Small connection issue

[Stuart_]

Hey there.

I live in a remote place called Harlosh in Scotland, and getting broadband here is pretty hard to come by, but I have Virgin Media Cable so at least its something.

The problem is, when we first got the broadband, I could play the PS3 online (CoD4) and I could watch YouTube videos without them taking ages to load. But now, its the complete opposite.

I phoned Virgin and they said the best connection I can get is 0.5mb/s and I appreciate what they are saying, but there has been a massive drop in my connection (whether it be bandwidth or something else) and I'm not sure what it is.

To give you a rough idea, here is an example:
Lets say a YouTube video is 3 minutes long; it would take about 7 minutes to buffer when before I could watch it and it would buffer just fast enough for me to watch all of it. (I know about how the bit-rate of the video, HD and everything effects the loading time, but I'm talking about the exact same crappy video taking way longer than usual)

Oh and if you're wondering, I have tried other video websites such as Dailymotion and Metacafe and the results are all the same; slow slow slow.

Speed Test results: - http://www.speedtest.net/
Download: 0.49 mb/s
Upload: 0.35 mb/s

Ping Test results: - http://www.pingtest.net/
Packets Lost: All.
Ping: 57 ms
Jitter: 2 ms

So I was just wondering if someone could help to get my connection back on track because I really want to play CoD4 again and for CoD6 coming out in November 10th (whoop whoop!). It may be my router, but I'm pretty sure there is no way to tell unless I got a new one, right?

Thanks for any help.

[RobboEdin]

Are you sure that you are actually on Virgin Media CABLE broadband and not the Virgin National product supplied down an ordinary BT phone line?

What do you get for the Host name from the following address?

http://cableforum.co.uk/board/misc.php?do=connection

Please exclude the first part of the address which will probably be an IP address.

Something like the following:

nn-nnn-nnn-nnn.cable.ubr04.livi.blueyonder.co.uk

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by RobboEdin

Are you sure that you are actually on Virgin Media CABLE broadband and not the Virgin National product supplied down an ordinary BT phone line?

What do you get for the Host name from the following address?

http://cableforum.co.uk/board/misc.php?do=connection

Please exclude the first part of the address which will probably be an IP address.

Something like the following:

nn-nnn-nnn-nnn.cable.ubr04.livi.blueyonder.co.uk

No, I'm not 100% but they did say it was Cable because it's the only thing we can get here in Harlosh and yes, it is probably being supplied down an original BT phone line.

Host: client-ip-ip-ip-ip.leed.adsl.virginmedia.com *

*ip being my actual IP number, so I didn't want to show it.

[RobboEdin]

The adsl in this address shows that you are not on CABLE (which was always very doubtful due to your remoteness) but your broadband is the normal down-the-bt-line broadband, supplied by Virgin Media.

Try putting your postcode or telephone number into the following webpage and see what speed BT say you should get.

http://www.productsandservices.bt.co...erview_BB_home

Given your remoteness, it would not surprise me that what you have been told by Virgin Media and seen in your own speedtest results is true - a broadband download speed of 0.5Mb.

Your issue with the applications you mention may then be down to increased contention on your very remote line because some of your very few neighbours now have broadband whereas before they didn't.

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by RobboEdin

The adsl in this address shows that you are not on CABLE (which was always very doubtful due to your remoteness) but your broadband is the normal down-the-bt-line broadband, supplied by Virgin Media.

Try putting your postcode or telephone number into the following webpage and see what speed BT say you should get.

http://www.productsandservices.bt.co...erview_BB_home

Given your remoteness, it would not surprise me that what you have been told by Virgin Media and seen in your own speedtest results is true - a broadband download speed of 0.5Mb.

Your issue with the applications you mention may then be down to increased contention on your very remote line because some of your very few neighbours now have broadband whereas before they didn't.

I understand what you're saying about the line usage has probably created the poor speeds, but it cannot be that. I know all my neighbors, and we have all had broadband for the same time. I remember the days of dial-up and we all got broadband at the same time, and a few others afterward, but not longer than a few months.

I live 5 miles away from the exchange, and there is roughly 40 people in Harlosh.

The BT confirms that we can only have 0.5 Mb/s at this time, and I already knew that because VirginMedia told me that when I phoned them.

I'm not convinced, at all, that its due to more people connecting to the line because there has been one new person move to Harlosh in the last 5 or so years, and more people have actually moved away/died.

Here is my result from the BT line-checker:
"We have tested your line and can confirm your line supports the UK's most complete broadband package, BT Total Broadband. We estimate your maximum connection speed to be 0.256Mbps, which is the fastest speed your line can currently support."

How can my connection go from decent (for where I life) to absolutely terrible? For no apparent reason.

[Kymmy]

The speed will be purely due to the distance from the exchange. Line attenuation on 5 miles is quite severe..

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

The speed will be purely due to the distance from the exchange. Line attenuation on 5 miles is quite severe..

