Where's the money been found.

Originally Posted by Maggy J

I may have to count the pennies but so what if I eat less chocolate/sweets/fruit because I put a couple of quid in the Oxfam box for Pakistan flood victims when I was passing the Oxfam shop yesterday.

How can we not give.

Maggie i have not said we shouldn't give ,i have said we shouldn't ringfence the budget so it is untouchable At the moment i believe the DFIDs' budget is somewhere between 7-9 billion ,a not inconsiderable sum of money some of which i feel could be redirected back home to either help pay of our loans thus ensuring further aid in years to come or taking the sting out of the present round of cutbacks ,this would also have the side effect of lessening the public outrage at suffering cutbacks whilst giving billions away

Originally Posted by martyh

Maggie i have not said we shouldn't give ,i have said we shouldn't ringfence the budget so it is untouchable At the moment i believe the DFIDs' budget is somewhere between 7-9 billion ,a not inconsiderable sum of money some of which i feel could be redirected back home to either help pay of our loans thus ensuring further aid in years to come or taking the sting out of the present round of cutbacks ,this would also have the side effect of lessening the public outrage at suffering cutbacks whilst giving billions away

But even 9 billion isn't going to plug any of the holes in the dyke.

Originally Posted by Maggy J

But even 9 billion isn't going to plug any of the holes in the dyke.

oh come on Maggie even if the budget was to be cut by a third (not unreasonable i think)then 3 billion would be back in the uk economy ,meaning those much needed new schools (to use your example)would be built ,and as i said ,much less outrage from the public

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by martyh

oh come on Maggie even if the budget was to be cut by a third (not unreasonable i think)then 3 billion would be back in the uk economy ,meaning those much needed new schools (to use your example)would be built ,and as i said ,much less outrage from the public

There isn't that much outrage that I've known regarding foreign aid. Copious amounts, largely encouraged by unions and Labour for political reasons over cuts but not a massive amount over foreign aid.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

There isn't that much outrage that I've known regarding foreign aid. Copious amounts, largely encouraged by unions and Labour for political reasons over cuts but not a massive amount over foreign aid.

How would anybody know? if any illfeeling is reported in the press it would be dismissed as media hype ,if a poll was done it would be dismissed as using leading questions ,If people admit to wanting the aid cut they would be dismissed as uncaring .There seems to be plenty of outrage amongst the working classes that i know ,but nobody bothers to ask them

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by martyh

How would anybody know? if any illfeeling is reported in the press it would be dismissed as media hype ,if a poll was done it would be dismissed as using leading questions ,If people admit to wanting the aid cut they would be dismissed as uncaring .There seems to be plenty of outrage amongst the working classes that i know ,but nobody bothers to ask them

Funny, I understood that 'working classes' have a vote and an MP too, same as us middle class types.

Are we getting into class war here? We really don't want to do that especially about financial related things

Easy as it is to see things as black and white there are a ton of shades of grey with things like this. Some of my own family are outraged about many things, this being one of them, which is why I as a general rule avoid discussing politics with them

[TheNorm]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Are we human, or are we dancers?

Not that I want to be pedantic*, but if you are referring to The Killers I think you'll find the lyric is "Are we human or are we dancer?" (singular)which is wonderfully ambiguous.

*well, maybe just a little bit

Marty while i understand your point you have to realise that whatever money we give away we usually do so in the safe and certain knowledge that the benefits usually financial as well will more then compensate. Foreign aid is such a bad title for what the money is used for and does for this country and that is why the budget was ring fenced because part of us getting the country back on an even keel like it or not will be improved trade and dealings with foreign nations. I am not rolling in it but compared to those poor sods in pakistan right now i am and having the life of reily so if we can help we should it is the human thing to do and on top of that trust me our government will already have worked out how we will ultimately profit from this supposed act of kindness.

I heard a statistic on The BBC news this morning that may put this into perspective.

The government SAVES £87 billion on not paying carers.That is NOT a cutback.It's money that just isn't given to carers because they take on the burden instead.If they didn't the government would have to find that sum..

Think about that..

Makes Arthur's figure of £70 million pale into insignificance.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

It was stated in The Daily Star today, that the government has announced a 500 million grant for aid in Africa, what the hell is going on here, we are making sacrifices and this is being forced on us, yet they can find yet more money for another country.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

It was stated in The Daily Star today, that the government has announced a 500 million grant for aid in Africa, what the hell is going on here, we are making sacrifices and this is being forced on us, yet they can find yet more money for another country.

Africa is a continent Arthur.

See previous comments regarding budgets, etc, for more information. Already paid for.

If you're reading the Daily Star it does explain a few things though.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

It was stated in The Daily Star today, that the government has announced a 500 million grant for aid in Africa, what the hell is going on here, we are making sacrifices and this is being forced on us, yet they can find yet more money for another country.

I linked to the DS (oh, I feel so used now......) - you missed out the bit about it being to combat malaria, Arthur.

Anyhoo, here's the ToryGraph's take on it....

Malaria is one of Africa’s biggest problems, killing a child every 45 seconds and costing an estimated £7 billion a year in health care costs.

It is not known which countries will receive the money. All aid programmes are currently under review.

Government sources claim the extra aid could save 5,500 children’s lives in Zambia by increasing access to malaria treatment and prevention.

Meanwhile, in Ghana, up to 13,000 lives could be saved by funds for 2.4  million insecticide-treated bed nets, the sources said.

And it is from the ring-fenced budget.

[Stuart]

Indeed, it's entirely possible that if we didn't give them the £70 million (which, while it is a lot of money, is a tiny amount relatively speaking), the Taliban would then go in and use the fact that we ignored the problems in Pakistan (regardless of whether we are or not, it would be presented that way by the Taliban, so that would be the perception) as ammunition in any future recruitment drives.

The costs as a result of that could be far greater than 70 million.

Sorry but if the daily star or as i like to call it "the make it up as we go along rag" is the basis for any opinion then that opinion is devalued because clearly no real research has been done into any given subject.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

I don't care, we should not send that amount of money to a country, when we are suffering also.llWe are being told that we have to make cutbacks due to money that has been spent in this country, an yet they can send that amount of money abroad, they can quite easily stop or half that amount to put back into the economy, as an old motto is 'whats good for the goose, is good for the ganda"