Thank you, Tony Blair - Page 2

Sirius · 12-12-2009, 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBKing

Vince Cable for PM, I say.

BBKing

Cracking joke

TheNorm · 12-12-2009, 20:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBKing

'Mankind' being defined as 'BP shareholders'?

Close...

Quote:

Shell and Petronas win rights to develop vast Iraq oilfield

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...-auction-shell

---------- Post added at 19:47 ---------- Previous post was at 19:42 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBKing

And replaced by someone who didn't vote for the invasion of Iraq? ...

Yes, but... maybe they didn't think the PM was telling porkies about WMD.

frogstamper · 13-12-2009, 05:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBKing

And replaced by someone who didn't vote for the invasion of Iraq? That rules out:

David Cameron (Leader of the Opposition)
George Osborne (Shadow Chancellor)
Dominic Grieve (Shadow Home Secretary)
William Hague (Shadow Foreign Secretary) *
Liam Fox (Shadow Defence Secretary, and if anything a harder neo-con than Blair ever was) **

[plus most (all?) of the Opposition Front Bench]

Vince Cable for PM, I say.

http://www.holdthemtoaccount.com/who-voted-for-the-war/

* "The Prime Minister has put before the House the right decision. He deserves the support of honourable members in all parts of the House."

** "When we believe something is the right thing to do, as we did in the case of Iraq, we give the Government our full support"

And if I remember correctly Duncan Smith was as much a cheerleader for the war as any Labour minister, apart from the 100 Labour MP's who rebelled and voted against the war there was only a handful of Tories who followed suit.
Having said that I blame the Labour yes men as weak and the Tory yes men as voting in favour mainly to preserve the ridiculous "special relationship". Neither of our two main parties come out of this well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rizzy

only one had the courage of her convictions and resigned and while i don't have a lot of time for clair short on that at least she has some respect from me.

She only resigned when it eventually suited her, if you remember he talked her out of it initially.
The only real moral Labour front bencher was the late Robin Cook, I defy anybody to claim otherwise. IMO he was one of a very small number to come out of the entire fiasco with any credibility.

13-12-2009, 14:51

I wondered how long it would be before someone mentioned the tory's voting for it but if you cast your mind back they were also lied too about the wmd's and stupidly thought like many of us there was something concrete backing that up who knew it was a complete load of made up rubbish. Labour lied, labour took us into iraq knowing they were lying and labour are the one's who should pay for it and not just tony blair much as i loathe the man but all the senior figures that knew it was a lie and that still includes a few senior labour people now.

But please don't allow any facts to prevent some tory bashing i know how some love it so much

.

injuneer · 14-12-2009, 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBKing

Vince Cable for PM, I say.

Quite agree. He's the only one that talks any sense about the economy & would make an excellent chancellor. But inevitably we'll vote in the Tories for another few years of torture. We love 2 party politics.

Tezcatlipoca · 14-12-2009, 16:32

" 'Sycophant' Tony Blair used deceit to justify Iraq war, says former DPP "

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Grauniad

Sir Ken Macdonald, director of public prosecutions between 2003 and 2008, says Blair misled and cajoled the British people into a war they didn't want

Andrew Sparrow, senior political correspondent
guardian.co.uk, Monday 14 December 2009 09.22 GMT

Tony Blair used "deceit" to persuade parliament and the British people to support war in Iraq, Sir Ken Macdonald, the former director of public prosecutions, said today.

In an article in the Times, Macdonald attacked Blair for engaging in "alarming subterfuge", for displaying "sycophancy" towards George Bush and for refusing to accept that his decisions were wrong.

Macdonald's comments about Blair's decision to go to war are more critical than anything that has been said so far by any of the senior civil servants who worked in Whitehall when Blair was prime minister.

Macdonald was DPP from 2003 until 2008 and he now practises law from Matrix Chambers, where Blair's barrister wife, Cherie, is also based.

In his article Macdonald highlighted a remark Blair made in an interview broadcast yesterday about supporting the overthrow of Saddam Hussein regardless of whether Iraq had weapons of mass destruction to explain why he thought the former prime minister was guilty of deceit.

(snip)

Welshchris · 14-12-2009, 17:00

Bring back Maggie thatcher, she will sort the government out lol

Swinging her handbag in the house of commons will soon get everyone in shape!

**Hugh** · 14-12-2009, 17:03

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooo!

(and I'm a Tory)

papa smurf · 14-12-2009, 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooo!

(and I'm a Tory)

lapsed ?
or liberal leftie tory ?
bet you wouldn't dare say no to her thaterships face

**Hugh** · 14-12-2009, 20:47

TRG wet (economically sound, philosophically liberal (not libertarian), personal liberties liberal) Tory - and I had lunch with Her Madgesty 3 times..........

frogstamper · 16-12-2009, 05:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

I wondered how long it would be before someone mentioned the tory's voting for it but if you cast your mind back they were also lied too about the wmd's and stupidly thought like many of us there was something concrete backing that up who knew it was a complete load of made up rubbish. Labour lied, labour took us into iraq knowing they were lying and labour are the one's who should pay for it and not just tony blair much as i loathe the man but all the senior figures that knew it was a lie and that still includes a few senior labour people now.

But please don't allow any facts to prevent some tory bashing i know how some love it so much

.

Come on Rizzy the poor old Tories are not that dumb

, while I've no doubt at all Blair over sold the entire case for war, IDS was privy to and saw intelligent files concerning Saddam's supposed WMD.
He was as eager as Blair was for the war, I'm not in anyway shifting blame from the Labour front-bench for their glorifying the case for war, but to say the Tories were misled on mass is fantasy.

16-12-2009, 16:52

Froggie it wasn't hard to sell the wmd thing as the fact is both the UK and the US supplied saddam with the parts to make them so he did have them it is just a question of where they went. As for what files others then the labour high ranking saw we will never know as i know from my experience such files get changed depending on who is reading them in terms of what is left in and what is left out so what ids might or might not have read is open to question. Remember also that it was part of the old ideology of parliament that no pm would ever out and out lie in the house of commons on something as serious as this and thus would have got and did get a lot of passive support. I don't believe the torys were fully convinced by the evidence because so many weren't but convinced enough to vote for the action yes quite possibly.

TheNorm · 19-12-2009, 13:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

.... Remember also that it was part of the old ideology of parliament that no pm would ever out and out lie in the house of commons on something as serious as this and thus would have got and did get a lot of passive support. ....

Agreed. If the PM says he is convinced the guy has WMD, and no he can't reveal the source as it would compromise security, you can't blame MPs for voting "aye".

19-12-2009, 13:31

The war imo made Saddam a martyr they should have done him in the first war( not to me of course)

IMO Blair and Bush are war criminals and should be bought up on charges as such . There were never WMDs it was all a lie and that was unforgivable

19-12-2009, 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by zing

The war imo made Saddam a martyr they should have done him in the first war

The bottom line with Gulf 1, and the coalition forces not going on and kicking Saddam out of power, was that George Bush Snr. knew that the Arab Nations would not go along with that action. The UN resolutions that allowed the coalition military actions where only to kick the Iraqis back over the boarder and out of Kuwait. Anything beyond that would have been a breech of the UN resolution....