VM finally post news on bridge mode - superhub

For some customers........

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Stop making excuses for the inadequate performance of the superhub.

I was addressing your specific comment about why they hadn't released an interim firmware. I wasn't commenting on the performance of the SuperHub.

New features to the firmware will take more time to do than feature fixes.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I was addressing your specific comment about why they hadn't released an interim firmware. I wasn't commenting on the performance of the SuperHub.

New features to the firmware will take more time to do than feature fixes.

I be amazed if there is no such thing as a bridge mode on the original model.

This would indicate either.

1 - no original stock firmware existed when VM made the order, maybe this was a new just out of dev model.
2 - a unusual development path, I suppose not too surprising when consider its crappygear.

Netgear consistently are low priced router's tend to be good for low budget's when looking at what to buy so VM seemed to have gone with the cheapest quote.

Bridge mode is not that complicated,its basically disabling NAT, firewall, and adding some kind of passthru DHCP function so the connecting device gets the net ip automatically. After that its cosmetic stuff to change in the gui accordingly so people cant configure things like port forwarding which wouldnt do anything on it in bridge mode. On a normal router which has no direct bridge mode option its usually possible to do it manually by doing as I said in terms of disabling NAT.

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

I be amazed if there is no such thing as a bridge mode on the original model.

Here is a manual for a stock Netgear Cable Gateway. I don't see a 'bridge mode' function anywhere in it http://www.comhem.se/blob/view/-/192...CG3100.pdf.pdf

[Chrysalis]

As I said bridge mode is basically changing 2 settings

any router that can disable NAT and firewall supports it.

For a router to not be able to disable NAT is very unusual.

[pip08456]

You are able to turn NAT on or off with the CG3100.

(page 52 fig 5-4)

http://www.comhem.se/blob/view/-/192...CG3100.pdf.pdf

[BenMcr]

According to text from an ADSL gateway Netgear make ftp://downloads.netgear.com/files/DG...UM_14Oct10.pdf

NAT automatically assigns private IP addresses (10.1.1.x) to LAN-connected devices.
• Enable. Usually NAT is enabled.
• Disable. This disables NAT, but leaves the firewall active. Disable NAT only if you are sure that you do not require it. When NAT is disabled, only standard routing is performed by this router. Classical routing lets you directly manage the IP addresses that the N300 wireless modem router uses. Classical routing should be selected only by experienced users.

That doesn't sound like a modem only mode, as to me it reads as if the gateway still retains the external IP, and you would still have to use private IP addresses on the devices connected to the Gateway

I would assume the Cable version works in the same way

[Ignitionnet]

It isn't a bridge mode, no, it's just straight routing instead of doing NAT.

Incidentally you're link thieves, I found that manual on Comhem and just FYI only reason I found it was that I knew it was there from listening to the complaints about that device from a Comhem user

[pip08456]

Have to go to a meeting will reply to this later.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

According to text from an ADSL gateway Netgear make ftp://downloads.netgear.com/files/DG...UM_14Oct10.pdf

NAT automatically assigns private IP addresses (10.1.1.x) to LAN-connected devices.
• Enable. Usually NAT is enabled.
• Disable. This disables NAT, but leaves the firewall active. Disable NAT only if you are sure that you do not require it. When NAT is disabled, only standard routing is performed by this router. Classical routing lets you directly manage the IP addresses that the N300 wireless modem router uses. Classical routing should be selected only by experienced users.

That doesn't sound like a modem only mode, as to me it reads as if the gateway still retains the external IP, and you would still have to use private IP addresses on the devices connected to the Gateway

I would assume the Cable version works in the same way

on my adsl router if I disable NAT the pc gets the internet IP address. and the router only has a lan ip address. A pure bridge mode may be a bit more complicated then I thought but the basics of it is dumping NAT and passing thru all traffic untouched to a new device.

[pip08456]

Basically you are correct Chrys, bridge mode though would disable the router side altogether though which to me is a misleading.

The workround ATM leaves you double NATed as you know so just being able to switch off NAT in the SH would be an improvement, if the firewall is switched off as well then certainly to my mind the SH router side would pass all traffic without hinderance.

However, your personal router would still be connecting to the IP of the SH router not directly to the modem side.

