Scores die in Israeli air strikes

While i think Israel has a lot of things to answer for this isn't one of them for those bashing the israelis exactly how many rockets would you tolerate being fired at you before you did something and what else is it that you would do ????. This needs a diplomatic solution and sooner rather then later but there has to be give on both sides now the US can make that happen a little with Israel but who will do it with hamas.

If your going to fire rockets across a border you have to know eventually retaliation is going to come and i can't help feeling that these headlines of civilian losses are exactly what hamas hoped for rather then anyone asking too many difficult questions of them. What would be helpful in the discussion of this is if some people speak with facts to back them up rather then a slanted personal agenda as seems to be happening.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by frogstamper

Also general elections are due soon in Israel, so I imagine any future leader wants to come across as tough, but what worries me is that the Israeli's are now more likely to vote in the hard liners from Likud.

Ironically, the only way peace will be acheived is with the right wingers in power in Israel.
Take when Sharon (will they please just let the man die?) was in charge, he had the support of the right wingers, and the left wingers in striving for peace, hence the withdrawls from Gaza (of course the demolition of Israeli houses in Gaza was slammed by those who couldn't understand why it had to happen).
The left cannot gain enough of a majority to be able to take on any right wing opposition.

If you look at the steps given towards peace, Israel has always been the one to give, and give, and rarely gets peace in return.

[SMG]

Theres a hell of a lot of history for the Jews, they have been persecuted for donkeys years, killed by the million, & regarded as animals. Its no wonder they hit back.

Launching a rocket & killing people indiscriminately is one certain way of asking for a smack in the mouth. The Israelis overreacted, yes, & its understandable. They must be so sick & tired of being killed, its a wonder they dont retaliate a lot more.

If the US & UK are responsible for anything, its preventing Israel from taking this conflict to the next level. Israel has all the firepower it needs to settle this, or any other conflict. But keeping pushing, & threatening them will only bring that conclusion closer.

[chaos23]

Why do you people hate the Arab so much? It is the Israelis who wiped Palestine of the map, not the other way around.

[Sir John Luke]

Just read through this thread from the beginning looking for the evidence of hatred of Arabs. Must have been expunged by the Illuminati.

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by Sir John Luke

Just read through this thread from the beginning looking for the evidence of hatred of Arabs. Must have been expunged by the Illuminati.

The hate is everwhere, look on this page you will see it. It is unjustified, Israel is the aggressor so why support them?

[Julian]

Originally Posted by chaos23

The hate is everwhere, look on this page you will see it. It is unjustified, Israel is the aggressor so why support them?

I wouldn't feed the troll if I were you

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by chaos23

The hate is everwhere, look on this page you will see it. It is unjustified, Israel is the aggressor so why support them?

Hmm, considering I grew up in Saudi Arabia, and have strong ties to the middle east, hate the arabs? Pull the other one!

What I do have though is a greater understanding of the history and politics of the area than you appear to have. It is not as black and white as you seem to believe. There are many shades of grey, with humanitarian action from both sides working towards peace in the midst of a warzone, with one side at least predominantly attacking non-civilian targets.
While Fatah embessled international aid, building it's leaders $1million mansions and leaving the people it was supposed to support to starve (much like the arab nations have done) in order to keep them repressed and use Israel as a scapegoat, it has been left to international charity organisations to get aid to them, including Israeli charities (one of which I had the honour to work with).

In 1948, for instance, it was Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Iraq who invaded and attacked, Israel didn't attack them to start the conflict.
In 1967 Egypt was the agressor and paid the price.

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Hmm, considering I grew up in Saudi Arabia, and have strong ties to the middle east, hate the arabs? Pull the other one!

What I do have though is a greater understanding of the history and politics of the area than you appear to have.

In 1948, for instance, it was Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Iraq who invaded and attacked, Israel didn't attack them to start the conflict.
In 1967 Egypt was the agressor and paid the price.

You like to think you have a greater understanding, when all you are doing, is twisting things to suit your version. No sane mind could believe that Israel is the victim. The Israelis are treating the Palestiniens just as the Nazis treated the Jews in Europe. They are no better. If you were brought up in Saudi Arabia,you should be ashamed of your blatent disregard for the Palestinien people.

---------- Post added at 12:26 ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 ----------

Originally Posted by Taf

Israel says "Stop firing rockets at civilians or we retaliate".

Hamas fires more missiles, hiding amongst a civilian population.

Israel retaliates.

If Israel wants an end to rocket attacks then should they not consider an end to the occupation of the Air Space and territorial seas in and around Gaza? Those areas do not belong to the Israeli Government.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by chaos23

You like to think you have a greater understanding, when all you are doing, is twisting things to suit your version. No sane mind could believe that Israel is the victim. The Israelis are treating the Palestiniens just as the Nazis treated the Jews in Europe. They are no better. If you were brought up in Saudi Arabia,you should be ashamed of your blatent disregard for the Palestinien people.

I think you should read my post again now.

As for twisting things, have you ever actually been to Israel or the West Bank?
Do you actually realise what you're saying with regards to the Nazis?
Do you really not know what happened to the Jews in Europe? Does the word Shoah mean nothing to you?
Have you no knowledge of the refugee camps under Egyptian and Jordanian control? How terrible the conditions were? How much distain they treated their Arab brothers?
While Israel welcomed persecuted jews from around the globe, Egypt and Jordan treated their fellow arabs like pigs.

Xaccer's i think you've had too much tipple this xmas if you think you can introduce facts on this to certain posters who no matter what you say will continue with their view so save yourself some time and effort now m8 and give it up. I notice the Israel bashers have not answered my points yet about how many rockets they would tolerate or how else they would have responded and funnily enough i wasn't expecting a response of any substance as that would require some thought rather then some good ol Israel bashing.

Originally Posted by Xaccers

I think you should read my post again now.

As for twisting things, have you ever actually been to Israel or the West Bank?
Do you actually realise what you're saying with regards to the Nazis?
Do you really not know what happened to the Jews in Europe? Does the word Shoah mean nothing to you?
Have you no knowledge of the refugee camps under Egyptian and Jordanian control? How terrible the conditions were? How much distain they treated their Arab brothers?
While Israel welcomed persecuted jews from around the globe, Egypt and Jordan treated their fellow arabs like pigs.

Xaccers, remember the old saying -

Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Also, this link has a lot of truth in it (imho).

[Xaccers]

Very true guys, what was I thinking?

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

Xaccers, remember the old saying -

Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Also, this link has a lot of truth in it (imho).

Its nothin to do with making you angry, it do with countering your atrocious claims. You are the idiot Foreverwar, you are also a wannbee bully. Your love for all things Israel is clear. There is no point trying to reason with someone who has been indoctrinated.

[Sir John Luke]

Originally Posted by chaos23

Why do you people hate the Arab so much? It is the Israelis who wiped Palestine of the map, not the other way around.

Which map would that be?