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VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?
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Old 14-08-2008, 00:56   #1
dslam
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VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Hi All,

Does anyone have a detailed written explanation about how the Virgin Media Network is built?

On the surface it seems pretty simple, coax to the house (simplistic view lol!), but what people dont realise is theres a lot more to it (I bet there sure is!)

What im looking for is any info on how it all fits together:

Anyone have any diagrams?

What kind of headend kit do they use?
Are they still delivering Analogue AND Digital down to customers houses?
Is there a central "feed" to all headends for channels coming from say Sky (non regional channels)
Is there a local feed from Local stations to your local headend?
How do they obtain the SKY and Terrestrial Channels from? ie dish or fibre?
Do they fibre the headend output to ALL local street cabs or just some?
What speed is their green cab fibre network? STM-1 / STM-4 / STM-16 ?
Are all green cabs the same or are some 'master' ones?
How many households can a green cab supply before its "overloaded"
Is there a distance limit on the length of coax from the Green Box?
How do they get the right signal levels in everyones house ie near and far houses?
What frequency range are we talking about in a cable network?

Ok i'll stop there!!! All valid questions though! Sorry but I just like knowing how stuff works so any information greatly appreciated
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Old 14-08-2008, 08:06   #2
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

The physical design of the network varies regionally. (or franchise to franchise)


What kind of headend kit do they use?
Dunno

Are they still delivering Analogue AND Digital down to customers houses?
You can subscribe to analogue but its gonna be turned off soon.

Is there a central "feed" to all headends for channels coming from say Sky (non regional channels)
dunno

Is there a local feed from Local stations to your local headend?
these are tough questions

How do they obtain the SKY and Terrestrial Channels from? ie dish or fibre?
At a guess Its from large dishes at the head end.

Do they fibre the headend output to ALL local street cabs or just some?
The network is designed as a fibre loop, so if there is a break the services can be supplied from the other direction if that makes sense. Its fibre to all cabs then coax to the houses.

What speed is their green cab fibre network? STM-1 / STM-4 / STM-16 ?
Are you doing research for BT? i hear they'll be laying cable soon?

Are all green cabs the same or are some 'master' ones?
Some cabs are bigger and referred to as 'main distros'

How many households can a green cab supply before its "overloaded"
EX NTL 80%, ex Telewest 120%.

Is there a distance limit on the length of coax from the Green Box?
Yes but they can pull RG-11 cable which is fatter, the problem being fatter cable takes up more capacity of the ducting, so less cable can be pulled through it before it is blocked up.

How do they get the right signal levels in everyones house ie near and far houses?
The tech measures it, also different taps in the cab give a different signal strength.

What frequency range are we talking about in a cable network?
no idea


ONE QUESTION FOR YOU......WHY DO YOU WANT TO KNOW THIS?
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Old 14-08-2008, 09:34   #3
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Im quite interested in why you really need to know all this information too. Is this for a project for college/University? or are you spying for another company?...hmm
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Old 14-08-2008, 09:59   #4
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Or a terrorist hmmmm
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Old 14-08-2008, 10:52   #5
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

I've answered a few of the distribution questions.

Does anyone have a detailed written explanation about how the Virgin Media Network is built?
Its currently three seperate and different networks.



What kind of headend kit do they use?
For the digital - Langley use SA and Harmonic - Bromley use Thomson and SA - Knowsley use Thomson and SA
Are they still delivering Analogue AND Digital down to customers houses?
Yes
Is there a central "feed" to all headends for channels coming from say Sky (non regional channels)
There used to be fibre feeds from Sky to Hayes (feeding Knowsley) and Bromley (which then fed Langley) and originally there were also feeds to Langley. Now they take everything from satellite on 3m dishes.
Is there a local feed from Local stations to your local headend?
There were a few regional channels (like M in Manchester) but now I don't know.
How do they obtain the SKY and Terrestrial Channels from? ie dish or fibre?
Dish and Aerial
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Old 14-08-2008, 22:07   #6
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Anyone have any diagrams?
Not me

What kind of headend kit do they use?
Couldnt tell you

Are they still delivering Analogue AND Digital down to customers houses?
Yes they are but we are trying to get people onto digital boxes

Is there a central "feed" to all headends for channels coming from say Sky?
I believe there are individual feeds to each franchise, so im lead to believe

Is there a local feed from Local stations to your local headend?
I dont know

How do they obtain the SKY and Terrestrial Channels from? ie dish or fibre?
Dish so im informed

Do they fibre the headend output to ALL local street cabs or just some?
Ive yet to explore this side of things

What speed is their green cab fibre network? STM-1 / STM-4 / STM-16 ?
As above.