We know the SH has 2 IP addys. 192.168.0.1 and 192.168.100.1 the second being the modem side. (try it, it works).

So for true bridge mode 192.168.0.1 and the accompying Guest IP of 192.168.1.1 need to be able to be disabled in the SH to give true bridge mode where your router can use either of the 2 IP addys to connect to the modem side without any conflict.

Now to answer Ben, you keep coming out with different PDF files for different modem/routers to try to explain why the SH is what it is!

The SH is what it is, is purely and simply because that is what VM asked for. There are those who have already SSH'ed into it and found many parts of the GUI disabled etc.( they still exist in the firmware/software, just turned off.).

VM got what they asked for!

For those who would like to view the result of accessing the hub see here.

http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/.../379669#M40501

[Chrysalis]

yeah I understand what you saying.

of course on my superhub for whatever reason 192.168.100.1 hasnt worked for a while. just times out.

[qasdfdsaq]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

on my adsl router if I disable NAT the pc gets the internet IP address. and the router only has a lan ip address. A pure bridge mode may be a bit more complicated then I thought but the basics of it is dumping NAT and passing thru all traffic untouched to a new device.

No, what you've described pretty much is pure bridge mode. The "bridge mode" on cable modems is actually not pure bridge mode.

---------- Post added at 02:11 ---------- Previous post was at 02:09 ----------

Also, http://www.netgear.com/service-provi...02_CG3302.aspx

Management Specifications

• Advanced Settings: Wireless, Port Forwarding, Port Triggering
• Bridge, Cable Device, Ethernet MIB

Whatever that means.

---------- Post added at 02:18 ---------- Previous post was at 02:11 ----------

Originally Posted by pip08456

You are able to turn NAT on or off with the CG3100.

(page 52 fig 5-4)

http://www.comhem.se/blob/view/-/192...CG3100.pdf.pdf

Not sure if this applies to the SH/CG3xxx but turning off NAT on most consumer residential gateways (i.e. typical home routers) pretty much is what most people want out of bridge mode on the SH. It could however convert it into a straight router as Ignition mentioned but that's not the typical nomenclature used on most home devices I've seen, not sure about the cable routers though.

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Now to answer Ben, you keep coming out with different PDF files for different modem/routers to try to explain why the SH is what it is!

The SH is what it is, is purely and simply because that is what VM asked for. There are those who have already SSH'ed into it and found many parts of the GUI disabled etc.( they still exist in the firmware/software, just turned off.).

VM got what they asked for!

I know VM got what they asked for - they asked for a Hub from Netgear. Why do people keep on thinking I'm saying stuff I'm not?

What I was trying to point out, is that Netgear Gateways don't seem to have a pure bridge mode. As the two PDFs seem to indicate, they have 'Disable NAT' instead which puts them into a 'classic router' mode.

From how I understand this to work, if Virgin just enabled this, it would still leave the public IP on the SuperHub, and then people would have to start messing around with static IP addressess on the LAN side. Which isn't exactly a user friendly option

However, what I thought everyone wanted (and as far as I understand it what Virgin are going to deliver), was the public IP to be on whatever equipment was connected to the SuperHub, be it your own router or whatever else. In effect making it act like a standlone modem.

Based on the PDFs, current Netgear gateways (be it ADSL or Cable) can't do this

[zekeisaszekedoes]

Originally Posted by pip08456

I am still xcurious as to why they haven't released an interim firmware just to enable bridge mode, can't be too complicated. Then release another after thorough testing for all the other problems.

I know it's probably a typo, but xcurious sounds like a hip, modern slang version of "especially and/or extremely curious" and I'm adding it to my lexicon.

More to the point, I'm xcurious myself about the bridge mode not being rolled out with great haste, but if the beta testers who are posting here and in the hidden part of VM community are anything to go by it looks like a top priority. So, y'know, all that moaning we've been doing could end up being worth the effort.

Originally Posted by BenMcr

Based on the PDFs, current Netgear gateways (be it ADSL or Cable) can't do this

So in effect VM are asking Netgear to "break new ground" by doing something they wouldn't do usually? If that's true I'm *almost* impressed. Especially as it goes towards why there is a delay.