Will Virgin ever fix the numerous Liberate bugs? - Page 2

pauldavies83 · 29-12-2010, 12:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by ahardie

Cable tv hasn't been compulsory for the last few years. If it hasn't been value for money then people have been free to move. Nor will it be compulsory to pay Â£189 for the tivo box. Nice as it would be for them to just hand us these 1Gb tivo boxes for nothing it is totally unrealistic to expect them to.

No but it has been compulsory for the 12 month minimum term I entered into. Which expires early in the new year when I will make my choice.

I didn't say they should be giving them for free, I said they should make some effort to fix the very rough edges of the V+ service they are supposed to be offering to paying customers.

And for the record, the TiVo box is Â£199 and has a 1TB hard drive.

Digital Fanatic · 29-12-2010, 13:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauldavies83

No but it has been compulsory for the 12 month minimum term I entered into. Which expires early in the new year when I will make my choice.

I didn't say they should be giving them for free, I said they should make some effort to fix the very rough edges of the V+ service they are supposed to be offering to paying customers.

And for the record, the TiVo box is Â£199 and has a 1TB hard drive.

VM are looking to move all customers over to a TiVo product, so I'm not sure what the point of wasting money on fixing "niggles" in the Liberate system is?

Obviously any major problems will always be worked on and fixed. The V+HD is still classed as current, so will have code downloads when available.

Surely better to concentrate on getting everyone moved over to the new TiVo platform? Be it the V-HD or the new TiVo boxes.

pauldavies83 · 29-12-2010, 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

VM are looking to move all customers over to a TiVo product, so I'm not sure what the point of wasting money on fixing "niggles" in the Liberate system is?

Flavour of the month spokeswoman Cindy has said the move will happen over years - is it reasonable for paying customers to continue with these "niggles" if they don't want or cannot afford TiVo whilst it is "premium priced"? Do they not deserve a fully working service that it is as reliable as it can be?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Obviously any major problems will always be worked on and fixed. The V+HD is still classed as current, so will have code downloads when available.

Depends what you class as a major issue or a niggle?

Sluggish operation after midnight - in my eyes thats major
Capacity indicator unable to cope well with HD - in my eyes thats major (and a pretty simple fix)
Chase TV doesn't work well on HD channels - very frustrating, and could be fixed with a box swap if it's the underpowered SA box's fault (that is refused or chargeable because the SA box is "still working")
Bugs with padding in certain cases - in my eyes thats major, especially when your constantly missing the last few minutes of programmes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Surely better to concentrate on getting everyone moved over to the new TiVo platform? Be it the V-HD or the new TiVo boxes.

For who? The VM corporate balance sheet, or the paying customer?

Short term, there won't be any concentration on moving everyone over. The concentration will be on flogging to the masses to make the money. When the perceived maximum "early adopters" have paid their money, that's when your concentration on moving everyone over will happen.

Digital Fanatic · 29-12-2010, 14:05

Let's just be clear here... the V+HD for as long as it's in customers homes, will be fully supported.

All current bugs are being worked on, but some minor issues may not be cost effective to carry on researching. IMO

Plus it's better for the customer to be on the TiVo platform. the Liberate system is very old now (in tv terms!), so no matter how much the Liberate system is patched and fixed, it's still old technology from the former cable-cos.

It's going to cost VM a small fortune moving everyone over, but a superior platform is worth it.

Sky's platform is creaking too, that's why they are only giving out Sky+HD boxes.

29-12-2010, 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauldavies83

No but it has been compulsory for the 12 month minimum term I entered into. Which expires early in the new year when I will make my choice.

I didn't say they should be giving them for free, I said they should make some effort to fix the very rough edges of the V+ service they are supposed to be offering to paying customers.

And for the record, the TiVo box is Â£199 and has a 1TB hard drive.

The tivo box is rumoured to be Â£189 for existing customers and you are right it is 1Tb. Personally I wouldn't be interested if it were a 1Gb box.

Horizon · 29-12-2010, 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauldavies83

Sluggish operation after midnight - in my eyes thats major.

Only after midnight?

They've always been sluggish, full stop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauldavies83

For who? The VM corporate balance sheet, or the paying customer?

.

Unfortunately with a balance sheet that is 6 billion in the red, that takes the higher priority. If it weren't for the debt, no doubt vm would spend half a billion in one hit and get all the stbs replaced ASAP. Instead they spend about 200 million on all upgrades including broadband, so its going to take about 3 years to replace all the stbs in circulation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauldavies83

Flavour of the month spokeswoman Cindy.