Are all green cabs the same or are some 'master' ones?
There are main cabs for areas known as DP's.

How many households can a green cab supply before its "overloaded".
Not sure.

Is there a distance limit on the length of coax from the Green Box?
Answered by previous poter

How do they get the right signal levels in everyones house ie near and far houses?
Again, different taps give out different signals

What frequency range are we talking about in a cable network?
It depends.

Ok i'll stop there!!! All valid questions though! Sorry but I just like knowing how stuff works so any information greatly appreciated
Thats ok. An easy way to explain it, imagine a huge computer network,

Router -> Cable -> Router -> Cable-> Router...

you get the idea.
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Old 14-08-2008, 22:48   #7
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Smile Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Wow what a lot of questions as others have said it depends where you live as VM is made up of differrent cable companys all built there network to there own specs .Some telephone system use SDH and some PDH .Is this area the fibre goes out to the street to a control cab where it is changed over to copper which then goes to other cabs in the street which then goes to your house .Some towns have a Headend and some towns have a Hub site which is fed from the headend .
We have a local channel here and they send us the feed on fibre to the headend where we put it onto the network on analouge and digital
How many homes can be fed of a Fibre cab depends on the network build in the area
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Old 15-08-2008, 09:07   #8
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Yeah of course! I work for BT and we're planning to coax all the streets and cable the world... er nope and im not a terrorist either to whoever suggested that one too... jees, thanks for the comment! I only want cable in my estate and im finding ways to have it done...

In order to find a solution to this I need to know the limitations of cable, I had an extremely lazy VM contractor cable guy do a survey - he was supposed come round but he didn't and just phoned me up driving away from here saying nope mate you're 800metres from your green cab and thats way too far for a signal to work, then VM cancelled my order immediately...

Then I have you guys on this forum saying we can have higher grade cable to extend the distance from the cab. Besides this "expert" didnt do his job very well as down the other end of the road is ANOTHER green box which is 200m away from me at an estimate...

From reading Avonline website comments it seems cable guys or construction guys only get paid £10-20 per job install...

I was offering to pay whatever it costed for the install which would have been feasible WITHOUT digging any pavements... they could run the wire along the border of the estate as that is where my house is located.

The reason I offered the money is we get sub 1Meg from ADSL we are 5Km (by copper) from the exchange. I cant see VDSL coming anytime soon within 5 years so I feel like we're in the slow lane. VM suggested move house but i've just moved here last year.

I am just annoyed I have been fed a load of rubbish from VM and I know from reading comments on here and on wiki about "Hybrid_fibre-coaxial" they are just finding excuses not to do the job.

Since I have been researching this Im finding SO MANY properties could easily be connected to VM at little cost if they just used their brains.

Not every installation needs a JCB digging the road up. Why wont they entertain these installs? They are turning away subscriptions and revenue.
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Old 15-08-2008, 09:30   #9
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Hello all, I'm new on the forum today, read this post and I'm very interested in this as well!
I'm new to VM from AOL ADSL and love to know how everything works.
Always been an inquisitive so and so.
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Old 15-08-2008, 09:49   #10
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

The main thing is Virgin will not extend the cabling to the estate if its not going to be cost effective as it costs alot of money to do a installation
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Old 15-08-2008, 10:06   #11
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jungleguy View Post
The physical design of the network varies regionally. (or franchise to franchise)

Quote:
What kind of headend kit do they use?
Dunno
Varies depending which headend it is.

Quote:
Are they still delivering Analogue AND Digital down to customers houses?
You can subscribe to analogue but its gonna be turned off soon.
To some customers, in some areas analogue is already turned off.

Quote:
Is there a central "feed" to all headends for channels coming from say Sky (non regional channels)
dunno
No.

