Cutting pay for the Police - what next

[Derek]

Originally Posted by Pierre

you contribute 14%, how much do we contribute?

Probably the same if not less than for any other public sector employee.

Originally Posted by Pierre

You also can't be made redundant. In this current climate that kind of job security is priceless.

When they talk about job losses, they mean not replacing officers that leave, not making them redundant.

They are wanting to remove that safety net and have short, medium and long term contracts instead of an ongoing job.

I don't know if anyone was watching the BBC News there. Nick Robinson has just claimed every cop in London gets double time for working Sundays. A blatant lie that makes the 4 hours O/T for answering a phonecall myth seem believable.

I'm curious as to other workers experiences with overtime. Every previous workplace I've been in has offered time and a half at a minimum for overtime and the current time and third, minus the first half hour, is the lowest I've experienced yet it's still trotted out as being outrageous and tantamount to sticking your fingers in the till.

What do firemen, ambulance workers, nurses etc. get for overtime rates?

[bonzoe]

And some don't get paid overtime.

I know the police do a hard job, but as per ALL public sector jobs, it's Joe public who has to stump up and pay.............even if not receiving pay rises themselves, where will it end? I have noticed my pay packet go down over the last 10 years, but the bills just keep going up.

Originally Posted by Derek

Probably the same if not less than for any other public sector employee.



They are wanting to remove that safety net and have short, medium and long term contracts instead of an ongoing job.

I don't know if anyone was watching the BBC News there. Nick Robinson has just claimed every cop in London gets double time for working Sundays. A blatant lie that makes the 4 hours O/T for answering a phonecall myth seem believable.

I'm curious as to other workers experiences with overtime. Every previous workplace I've been in has offered time and a half at a minimum for overtime and the current time and third, minus the first half hour, is the lowest I've experienced yet it's still trotted out as being outrageous and tantamount to sticking your fingers in the till.

What do firemen, ambulance workers, nurses etc. get for overtime rates?

in my experience those in the private sector are very lucky if they get overtime rates ,my wife doesn't (not even for weekends) non of the factory workers at the company i subby to get overtime rates ,the night shift get the same pay as the day shift

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

This government need to have a good look in the mirror at themself and think, what are we doing to this country.

They have now decided to reduce the pay of officers, not only have they cut the forces down to a bare minimum, they have now decided to cut there pay.

This will not only reduce the morale of officers on the beat to an all time low, but it will reduce the prospect of anyone thinking of joining the service, we need MORE police officers and PCSO's on the beat otherwise crime will go up, and who will win in the end - the criminal, as they will know that if they commit a crime, there will be no old bill to nick em'.

They haven't cut salaries (they have frozen them), and they are not directly cutting the numbers.

They cannot make the Police Officers redundant. There are a lot of people who work for publicly funded organisations who are not necessarily directly employed by the government or any of the councils. They have no such job security. I am in that position.

Unfortunately, I think we would have had these cuts regardless of who was in charge, thanks to the mismanagement of the last government. I also think that had the government not made these cuts, the country would have gone "bankrupt". If this had happened, we would have been rescued, but we'd be facing far worse cuts now and cuts for a lot longer. Look at Ireland and Greece.

[superbiatch]

Originally Posted by Derek

What do firemen, ambulance workers, nurses etc. get for overtime rates?

Most NHS workers come under the Agenda for Change Pay scheme introduced about 5 years ago iirc. Any hours we work over full time 37.5 are paid at 1.5 times, but if you are part time you have to work up to full time before having this entitlement. But tbh my overtime stopped last August which is why I'm now in a debt management plan as no overtime and no pay rise (for 3 years!) = can't pay all the bills

But i do feel lucky to have a full time job at this time and I'm quite happy to work a 2nd job to make ends meet.

[Hom3r]

TBO I don't care that their having a pay cut. (I have a friend who is in Afganistan and get £20,000. A cop get £23,000 and doesn't face bomsbs or bullets every day)

I'l would have rather taken a pay cut than given redundancy.

In the current climate a cut is better than a total loss.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Derek

If you decide the job isn't worth it and go home could you get jailed?

If your boss decides you need to come in and work on a day with no notice regardless of previous plans do you need to comply with his demands?

I thinks that's a 'no' then.....

[Arthurgray50@blu]

My personnel feeling is that the police services, whatever force it is, deserve DOUBLE what they get, along with LAS and the Nurses.