Please, I would appreciate if you read what I have written. I know what you're saying.

My connection was fine, it was totally fine 5 or so months ago. I could play CoD4 on PS3 without any issues (now, I can log in once out of 20 attempts and the lag makes it unplayable.) and I could play YouTube videos and watch movies online (but now, I cannot do either. I have noticed a massive drop, its not like its unnoticeable).

[RobboEdin]

Although you say that the same number of residents of your small area are using broadband as previously, you need to understand that all broadband users everywhere are using more and more of the resource all the time.

You simply have to look at webpages which you may browse. They are starting to have more and more adverts on each page and those adverts are more sophisticated and use up more and more of your bandwidth.

You can be sure that the newer version of the program you want to use will be more resource-intensive and use more of your available bandwidth.

I'm afraid that you are between a rock and a hard place. You have to trade your tranquill location against a very poor broadband service.

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by RobboEdin

Although you say that the same number of residents of your small area are using broadband as previously, you need to understand that all broadband users everywhere are using more and more of the resource all the time.

You simply have to look at webpages which you may browse. They are starting to have more and more adverts on each page and those adverts are more sophisticated and use up more and more of your bandwidth.

You can be sure that the newer version of the program you want to use will be more resource-intensive and use more of your available bandwidth.

I'm afraid that you are between a rock and a hard place. You have to trade your tranquill location against a very poor broadband service.

This why (in my first post) I was wondering if the problem lies with bandwidth allocation.

Is there something I can do to test it, for it being too high (ha ha) or too low? Or something else?

And, it's not like it was gradual the change of connection; it was instantly, over night. It went from fine to really poor.

[RobboEdin]

Originally Posted by Stuart_

This why (in my first post) I was wondering the problem lies with bandwidth allocation.

Is there something I can do to test it, for it being too high (ha ha) or too low? Or something else?

I think what you are failing to understand is that you and your fellow remote residents share a fixed bandwidth which you are each using more of. There is currently no more for you to use until BT get round to giving you some more.

You have used up your limited resource. Things won't get any better. They will only get worse as the applications you are using become more resource-intensive.

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by RobboEdin

I think what you are failing to understand is that you and your fellow remote residents share a fixed bandwidth which you are each using more of. There is currently no more for you to use until BT get round to giving you some more.

You have used up your limited resource. Things won't get any better. They will only get worse as the applications you are using become more resource-intensive.

I do understand that, I fully understand that.

Either way, that is amazingly crappy. I think our line is getting updating in 2011 so not too long I guess.

Well thanks for all the information and help, much appreciated. I'm going to give Virgin Media a phone and ask them about my bandwidth allocation.

[Sephiroth]

Try this link to see if you have alternatives.

http://www.farina1.com/adsl/

I can't vouch for the results but you might be able to see where I'm going. I don't know if Virgin National use ADSL2+ and there's no consensus about whether or not ADSL2+ can improve reliability or speed. It all depends on attenuation and SNR. You'll need to winkle these numbers out of your router by logging onto the router and reading out from the status screen. We'd like to see those figures here, too.

As to what may have changed - it's a complex set of possibilities. I'll try and explain. The key word is CONTENTION. I'll assume for added "simplicity" that your VM service has bought BT capacity wholesale and haven't installed any infrastructure from your local exchange.

1/
You have an individual line to the exchange. You don't share anything with anyone else at this point.

2/
At the exchange up to 50 lines converge into a box where the signal is converted for use across the network and is then piped at 4 Mbps to a router. If you have 40 houses in Harlosh and 20 of them are bashing away at ½ Mbps, there is already contention and oversubscription on the available 4 Mbps.

3/
At your exchange either more villages come in to separate boxes as in (2) above and everything is then put into the network cloud (ATM) at 155 Mbps or if yours is a purely local exchange it goes to a larger exchange at 30 Mbps where it is concentrated onto the 155 Mbps pipe.

4/
Referring to (3) above, you'd really need to know what's at Harlosh exchange. How many villages (each one narrowed into the 4 Mbps pipe) are contending for the 30 Mbps pipe to the larger exchange. (Or the 155 Mbps pipe from Harlosh if it's a larger exchange, or how many smaller exchanges focus on a larger exchange and then feed 155 Mbps).

5/
The 155 Mbps pipe goes into the BT network cloud, routed to a PoP (Point of Presence). I don't know the basis for this routing - whether or not there is some algorithm to allow load balancing across the POPs (there are at least 11 BT PoPs in the cloud). Anyway, when you are routed at logon to a PoP, you reach a RAS (Remote Access Server handling thousands of connexions from hundreds of exchanges = contention) which authenticates you and assigns an IP address and during your session you are subsequently passed through to BT's Internet Backbone running at GigaBit rates. Since you don't know what anyone else is trying to do on the internet, there is more contention for you to consider.

