Anger After British Man Executed In China

[Waldo Pepper]

I thought Bi-polar was a mood swing issue and not prone to an inability for working out right from wrong .

Having worked with many who have had severe mental issues including Bipolar, I won't be shedding too many tears for one who tried to smuggle smack into a country known for little tolerance for such acts to ruin more lives.

Being depressed does not mean being stupid as this guy is trying to imply.

[Peter_]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Debunked by whom, exactly?

The Chinese singularly refused to have him medically examined (even in an attempt to "debunk" any assertion that he was mentally ill).

"The Chinese authorities originally indicated a willingness to allow him to be assessed by a local doctor, but the court subsequently refused. Reprieve immediately sought permission for British psychologist Dr Schaapveld to see Akmal, and paid for him to fly to China - where he too was inexplicably refused access."

People would do well to read up a little before going off on this "he deserved it", "he wasn't mentally ill", "I support this sentence 100%" ill informed sheepish populism that is being spouted on this thread.

Read the written statements from those who knew him, who incidentally had & have nothing, whatsoever, to gain from their actions - before you spout drivel about anyone having "debunked" anything.

The only thing that has been "debunked" is the notion that Britain carries any weight whatsoever in world affairs or diplomacy.

Up till his trial no one mentioned his supposed illness and anyway he broke chinese law and was duly tried and executed for trying to take 4 kilos of heroin into their country.

He broke their law, was tried in their courts, was found guilty under their laws, he was executed under their laws.

Are we supposed to feel pity for a drug runner, I do not think so and so do many other people.

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by Moldova

Up till his trial no one mentioned his supposed illness and anyway he broke chinese law and was duly tried and executed for trying to take 4 kilos of heroin into their country.

He broke their law, was tried in their courts, was found guilty under their laws, he was executed under their laws.

Are we supposed to feel pity for a drug runner, I do not think so and so do many other people.

Again, you quite obviously didn't bother to read anything.

"The Chinese authorities originally indicated a willingness to allow him to be assessed by a local doctor, but the court subsequently refused."

Nobody is asking anyone to to feel pity for drug runners - the issue at hand is the very real possibility, based not only on the written statements referenced earlier but also on the fact that nobody else was ever identified, questioned, arrested or charged, that Mr Shaikh was duped into carrying something he knew nothing about - there is a very distinct difference.

[Peter_]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

"The Chinese authorities originally indicated a willingness to allow him to be assessed by a local doctor, but the court subsequently refused."

They have no need for him to examined under their laws at all, he was caught smuggling and was duly sentenced to die by firing squad.

Maybe if other countries did the same then we would have less drug mules either through chose or executed I do not care which.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Nobody is asking anyone to to feel pity for drug runners - the issue at hand is the very real possibility, based not only on the written statements referenced earlier but also on the fact that nobody else was ever identified, questioned, arrested or charged, that Mr Shaikh was duped into carrying something he knew nothing about - there is a very distinct difference.

He was duped into carrying a bag that was not his, this defence has been used worldwide and for once it was ignored because he chose to carry the bag with the drugs and was not forced into it.

I am sick of people trying to use excuses like that, if you are caught carrying drugs because you carried the case for the nice man, then you alone are to blame because after all the publicity over the years you are still to stupid to take any notice.

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by Moldova

They have no need for him to examined under their laws at all, he was caught smuggling and was duly sentenced to die by firing squad.

So again you didn't bother reading anything. He had a right to a full medical examination / evaluation under the terms of his right to appeal for clemency / commutation of his death sentence. The Chinese ignored requests for a medical examination - they didn't "debunk" anything.

Originally Posted by Moldova

Maybe if other countries did the same then we would have less drug mules either through chose or executed I do not care which.

Yes I agree - but only where there is no reasonable doubt as to their intent & guilt.

Originally Posted by Moldova

He was duped into carrying a bag that was not his

Yes, so it would appear - he was indeed duped.

Originally Posted by Moldova

this defence has been used worldwide and for once it was ignored because he chose to carry the bag with the drugs and was not forced into it.

Nobody, anywhere, has suggested he was "forced" to carry the case. The assertion of those who believe him to have been unjustly tried and executed is that he was mentally ill, vulnerable to exploitation and unaware of the contents of the suitcase. His mental fragility is abundantly clear from the numerous written statements from individuals who knew him personally if you would bother to read them.

Originally Posted by Moldova

I am sick of people trying to use excuses like that, if you are caught carrying drugs because you carried the case for the nice man, then you alone are to blame because after all the publicity over the years you are still to stupid to take any notice.

If only real life were as "black and white" as you'd like it. You make it sound as though mental illness is a commonly used excuse for drug trafficking when in actual fact it isnt. Naivety, stupidity and lack of common sense / regard for the law are not, in any shape or fashion, the same as mental illness being exploited for criminal ends.

[Peter_]

He carried a case full of drugs belonging to another person into a country with strict anti drug laws and did it of his own free will, he then got caught and was tried accordingly under that countries law and he was then sentenced to death and was shot.

He broke their laws and it is of no consequence what we think about the case as China stood by the countries laws and carried out his sentence.

As I have said before if this happened in other countries then maybe the would be less drugs on the street, but most of these countries chicken out and commute them to life and even after a few years send them home.

If it was widely known that you will be executed if caught smuggling drugs into these countries then maybe this would be a thing of the past.

