3 people ...BBC you're looking at 8 -10 basic crew so there where your money gets wasted folks.

[Osem]

They could save a few quid by ditching Gary Lineker (@£1.5m pa) and some of the other overpaid football pundits like Alan Hansen (@£40,000 per appearance on MOTD). I'm sure there are plenty of ex-footballers who could do the job just as well for a whole lot less.

[carlwaring]

Originally Posted by toonlight

Good riddance to an over paid, over staffed + over funded publically body.

By what benchmark are you measuring? What is your experience in the sector that makes you qualified to make such a sweeping generalisation?

They had taken the devils shilling so now have bear what come with it, by paying with there not needed job in the first place...

Okay. Which jobs, specifically, are "not needed" and why?

Cost savings my left foot, the BBC radio operation has more staff than it ever needed compared to a private radio operation on the open market...

Really? I assume you really do have no clue as to how these things work?

Here's one for you then. Most "private radio operations" will pay one person to voice-track (ie basically pre-record) their week'-worth of shows and therefore can pay them less than they would to do all the shows in 'real time'; and that's just the one person who, if they did do their programmes "live" would be the only person in the studio; barring a possible Producer.

Compare and contrast that with BBC Radio 1 where (as far as I know) most shows are broadcast LIVE; certainly the daytime ones. And Radio 4? Well they're mostly talk, so they will have some people in the studio, a producer and at least one or two "technical" folk to control everything rather than being "self-op" like Radio 1 or any commercial station.

...which delivers a better more leaner quality programme format

Subjective. You might think that. Others might not.

...on a much smaller crew normally 3 people ...BBC you're looking at 8 -10 basic crew so there where your money gets wasted folks.

No. As I explained, it's usually the other way round.

[jodash]

Originally Posted by Osem

They could save a few quid by ditching Gary Lineker (@£1.5m pa) and some of the other overpaid football pundits like Alan Hansen (@£40,000 per appearance on MOTD). I'm sure there are plenty of ex-footballers who could do the job just as well for a whole lot less.

agreed but the BBC seem to be loyal to there presenters on TV and radio,unless there all on very long contracts

[toonlight]

Let me me begin to say hello my fellow gent carlwaring
Lets get right to the answers now..... ok buddy

Originally Posted by carlwaring

By what benchmark are you measuring? What is your experience in the sector that makes you qualified to make such a sweeping generalisation?

Well a tax payer in general carl plus a private sector worker for many years who seen all how the public sectors workers get for doing sweet fanny adams nothing but moan when they have work by pulling their finger out to work for there "self called" little amount of money..... like the BBC workers are public servants right ? Yes it's publicly funded for peats sake
So like any other public owned service it should be run on a tight shoe string no more extra expense than need unlike now days.
You have person for H & S person for paper pushing, person for that then this, then that it goes on!!! Typical time wasting exercises to fool unquestioning fellow tax payer/s paying their wages I may add, then they ask for a license fee on top after we paid for them already pure utter down right cheek I never leave nothing anything to chance as you have gathered, you have question everything leave nothing unturned I may add in todays world if you don't you will never know how little we a taxpayers have to rightly pay not be mugged at every corner with tax like untold numbers that do willing & not wake there feeling to the system of big government that make them slaves to the system.

Originally Posted by carlwaring

Okay. Which jobs, specifically, are "not needed" and why?

Good question, fellow kind sir.... well all the red tape jobs first & easy one like as that of a eg; personal manager, all H + S enforcers staff + alike then work your way from the top down, like it should be like. Shear off most top level management, then their paid followers. Then the assistant to all the middle management, then last cap all salaries below the point of inflation/interest rates not above like now!!! Hows for a start my second would be to drive down the cost of production to the minimum unlike now even only pay on percentage then the rest on performance rated pay.

Originally Posted by carlwaring

Really? I assume you really do have no clue as to how these things work?

Most public service work for there own cause, but it should never have been that way, blame the unions for that - they seam to want everything & anything for their members but never think theres a fine line between in the black or in the red mist + your on your own way to losing your job money wise.
As public servants, we paying their wages also to add giving them their job in the first place, respect should from top down to the tax payers... you don't see that when you hear about the chief exc bonuses or there expense claims no you don't just it's all take not in-thinking where there money came from in the primary stages. If these people want respect they have to earn it the hard way not slack away from there neck downwards. I know all about balancing costs as I work in private sector (SME), where cost are tight but there work to be had but overall we have a higher work rate & production than if it was run by public funded body, to compare eg private sector vs council (tax payer funded) doing the same jobs.
Yes you guessed it + most likely seen it too the "council" take longer, cost 3x as much even most times have to be redone from the private sector as errors have been made from day one!
Plus I've seen for myself on many times, public bodies employing "yes" agreeing brain zombies to do middle/higher management dirty work if that doesn't stink from high heaven what doesn't. Who gets the can first? it's the brain zombie not the management as the brainless idiot gets replace with another one or two hence the words "red tape" or " over the top government bureaucracy" come to mind > useless bunch the lot of them.