6/
From BT's backbone, you go to a Gateway. Here the ISPs (like VM) lease a pipe of 155 Mbps or 622 Mbps depending on what they want to pay BT. Another point of traffic contention. Is VM 155 or 622? Have VM suddenly brought on a number of new subscribers from a number of additional exchanges? That adds to a change in contention you experience.

7/
So you've reached VM via the Gateway. Who knows what goes on in there and on the web?

8/
Oh - by the way, upstream capacity is about 50% of downstream. So there's delay and contention there to consider.

So - you see anything could have, and probably did, change pretty well overnight. And that's assuming you haven't changed any network card settings.

Finally, unless I missed something in your earlier posts, did you askyour neighbours what's happening to them?

Whew. End of massive!

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Try this link to see if you have alternatives.

http://www.farina1.com/adsl/

I can't vouch for the results but you might be able to see where I'm going. I don't know if Virgin National use ADSL2+ and there's no consensus about whether or not ADSL2+ can improve reliability or speed. It all depends on attenuation and SNR. You'll need to winkle these numbers out of your router by logging onto the router and reading out from the status screen. We'd like to see those figures here, too.

As to what may have changed - it's a complex set of possibilities. I'll try and explain. The key word is CONTENTION. I'll assume for added "simplicity" that your VM service has bought BT capacity wholesale and haven't installed any infrastructure from your local exchange.

1/
You have an individual line to the exchange. You don't share anything with anyone else at this point.

2/
At the exchange up to 50 lines converge into a box where the signal is converted for use across the network and is then piped at 4 Mbps to a router. If you have 40 houses in Harlosh and 20 of them are bashing away at ½ Mbps, there is already contention and oversubscription on the available 4 Mbps.

3/
At your exchange either more villages come in to separate boxes as in (2) above and everything is then put into the network cloud (ATM) at 155 Mbps or if yours is a purely local exchange it goes to a larger exchange at 30 Mbps where it is concentrated onto the 155 Mbps pipe.

4/
Referring to (3) above, you'd really need to know what's at Harlosh exchange. How many villages (each one narrowed into the 4 Mbps pipe) are contending for the 30 Mbps pipe to the larger exchange. (Or the 155 Mbps pipe from Harlosh if it's a larger exchange, or how many smaller exchanges focus on a larger exchange and then feed 155 Mbps).

5/
The 155 Mbps pipe goes into the BT network cloud, routed to a PoP (Point of Presence). I don't know the basis for this routing - whether or not there is some algorithm to allow load balancing across the POPs (there are at least 11 BT PoPs in the cloud). Anyway, when you are routed at logon to a PoP, you reach a RAS (Remote Access Server handling thousands of connexions from hundreds of exchanges = contention) which authenticates you and assigns an IP address and during your session you are subsequently passed through to BT's Internet Backbone running at GigaBit rates. Since you don't know what anyone else is trying to do on the internet, there is more contention for you to consider.

6/
From BT's backbone, you go to a Gateway. Here the ISPs (like VM) lease a pipe of 155 Mbps or 622 Mbps depending on what they want to pay BT. Another point of traffic contention. Is VM 155 or 622? Have VM suddenly brought on a number of new subscribers from a number of additional exchanges? That adds to a change in contention you experience.

7/
So you've reached VM via the Gateway. Who knows what goes on in there and on the web?

8/
Oh - by the way, upstream capacity is about 50% of downstream. So there's delay and contention there to consider.

So - you see anything could have, and probably did, change pretty well overnight. And that's assuming you haven't changed any network card settings.

Finally, unless I missed something in your earlier posts, did you askyour neighbours what's happening to them?

Whew. End of massive!

Well first off, thank you for even taking the time to write all of that! It really is massive! Very informative though, thank you.

As for my neighbors, I asked one of them tonight actually and guess what? They done a speed test on http://www.speedtest.net and came back with these results:
Download: 1.81 mb/s
Upload: 0.33 mb/s

Now tell me this; how can she (her name is Sarah) get a better connection than me, and she actually lives further away from the exchange than I do.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Stuart_

Well first off, thank you for even taking the time to write all of that! It really is massive! Very informative though, thank you.

As for my neighbors, I asked one of them tonight actually and guess what? They done a speed test on http://www.speedtest.net and came back with these results:
Download: 1.81 mb/s
Upload: 0.33 mb/s

Now tell me this; how can she (her name is Sarah) get a better connection that me, and she actually lives further away from the exchange than I do.

Because speedtest.net is crap. I use http://www.broadbandspeedchecker.co.uk/ for quick tests.

[Stuart_]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Because speedtest.net is crap. I use http://www.broadbandspeedchecker.co.uk/ for quick tests.

It is not crap, it is the actual speed test website VirginMedia told me to use. But, because I'm a nice guy, and to make you happy I shall use that website and make my friend Sarah do that test as well.

Speed Test results: - http://www.broadbandspeedchecker.co.uk/
Download: 480 Kbps
Upload: 337 Kbps