Quote:
Is there a local feed from Local stations to your local headend?
these are tough questions
Yes

Quote:
How do they obtain the SKY and Terrestrial Channels from? ie dish or fibre?
At a guess Its from large dishes at the head end.
Combination of direct fibre feeds and dishes.

Quote:
Do they fibre the headend output to ALL local street cabs or just some?
The network is designed as a fibre loop, so if there is a break the services can be supplied from the other direction if that makes sense. Its fibre to all cabs then coax to the houses.
Only nodal cabinets, and it's not a fibre ring to the cabinets it's a star network. A fibre break means bye bye node.

Quote:
What speed is their green cab fibre network? STM-1 / STM-4 / STM-16 ?
Are you doing research for BT? i hear they'll be laying cable soon?
None of the above as far as cable TV, etc, go, it's not SDH nor is the signal travelling along the fibre digital, and the bandwidth depends on the area. Some areas use DWDM while others carry a single wavelength. The only SDH / PDH being used is to carry telco and would very rarely be above STM-1. You can get a lot of 64kbps phone calls into 155.52Mbit

Quote:
Are all green cabs the same or are some 'master' ones?
Some cabs are bigger and referred to as 'main distros'
There are bigger cabinets which contain telco multiplexers. From the CATV point of view there are 3 kinds of cabs, nodes which terminate fibre, trunks which as they suggest are coaxial trunk amplification cabinets, and the smallest kind which are line extender cabinets which usually feed small areas such as a single street.

By small I am not referring to physical size necessarily though the biggest cabinets are telco or optical muxes.

Quote:
How many households can a green cab supply before its "overloaded"
EX NTL 80%, ex Telewest 120%.
Ummm...

There's no real definite figure if you are referring to broadband, it depends on how much bandwidth has been allocated to that nodal cabinet and how much usage there is. There could be anything from 250 to 2000 homes sharing a single piece of fibre.

Quote:
Is there a distance limit on the length of coax from the Green Box?
Yes but they can pull RG-11 cable which is fatter, the problem being fatter cable takes up more capacity of the ducting, so less cable can be pulled through it before it is blocked up.
Ideally they try and avoid going over a 100m run from the tap in the cabinet to the home. As above if signal levels are low a lower resistance larger cable can be pulled.

Quote:
How do they get the right signal levels in everyones house ie near and far houses?
The tech measures it, also different taps in the cab give a different signal strength.
What he said. There are 3 different levels of resistance in the cabinet usually from 3 different taps which supplies some level of granularity, and for finer adjustment attenuators can be used.

Quote:
What frequency range are we talking about in a cable network?
no idea
Dealing with what you'll find on VM's network only...

On upstream it's one of the following depending on network:

5MHz - 30MHz (Cheap rubbish)
5MHz - 42MHz (DOCSIS / NTSC Systems)
5MHz - 50MHz (Extended DOCSIS / Non-NTSC)
5MHz - 65MHz (EuroDOCSIS)

On Downstream


On decent NTSC cable systems downstream spectrum starts at 50MHz.
On DOCSIS (not EuroDOCSIS) systems running the same split it starts at 50MHz.
On fully EuroDOCSIS / PAL compatible systems it starts at 88MHz.

Actually here you go, specs of the filtering hardware that might be used (diplex filters):

Code:
Passband Low port (MHz)  	Passband High port (MHz) 
0 to 10 	14 to  750
0 to  33 	43 to  750 
0 to  40 	50 to  750 
0 to  48 	54 to  750
0 to 65 	88 to  750
On the VM network a very few areas max out at 450 or 550MHz, most max at 750MHz and a very few at 880MHz.

Please see this link for a more generic overview: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_fibre-coaxial

HTH.
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Old 15-08-2008, 10:45   #12
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Broadbandings View Post
To some customers, in some areas digital is already turned off.

????? So now they're turning off digital for the analogue customers
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Old 15-08-2008, 10:51   #13
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

I have no idea what you are referring to sir *whistles innocently*
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Old 15-08-2008, 11:38   #14
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Re: VirginMedia Network Technical Diagrams?

Seek and yee shall find:

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/11...work-info.html
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