[soicky]

Originally Posted by Moldova

He carried a case full of drugs belonging to another person into a country with strict anti drug laws and did it of his own free will, he then got caught and was tried accordingly under that countries law and he was then sentenced to death and was shot.

He broke their laws and it is of no consequence what we think about the case as China stood by the countries laws and carried out his sentence.

As I have said before if this happened in other countries then maybe the would be less drugs on the street, but most of these countries chicken out and commute them to life and even after a few years send them home.

If it was widely known that you will be executed if caught smuggling drugs into these countries then maybe this would be a thing of the past.

You still haven't taken in anything Mr Angry has said.

[idi banashapan]

sorry, Mr. Angry, but the guy was caught smuggling a large amount of a very illegal substance.

he chose to carry a package for someone else on a plane. a package which we can only assume he did not check.

the person he held it for told him they would meet him at the other end of the journey to retrieve the package, which in itself should ring alarm bells - why didn't the person take it themselves if they are going there anyway?

Bi-Polar, the disorder which is being used in connection with this mans name, does not make one stupid nor naive. if it were affecting his lifes judgement so much as to let him agree to carry a parcel in the alleged circumstances set out above, then;
1) I find it hard to believe he could have successfully organised, funded and travelled the journey by himself, or
2) he should have been accompanied by one of his friends or family, whom are now stating the believed he was suffering mental illness since around 2001.

if the latter is true, why did they apparently not seek medical help for him many years ago?

At the end of the day, he was caught carrying out an illegal process in China by the Chinese. He was sentenced there under their laws. the UK has no part to play in their laws and nor should they, as we would not expect the Chinese to have over our own laws in the UK.

in my personal view, this is simply a case of him actually getting caught. the media has had such a frenzy over it because the UK/Chinese relationship is currently strained as China is becoming wealthy and powerful and all without the 'backing' (though I feel 'consent' is a more apt term) of the western world which, obviously, the UK and US don't like as it means they cannot tell China how to run the country or how and who to trade with (ie, in US dollars).

he has been caught.
he has been executed.
the drugs are off the street is he is no longer drug running. in my view, the situation has been dealt with for the best all round outcome.
he should not have been running drugs.
he should not have been holding a parcel on a plane for the bigger boys in the playground - ESPECIALLY without checking it (which in itself is idiotic and not a result of Bi-Polar).

I personally think some praise is due to the Chinese in the handling of the situation for the fact they stuck to their guns and carried it through without being bullied by the West. unfortunately, this has led to a great propaganda story for the UK media, making out the Chinese are the baddies when in fact it was a Brit who was totally breaking the law and aiding the life-wrecking and potential death of some estimated 28 thousand heroine abusers and fuelling the continued running and pushing of a very dangerous substance. If only all countries took it as seriously as the Chinese, a lot more lives would be saved. not only those of the users, but those of their families too, who have to suffer the aftermath of dealing with drug abuse and possible death of loved ones due to it.

[Peter_]

Originally Posted by soicky

You still haven't taken in anything Mr Angry has said.

Such as what, that he was not examined to find out if he was ill, China have their laws and if they chose to carry them out as they see fit as a sovereign country who are we to interfere.

This guy was well enough to live in Poland before this and survive quite well.

He got asked to carry a bag and did it no questions asked, many people do that are we to assume that they are all ill in some way.

At 53 years of age he must have been quite aware of the stance that all countries have on drugs being smuggled into their country.

I do not feel sorry that it happened as it may stop a few other people from doing something similar.

As others have said in this thread "Live by the sword, Die by the sword"

[Taf]

I wish drug smugglers and pushers caught here could be sent to China with a few ounces of drugs in their pockets... it might prove a worthy deterrent.

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by Moldova

He carried a case full of drugs belonging to another person into a country with strict anti drug laws and did it of his own free will, he then got caught and was tried accordingly under that countries law and he was then sentenced to death and was shot.

Your inability to take on board even the most fundamental elements of this particular case speaks volumes -Mr Shaikh was executed by lethal injection, he was not shot.

Yes, he was caught with drugs - I am not denying that - I'm merely saying that given his personal circumstances he was not afforded a fair trial in conjunction with international legal obligations which China, despite having it's own laws, has subscribed to.

It would appear that those who use the "It's their law", "live by the sword, die by the sword" arguments feel that a fair trial, especially when execution is an option, is too much to ask for in this day and age.

[SMG]

Originally Posted by Taf

I wish drug smugglers and pushers caught here could be sent to China with a few ounces of drugs in their pockets... it might prove a worthy deterrent.

Rock on.


A little more info on this case.

http://newsforums.bbc.co.uk/nol/thre...20100102165356

It does ask the question, "Why was there no medical evidence"not even a doctors note, to suggest he was suffering from any mental disease. I suspect the Chinese dismissed his claims as the last pleadings of a condemned man. It seems only his family suggested he suffered from a mental illness.

[Peter_]

They should execute more and maybe it will stop drug mules or maybe it will not.

To be honest I do not care how he was executed as they should do it more often.

Quite frankly i dont believe you

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Moldova

They have no need for him to examined under their laws at all, he was caught smuggling and was duly sentenced to die by firing squad.

He was executed by lethal injection, quite an important fact if you are trying to present details of the case as fact...

Originally Posted by Bender
Bi-Polar, the disorder which is being used in connection with this mans name.

There is a very good chance that he had schizophrenia to. The more I hear about this case the worse it gets...