Originally Posted by carlwaring

Here's one for you then. Most "private radio operations" will pay one person to voice-track (ie basically pre-record) their week'-worth of shows and therefore can pay them less than they would to do all the shows in 'real time'; and that's just the one person who, if they did do their programmes "live" would be the only person in the studio; barring a possible Producer.
Compare and contrast that with BBC Radio 1 where (as far as I know) most shows are broadcast LIVE; certainly the daytime ones. And Radio 4? Well they're mostly talk, so they will have some people in the studio, a producer and at least one or two "technical" folk to control everything rather than being "self-op" like Radio 1 or any commercial station.

Well like all of the BBC's assortment of media outlets, they leach from other sources rather that source it for themselves, it's how BBC been ran since bean counters have taken over, oh way back when. Reading a piece the other day, how the BBC is trying to muscle out all the commercial sources in all type of media these days, take "the voice" on BBC1 theres a good example for you where corp' is heading - wanting to be a commercial but still over funded by tax payers squeezing out the smaller players that produce a higher quality of programming other than what rubbish the BBC produces in todays world. All repeats, poor lack luster type of programming, no new ideas + or themes but the old form of produced rubbish; then they wonder why are they viewing figure are falling big each year... any one guess why?
Btw I no need to watch any of BBC content as it all same I've though the years, even there radio stations > utter dire need of full removal, to free up the air waves for others to broadcast content on a local level.

Originally Posted by carlwaring

Subjective. You might think that. Others might not.

Thats true, each of us have our own views but the BBC corp needs to brought down to it's knees & it to be cut down to it real size - cut 75% of the lot of it, employ the empy space (programming) on a free lance basis like the commercial sector does, easy as that - plus run on shoe string budget no extra expense !! than it needs that way you cut cost & improve quality - a tried + tested formula for years.

So I hope I've answered all your questions, if not don't be afraid to ask carl buddy, enjoy your day whenever your reading this

---------- Post added at 22:45 ---------- Previous post was at 22:23 ----------

Originally Posted by Sirius

Have you ever posted a link from the BBC news site on this forum or do you EVER go to any BBC website ???
BTW here's a hint
YOU DO
And you state in your info you have TV so you are getting the BBC whether you like it or not. Pay your tax like the rest of us

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

If I've posted a link to a BBC website/article then that's usually because it comes up in a internet search and this site likes approved sources. I don't use BBC resources as I do not subscribe to their services. Yes I have TVs but as you're surely aware you may own as many TV sets, VCRs, DVD recorders, computers etc as you like, and they can be capable of receiving live TV, but still not need to pay the BBC tax. The facts

The BBC like the rest of us will have to live within it's means. Any job loss is unfortunate but that's the way it is.

Hia heero & Sirius having a good day?

Sorry I have agree with heero, on this one Sirius it says it all on back of your TV license look for yourself, I have even on the TVL web site ....... you only need a license if only your viewing a live feed broadcast only that not anything else.

Not: owning a number of TV's , DVD players, Moblie phone, computer etc

As long you use you equipment to watch Tv on demand, catch up services like BBC I player (not live) recorded programmed content you within your legal rights. Don't think one minute those TVL persons are for your benefit to visit you, there to collect a illegal tax which they have no power to in the first place, do remember that too.
Say nothing to them, don't answer there questions send them packing full stop.

[carlwaring]

Originally Posted by toonlight

Well a tax payer in general carl plus a private sector worker for many years who seen all how the public sectors workers get for doing sweet fanny adams nothing but moan when they have work by pulling their finger out to work for there "self called" little amount of money.....

So basically no actual relevant experience to say whether or not the BBC are actually over-staffed then. Just a general feeling that "well they're public sector workers so they must be? Okay. Glad we got that cleared up and we can safely ignore your opinion as just that.

like the BBC workers are public servants right ? Yes it's publicly funded for peats sake

Except that they're actually not "public sector" workers in the sense that you mean it.

So like any other public owned service it should be run on a tight shoe string no more extra expense than need unlike now days.

So do you have any examples of this "extra un-necessary expense" then, or are you just parroting the Daily Wail?

You have person for H & S person for paper pushing, person for that then this, then that it goes on!!! Typical time wasting exercises to fool unquestioning fellow tax payer/s paying their wages I may add,

This makes no sense, so I'm going to have to ignore it as nonsense.

then they ask for a license fee on top after we paid for them already...

More nonsense. What have we "paid them already" that they then shouldn't need to "ask for a Licence Fee for"?

I never leave nothing anything to chance as you have gathered, you have question everything leave nothing unturned I may add in todays world if you don't you will never know how little we a taxpayers have to rightly pay not be mugged at every corner with tax like untold numbers that do willing & not wake there feeling to the system of big government that make them slaves to the system.

Good question, fellow kind sir....

