First £1,000 rail fare criticised

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8340561.stm

The UK's first £1,000 rail ticket has been described as "scandalous" and "appalling value" by opposition MPs.
The first-class return walk-up fare is from Newquay, in Cornwall to Kyle of Lochalsh, in the Scottish Highlands.

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Wow!

[papa smurf]

you could buy a car fill it with fuel drive there and back and still have the car at the end of the journey for £1,000

its a joke

[DocDutch]

well it is 1st class....and buying a car that would give you 1st class service isnt that cheap...but still thats 1 massive bill that I would never pay for. especially on First which most of the time is crap trains anyway

It amazes me that I can at certain times of the year fly to Newcastle cheaper than taking the train.

[Tony.]

Originally Posted by DocDutch

well it is 1st class....and buying a car that would give you 1st class service isnt that cheap...but still thats 1 massive bill that I would never pay for. especially on First which most of the time is crap trains anyway

Just because the ticket is First Class doesn't mean you get to travel First Class

Mr Doe pointed out that on the first leg of the journey (Newquay to Par) and the last (Inverness to Kyle of Lochalsh) there were not even any first-class carriages for the ticketholder to sit in

On the Cambridge to London trains 'first class' means a carriage where the commoners are not allowed to sit. They also have paper on them that says 'first class'. Stupid.

[frogstamper]

Originally Posted by Damien

On the Cambridge to London trains 'first class' means a carriage where the commoners are not allowed to sit. They also have paper on them that says 'first class'. Stupid.

Its similar on the Brighton to London line, in that "1st class" seats are exactly the same as 2nd, the only advantage of traveling 1st is that you get a guaranteed seat...at only twice the standard fare.

[BBKing]

I'm always slightly annoyed by this kind of story, mainly because they never understand the issues correctly - prices are high because the train company doesn't want you to buy this ticket, they want you to buy an advanced ticket valid only on a certain train, which allows them to use yield management software to maximise occupancy and revenue per seat. This is exactly what airlines do, of course - the idea came directly from airlines and the first people to use it were the French with the TGV, which was designed to compete and win against airlines, which it did. Try rocking up an hour before departure at Heathrow and see what the prices are like - a few years ago a mate and myself flew to Shannon on Aer Lingus - I booked early enough to get a reasonably cheap (sub-£100) economy ticket, he got back from working abroad and had to take the cheapest one available, which was a £400 First Class one.

What's been lost is the freedom to turn up when you want and get the next train for a reasonable price, which I used to do all the time. This probably explains why I only ever get the train within London, on business or on Chiltern to Birmingham, which has direct competition resulting in lower fares, for a slightly longer journey. If there was more competition fares would be lower elsewhere, but there's no real prospect of that on most lines.

[Charlie_Bubble]

Originally Posted by BBKing

I'm always slightly annoyed by this kind of story, mainly because they never understand the issues correctly - prices are high because the train company doesn't want you to buy this ticket, they want you to buy an advanced ticket valid only on a certain train, which allows them to use yield management software to maximise occupancy and revenue per seat. This is exactly what airlines do, of course - the idea came directly from airlines and the first people to use it were the French with the TGV, which was designed to compete and win against airlines, which it did. Try rocking up an hour before departure at Heathrow and see what the prices are like - a few years ago a mate and myself flew to Shannon on Aer Lingus - I booked early enough to get a reasonably cheap (sub-£100) economy ticket, he got back from working abroad and had to take the cheapest one available, which was a £400 First Class one.

What's been lost is the freedom to turn up when you want and get the next train for a reasonable price, which I used to do all the time. This probably explains why I only ever get the train within London, on business or on Chiltern to Birmingham, which has direct competition resulting in lower fares, for a slightly longer journey. If there was more competition fares would be lower elsewhere, but there's no real prospect of that on most lines.

...and is why I never bother with the train any more as I don't like to plan my trips out 1 month in advance!

[BBKing]

...and is why I never bother with the train any more as I don't like to plan my trips out 1 month in advance!

Quite - they're good for a) the very rich (or those on expenses) or b) the very well organised. Being neither, it's a bit frustrating, really. Where there *is* competion, on the other hand, it can be quite good, look at Grand Central's prices for turn-up-and-go at Kings Cross on the East Coast (there just aren't that many trains). First Class off-peak return to Sunderland's only £101, for instance, although on the downside you end up in Sunderland. Doesn't seem to offer wifi yet, though, which many of the big operators are introducing.

First Class on a proper train will knock any airline into a cocked hat, by the way. One of the nice things about going skiing by train is that you can sit in the pub at St. Pancras watching them prepare your train, then stroll downstairs, buy a crate of lager, some gin and tonic, mooch through security and customs into the departure lounge, wander upstairs to the train, shove your skis and boards into a compartment in the middle, settle down, get the cards out and crack open a beer, all in about half an hour. That's civilised travelling. I suspect trying the same thing on Ryanair would result in the police being called.

http://www.grandcentralrail.co.uk/

[Pauls9]

The last part of the trip is worth trying...

A two-car train rattling along at 20 mph through lovely scenery, sometimes pausing for request stops. Make sure you get a seat on the north side otherwise your view will be spoiled by tourists.

[Kymmy]

Well in this case it's 4 times the cheapest fair. Did a little test of trainline.com and found the following

[Ravenheart]

And if you split the ticketing it can be miles cheaper. But of course the privatised railway companies won't tell you that.

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/tra...-train-tickets

When I did my fundraiser recently, all of the train companies kindly upgraded me to First Class. Usually the First class has a little more leg room, free refreshments, and they chuck in a free newspaper.

On the leg from Inverness back to Edinburgh, these are short (usually 2-3 carriages) units and the first class is identical to standard class (if it has any 1st at all) and just has a glass door diving the two.

1st Class on Cross Country Trains (voyager) http://www.flickr.com/photos/joannec...7622322073530/

1st Class on First Great Western (refurbished Inter City 125 dating back to the 70's) http://www.flickr.com/photos/joannec...7622322073530/

The fares these days are crazy though, and far more expensive than our European neighbours, but there was a serious lack of investment in the rail network since the electrification of the west coast main line in the 60's.

[BBKing]

but there was a serious lack of investment in the rail network since the electrification of the west coast main line in the 60's.

Often said, but it's not actually true - the most miles electrified per annum were under Thatcher, of all people. By the early 90s BR was a pretty efficient organisation with a lot of new trains and recent electrifications under its belt and had just modernised itself into an efficient business-led structure. Privatisation blew that apart, and it now takes a lot more subsidy - the fare increases (or at least the urge to maximise revenue that leads to unregulated fares skyrocketing) are partly to reduce the subsidy requirement by paying franchise premiums back to the Treasury and partly to satisfy shareholders.

This isn't to say there hasn't been investment, but it's been patchy and, under Railtrack, often extremely badly handled. It's taken Network Rail several years and a huge amount of cash to attempt to straighten out things like signalling procurement, which was in a total mess. Unfortunately, on any network, you can't just fix the mess by fixing the process, you also have a backlog of work to do which has knock on effects on what you can do in the future. The big issue now is capacity, fixing which costs a lot of money - I foresee a future Tory Government given a choice between expensive capacity improvements and pricing people off the trains and going for b) every time.

Originally Posted by BBKing

I foresee a future Tory Government given a choice between expensive capacity improvements and pricing people off the trains and going for b) every time.

Whilst taxing car owners to the hilt at every opportunity.