Yes, it appears she is around quite a bit at the moment.

Matth · 29-12-2010, 21:51

Ah, so does that mean do nothing, and get a free upgrade to HD in up to 3 years?

pauldavies83 · 31-12-2010, 13:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Let's just be clear here... the V+HD for as long as it's in customers homes, will be fully supported.

All current bugs are being worked on, but some minor issues may not be cost effective to carry on researching. IMO

So, when can we expect progress on the issues the OP highlighted?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Plus it's better for the customer to be on the TiVo platform.

Yes, but not every customer wants to pay for it. But, I'd expect the majority want the service they have already paid for to work as well as it could. Not something that V+ could be reviewed as currently.

Digital Fanatic · 31-12-2010, 13:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauldavies83

So, when can we expect progress on the issues the OP highlighted?

Yes, but not every customer wants to pay for it. But, I'd expect the majority want the service they have already paid for to work as well as it could. Not something that V+ could be reviewed as currently.

Sluggish operation after midnight - unlikely
Bugs with padding in certain cases - WIP
Capacity indicator unable to cope well with HD - WIP
Chase TV doesn't work well on HD channels - what's "chase tv" ???
Lack of a dynamic EPG - unlikely

There will be different TiVo products going forward, so not everyone will be going over to the 1TB product.

The V-HD will have the TiVo download for EPG etc at a later date.

BenMcr · 31-12-2010, 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Chase TV doesn't work well on HD channels - what's "chase tv" ???

Delay TV I think

I assume he means that the FF/RW functions acts etc aren't as responsive on HD than they are on SD

OLD BOY · 31-12-2010, 14:03

My understanding is that the V+ becomes sluggish after midnight because it is uploading the information for the next day. The specification of the boxes is only just sufficient to cope with the process, whereas if there was spare capacity, the system wouldn't slow down like this.

Hopefully the new TIVO boxes will have plenty of spare capacity so that we do not experience similar problems with this now or in the foreseeable future.

jamiec21 · 31-12-2010, 14:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenMcr

Delay TV I think

I assume he means that the FF/RW functions acts etc aren't as responsive on HD than they are on SD

Yeah, a few times during the recent cricket on SSHD1 I've paused the live TV for a couple of minutes then come back. When resuming, occasionally the box will get itself into a mess and skip a few seconds before eventually catching up with itself. Not a major issue, but annoying when watching live sport. Never had these problems with SD channels in the past, only noticed it on HD channels.

---------- Post added at 13:23 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

My understanding is that the V+ becomes sluggish after midnight because it is uploading the information for the next day. The specification of the boxes is only just sufficient to cope with the process, whereas if there was spare capacity, the system wouldn't slow down like this.

Not that I'm claiming any knowledge on this, but surely there's some code in the firmware which is telling the box exactly when to begin the EPG information grab, a time that could be changed to later on in the early hours. It seems logical, but maybe I'm taking a too simplistic view of the issue.

It was probably a bit harsh to mention the lack of a dynamic EPG as a bug, it's not a bug, just the lack of a pretty essential feature.

BenMcr · 31-12-2010, 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamiec21

Not that I'm claiming any knowledge on this, but surely there's some code in the firmware which is telling the box exactly when to begin the EPG information grab, a time that could be changed to later on in the early hours. It seems logical, but maybe I'm taking a too simplistic view of the issue.

It was probably a bit harsh to mention the lack of a dynamic EPG as a bug, it's not a bug, just the lack of a pretty essential feature.

As far as I understand it, even if it could be moved the upload doesn't just cover the V+ HD boxes, but the V HD and SD boxes as well - and they only carry a one day EPG.

So if you move the time those customers (who outnumber the V+ customers by a fair bit!) may end up not having EPG information for times when people actually watch TV

31-12-2010, 15:10

Slightly off-topic but will the tivo be a dynamic epg. Will tivo do the neccessary updates? I would hope so as that would be partly what the Â£3 sub would be for wouldn't it?

jamiec21 · 31-12-2010, 15:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by ahardie

Slightly off-topic but will the tivo be a dynamic epg. Will tivo do the neccessary updates? I would hope so as that would be partly what the Â£3 sub would be for wouldn't it?

If the Tivo doesn't have a dynamic EPG, it would be laughable. I have near 10 year old Freeview boxes which have dynamic 7-day EPGs, for it not to be in brand new DVB-C boxes would be disgraceful.