I thought so.

well all the red tape jobs first & easy one like as that of a eg; personal manager, all H + S enforcers staff + alike then work your way from the top down, like it should be like.

I assume you mean "personnel" manager?

So the BBC shouldn't employ anyone who is "..responsible for managing the welfare and performance of everyone within the organization." (link) You don't think the welfare and performance of a company's employees is anything for said company to bother about?

Shear off most top level management, then their paid followers.

Well they're cutting their pay. That's a start

Hows for a start my second would be to drive down the cost of production to the minimum unlike now even only pay on percentage then the rest on performance rated pay.

The BBC already pays far less than any equivalent commercial-sector job, so I don't think there's any reason to cut things further. However, there is a more cuts to come and it's all detailed here.

{snip a load of stuff I cba to read}

Well like all of the BBC's assortment of media outlets, they leach from other sources rather that source it for themselves..

Again, you're going to have to provide some examples of what you mean because I don't know what you're on about

Reading a piece the other day, how the BBC is trying to muscle out all the commercial sources in all type of media these days..

No, they really aren't

take "the voice" on BBC1 theres a good example for you where corp' is heading - wanting to be a commercial but still over funded by tax payers squeezing out the smaller players that produce a higher quality of programming other than what rubbish the BBC produces in todays world.

They don't "want to be commercial" at all. No commercial channel wants them to be commercial either because it would be very bad for them. But it is true that the BBC does operate in a commercial media environment.

All repeats...

Massive over-statement there

poor lack luster type of programming, no new ideas + or themes but the old form of produced rubbish..

Subjective. I disagree.

..then they wonder why are they viewing figure are falling big each year... any one guess why?

Because ever TV channel viewing figures are falling due to there being ever more channels to watch.

However, despite that, BBC1 and BBC2 remain by far the most-watched pair of channels from any single broadcaster.

Thats true, each of us have our own views but the BBC corp needs to brought down to it's knees & it to be cut down to it real size - cut 75% of the lot of it

As I understand it, a report a few years ago by the Conservative Party concluded that, to strip the BBC down to "PSB only" (though they didn't say whose definition of PSB they were using) would save each LF payer a grand total of just £6 per year. So they buried it and turned it into "LF freeze" instead.

..plus run on shoe string budget no extra expense

You got any examples? Here's one. For the entire Beijing Olympics, the BBC took a team of a little over 400 people. That's for their entire coverage; start to finish on all outlets. For one, standard, 90m football match in the UK, Sky use 120 people. So, in your opinion, which of those is the more wasteful?

So I hope I've answered all your questions...

Not so much, really. You've ranted a lot, though. Hope you feel better now

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by carlwaring

So basically no actual relevant experience to say whether or not the BBC are actually over staffed then.

Here's one, a point I have raised before.

I was listening to the radio in the car, and flicking through the channels noted that radio 2, radio 4 and radio 5 all had virtually the same news bulletin and travel information, all being read out by different people.

Surely not beyond the realms of possibility to centralise that is it?

I think some of you should read Flat Earth News by Nick Davis.

You might start to appreciate just how the gathering of everyday news has been cheapened by the cut throat press barons who demand high turnover and churn at the expense of actually ethically sourcing the news.
This is the reason why every newspaper and news channel and radio news has exactly the damned same news stories.They basically all go to the same flawed sources where cutting costs is the motto rather than getting the news.At least the BBC has had the financial ability to try and source news ethically.That is up until Murdoch putting his size 9s all over influencing the present government over the cuts to the BBC's funding.

[carlwaring]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Here's one, a point I have raised before.

I was listening to the radio in the car, and flicking through the channels noted that radio 2, radio 4 and radio 5 all had virtually the same news bulletin and travel information, all being read out by different people.

Surely not beyond the realms of possibility to centralise that is it?

You have to remember that each of those stations will deliver there news in different styles according to the listener demographic.

However, I believe that is one thing they are, indeed, looking at doing.

Originally Posted by Maggy J

I think some of you should read Flat Earth News by Nick Davis.

Not the first time I have had that book recommended when discussing this subject.

Someone I know of (on the DS forums) who is a freelancer, tells how some commercial stations get their news stories from the BBC website!!

Originally Posted by Maggy J

That is up until Murdoch putting his size 9s all over influencing the present government over the cuts to the BBC's funding.

Funnily enough, that's not the first time (or second or third!) that I have read that comment too

Originally Posted by carlwaring

You have to remember that each of those stations will deliver there news in different styles according to the listener demographic.

However, I believe that is one thing they are, indeed, looking at doing.


Not the first time I have had that book recommended when discussing this subject.

Someone I know of (on the DS forums) who is a freelancer, tells how some commercial stations get their news stories from the BBC website!!


Funnily enough, that's not the first time (or second or third!) that I have read that comment too

Sadly there was a time when reading the same facts in more than one newspaper actually meant that the story was likely to be true.Now it just means they use the same sources..