Ban the burkha ?

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Woops, my bad, trying to find it but there was also a few attempts at crossing passport control in a burkha one of I believe suceeded.. just can;t find the right news report as the search keeps getting clogged with french and belgium "ban the burkha" reports

Try the Sun and Mail websites

The failure of a security officer to carry out their duties properly is not reason enough to ban an item of clothing.

[Kymmy]

Is it me or is google getting worse

Even Islamic countries have problems http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6270626.stm

---------- Post added at 15:19 ---------- Previous post was at 15:17 ----------

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Try the Sun and Mail websites

The failure of a security officer to carry out their duties properly is not reason enough to ban an item of clothing.

Not saying it is and definately didn't say we should ban it (see post #648) what I have said a few times within this thread is that Burka wearers should expect to remove the item when proof of identity is needed

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Woops, my bad, trying to find it but there was also a few attempts at crossing passport control in a burkha one of I believe suceeded.. just can;t find the right news report as the search keeps getting clogged with french and belgium "ban the burkha" reports

I seem to remember WPC Sharon Beshenivsky's killer escaping the country under a burka to...

[Derek]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I seem to remember WPC Sharon Beshenivsky's killer escaping the country under a burka to...

Yep he was believed to have gone back home wearing a niqab.

http://sweetness-light.com/archive/m...a-veiled-woman

[Kymmy]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I seem to remember WPC Sharon Beshenivsky's killer escaping the country under a burka to...

Originally Posted by wikibin

Some time between Christmas Day and New’s Year he fled the UK, returning to Somalia, apparently bearing his sister’s passport and disguised in a niqab. Jama was not required to prove his identity by immigration staff.

http://wikibin.org/articles/mustaf-jama.html

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I seem to remember WPC Sharon Beshenivsky's killer escaping the country under a burka to...

Niqab actually, using his sister's passport.
Again, as Kymmy and I and others have said, there is no reason why their faces cannot be shown for security reasons such as at check-in, passport control, security control, shops, banks, jewlers, schools, busses etc.

You may also be aware that a reporter was able to fly all over europe using passports which weren't hers, clearly showing her face as she travelled.

[Derek]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Niqab actually, using his sister's passport.
Again, as Kymmy and I and others have said, there is no reason why their faces cannot be shown for security reasons such as at check-in, passport control, security control, shops, banks, jewlers, schools, busses etc.

Has there been any instances of people suing or similar because some people have demanded that forms of face covering are removed?

If there hasn't been then surely all that needs to happen is for check-in staff, passport control etc. to grow a pair and demand that where its necessary for ID to be confirmed or faces to be seen that anything obscuring that is removed.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Derek S

Has there been any instances of people suing or similar because some people have demanded that forms of face covering are removed?

If there hasn't been then surely all that needs to happen is for check-in staff, passport control etc. to grow a pair and demand that where its necessary for ID to be confirmed or faces to be seen that anything obscuring that is removed.

My understanding is that security staff should ask for any face covering to be removed, and if requested, a private room and female member of staff is available (to confirm identity, nothing else, before MLM see's this).
As with any security system, if the people running can't be bothered, then checks won't take place, and as demonstrated by the reporter who travelled on other people's passports, you don't have to cover your face to get through in that situation.


The only search related complaints which spring to mind are Diana Ross, and that poor woman in the US who was forced to use pliers to remove her nipple piercings behind a screen in the main security area, while the male security officers giggled like little school boys.

[Kymmy]

Makes you wonder whether other biometric measures (like a finger print/iris scan/voice print) should be implemented as standard for any monetary or security situation.. Then they'd be no arguing that the burka covers the face...

Only problem then is that the Ban the Burka people would have to admit that they're purely against the burka because it's an alien idea to their normal culture

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by Derek S

Yep he was believed to have gone back home wearing a niqab.

http://sweetness-light.com/archive/m...a-veiled-woman

Is there any substantive proof that he did?

Most, if not all, reports state it was "believed" that he did I'm not sure that it was ever proven to be the case (happy, as ever, to be corrected).

It was not mentioned during the course of the trial, as far as I am aware, and a spokesperson for the police at the time poured scorn on the theory saying "he may also have escaped using a pantomime horse disguise".

Interestingly - despite ministerial and senior political figures calls at the time for an investigation in to how he might have managed this feat - I don't believe any such investigations were held.

That being the case one could quite reasonably assume that the reason no investigations took place into the veil theory was because it didn't actually occur - but was just another example of veil hysteria.

[frogstamper]

As I said earlier I don't really have an issue with this oppressive garment concerning security, as no doubt in situations where an identity needs confirming the woman in question, or more likely her very insecure husband, can give consent.
I'm far more concerned with the insecure sad little men who force "their" women to wear this monstrosity, Britain has a long proud history of women fighting for equality down the years and in my opinion this is no different.
Sadly I believe that a lot of people believe they are going to be accused of Islamaphobia if they speak out against the burkha, ridiculous, in 21st century Britain we are content to sit back for fear of offending a very vocal minority whilst there are women being made to wear this sack before being allowed out...this is the real travesty about the burkha.

[papa smurf]

French back burka ban as only ONE MP votes against move to outlaw Islamic 'walking coffins'





French MPs today overwhelmingly voted to ban the burka after a senior minister described it as a ‘walking coffin’ and a ‘muzzle’.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...#ixzz0tb20K21m

Originally Posted by papa smurf

French back burka ban as only ONE MP votes against move to outlaw Islamic 'walking coffins'





French MPs today overwhelmingly voted to ban the burka after a senior minister described it as a ‘walking coffin’ and a ‘muzzle’.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...#ixzz0tb20K21m

still has to be ratified in september to become law but i think it will get through

[Osem]

Wonder what the human rights lawyers will make of this.

Originally Posted by Osem

Wonder what the human rights lawyers will make of this.

quite a bit of money i should think