WOULD any member of this forum do there job, l doubt that very much, its stressful, it is sometime take you to the limit, when you arrest someone and then get away with it on a technicality.

The paperwork, the red tape, the forces are paid to protect US. and should be paid accordingly, all these people who say, they get paid for sitting on there backside and drinking tea, there dreaming.

Remember, they have signed contracts, and therefore these are legally binding,

Actually i know of one forum member who does do their job.

Originally Posted by martyh

in my experience those in the private sector are very lucky if they get overtime rates ,my wife doesn't (not even for weekends) non of the factory workers at the company i subby to get overtime rates ,the night shift get the same pay as the day shift

marty, you appear to be confusing overtime pay with shift pay/allowance - completely different things.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

My personnel feeling is that the police services, whatever force it is, deserve DOUBLE what they get, along with LAS and the Nurses.

I take it you've never met any nurses? I have, and while a lot do a good job, there are also quite a few who do little or nothing. I suppose my opinion on Nurses took a knock when I worked at a hospital and saw how many Nurses nicked food from the patients. Not a good thing when we were budgeted a total of £1.49 a day for each patient and that £1.49 had to cover *all* the food and drink given to that patient for that day.

WOULD any member of this forum do there job, l doubt that very much, its stressful, it is sometime take you to the limit, when you arrest someone and then get away with it on a technicality.

I wouldn't. I know a few coppers though. How hard the job is depends on the area you are assigned to. I know that it *can* be a very dangerous and stressful job.

To illustrate that, I'll repeat something I posted a while back. One of my friends had been out of training a couple of weeks, and was assigned to Hounslow.

He was out on patrol and had to search a drug addict. In the search, he was stabbed by an empty syringe. He had to endure weeks of stress while he waited to find out what (if anything) he was infected by. He even convinced himself he was HIV+. Thankfully, the needle was clean. I am sure Derek has many similar stories.

However, he is posted in a quiet town now and (apparently) rarely sees action, but still gets paid the same.

It's also worth remembering that the Police are not the only government employees who regularly face danger (although they are amongst the better paid). I have family who worked at the DSS. They got death threats daily from claimants. Threats we were advised to take *seriously*. They were paid less than a third of what the average copper earned at the time.

Originally Posted by Hugh

marty, you appear to be confusing overtime pay with shift pay/allowance - completely different things.

no i'm not ,there is no overtime rate i.e time and a half double time ,the point about the night shift is that traditionlly night shift workers got extra for working night shift ours don't and i would suspect not many more do these days .I have confirmed with my wife who works for a chain of freezer shops that overtime is paid at the normal rate ,no extra for working weekends and bank holidays just the normal rate

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Derek

Probably the same if not less than for any other public sector employee.

Expertly not answered. We're talking about police not other public sector workers.

I'll ask again, you contribute 14%, how much does the force contribute?

They are wanting to remove that safety net and have short, medium and long term contracts instead of an ongoing job.

as I understand, that is not on the table.

I'm curious as to other workers experiences with overtime. Every previous workplace I've been in has offered time and a half at a minimum for overtime and the current time and third, minus the first half hour, is the lowest I've experienced yet it's still trotted out as being outrageous and tantamount to sticking your fingers in the till.

I don't get it, I used to get it in a more junior position, but for the last 10 years I have been expected to work as and when required, and be available 24/7.

I get a decent salary, and my working patterns are flexible so if I work a Sat or Sun or have a very late evening, I'll balance it up somewhere in the month/year. I don't get recompensed for inconvenience.

It's what many people in the private sector do all the time.

[Pog66]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

My personnel feeling is that the police services, whatever force it is, deserve DOUBLE what they get, along with LAS and the Nurses.

....and you are happy for your taxes to be increased and/or benefits be reduced to subsidise this?

Originally Posted by superbiatch

Most NHS workers come under the Agenda for Change Pay scheme introduced about 5 years ago iirc. Any hours we work over full time 37.5 are paid at 1.5 times,

All hours I do over the standard 37.5 are for the benefit of the company I work for

[techguyone]

It'll be interesting to see in a few years, when we're struggling for police officers, what they do to 'incentivise' people to join the force because the numbers are too low.This isn't the first time it's happened.

I suppose we could have yet more PCSO's of course lol. Not quite the same is it though.