Disconnection for abuse - Page 10

13-08-2008, 20:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by theLaw

I think you should submit a petition to http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/ regarding freedom laws. Also write to your MP and if you want a war, to the president of Iran.

You forgot to read this first on that website.

The e-Petitions service will be closed to new submissions during the Prime Minster's time away from Number 10. It will remain open as normal for the searching and signing of petitions.
This temporary closure will allow the Digital Communications team to deal more effectively with the large number of submissions that have built up due to the huge popularity of the service.
The e-Petitions system will re-open to new submissions when the Prime Minister returns to Downing Street after his summer break around 1 September.

dev · 13-08-2008, 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderballs

They dont make the rules up. The day we let companies make up the rules by which we are all governed will never come.

Can I suggest that some of your relatives gave their lives for the freedom we enjoy under the law of this great country of ours.

you entered into a contract with VM, they set the terms of the contract, so yes they do make the rules. VM can terminate the contract should you break any of the conditions of the contract (that is how contracts work), if they make one of those to be you must send a photo of you upside down to them every thursday and you don't they can terminate the contract still.

theLaw · 13-08-2008, 20:48

Don't be silly i can argue with anyone in email through fear of being banned!

**Hugh** · 13-08-2008, 20:50

You really have been sipping at the overflowing jug of crazy juice, haven't you?

I think this thread shows that you can't - or don't you let little things like facts get in the way of your tirades?

theLaw · 13-08-2008, 20:51

whydoineedatech doh.. okay true but what other parlimentary online petitioning service is there... i think it is called wait until they get back from holiday.

13-08-2008, 20:53

Is this thread going to feature in South Park as it is getting surreal

---------- Post added at 20:53 ---------- Previous post was at 20:52 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by theLaw

whydoineedatech doh.. okay true but what other parlimentary online petitioning service is there... i think it is called wait until they get back from holiday.

I know it was just in case anyone thought they could start one now

MovedGoalPosts · 13-08-2008, 20:53

I'd suggest that posters desist from the little jibes at each other, and debate the topic rather than nit picking and baiting each other.

theLaw · 13-08-2008, 20:56

I dont think it will make south park.. that a cartoon series that has abusive content

---------- Post added at 19:56 ---------- Previous post was at 19:53 ----------

But I suppose it is okay to be abusive if it makes you money!

Thunderballs · 13-08-2008, 21:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by dev

you entered into a contract with VM, they set the terms of the contract, so yes they do make the rules. VM can terminate the contract should you break any of the conditions of the contract (that is how contracts work), if they make one of those to be you must send a photo of you upside down to them every thursday and you don't they can terminate the contract still.

They can terminate the contract indeed but they have to do so lawfully by giving the required amount of notice.

Thats my beef with them now not the reason for disconnection because they could and would deny me service in any case now unless someone senior took a view I had been wronged (which i seriously doubt would happen at this stage) or there is something in the ISPA code of conduct that would require them to do so IF the ISPA found in my favour.

13-08-2008, 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderballs

They can terminate the contract indeed but they have to do so lawfully by giving the required amount of notice.

Thats my beef with them now not the reason for disconnection because they could and would deny me service in any case now unless someone senior took a view I had been wronged (which i seriously doubt would happen at this stage) or there is something in the ISPA code of conduct that would require them to do so IF the ISPA found in my favour.

They have no need to give you any notice, read in the link below section D Using our services section 1 a to j, you have accepted this by signing your agreement.

http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html...ble/terms.html

dev · 13-08-2008, 21:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderballs

They can terminate the contract indeed but they have to do so lawfully by giving the required amount of notice.

Thats my beef with them now not the reason for disconnection because they could and would deny me service in any case now unless someone senior took a view I had been wronged (which i seriously doubt would happen at this stage) or there is something in the ISPA code of conduct that would require them to do so IF the ISPA found in my favour.

as whydoIneedatech says, its in the terms, they don't need notice:

Quote:

If we believe that you are using the services in any of these ways, we are entitled to reduce, suspend and/or terminate any or all of the services without giving you notice.

afaik, the only legalities involved are those of contract law which tends to be whatever is in the contract goes

Thunderballs · 13-08-2008, 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by whydoIneedatech

They have no need to give you any notice, read in the link below section D Using our services section 1 a to j, you have accepted this by signing your agreement.

http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html...ble/terms.html

As I have said before Contract law isnt as simple as here here are the Terms of the contract therefore they are lawful and we have a right to enforce them.

I cannot enter into a contract with someone who is termanally ill to help them die because it is unlawful.

IF this clause in the contract with VM was deemed unlawful/unfair etc VM could not rely on it in court.

I do not believe they can rely on it in court.

It is a sad state of affairs when people think companies make the laws in our country and that what is written in commercial contracts/EULAS/AUPs etc is the law.

---------- Post added at 21:41 ---------- Previous post was at 21:35 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by dev

as whydoIneedatech says, its in the terms, they don't need notice:

afaik, the only legalities involved are those of contract law which tends to be whatever is in the contract goes

Absolute rubbish.

Contract Law specialists are not rubber stampers who got exceptional marks for English comprehension at school.

I do conceed that generally contracts are written by lawyers and so generally they contain terms that are lawful which might give rise to your your belief that whatever is in the contract goes.

dev · 13-08-2008, 21:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderballs

It is a sad state of affairs when people think companies make the laws in our country and that what is written in commercial contracts/EULAS/AUPs etc is the law.

VM don't make the laws, they make the terms of a contract which can be enforcable by existing laws. I find it wosre that someone would compare a contract for TV/BB to one involving life/death.

For a part of a contract to be non-enforceable, there has to be an element of illegality in it. For example, a contract to kill someone as they can't kill themselves is illegal as it's still defined as murder so the contract can't be legal. Similarly, the Apple EULA forcing people to use OS X on Apple hardware only isn't enforced as it breaks competition laws.

What law are you suggesting VM's terms breaks to make it non-enforceable?

13-08-2008, 21:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderballs

As I have said before Contract law isnt as simple as here here are the Terms of the contract therefore they are lawful and we have a right to enforce them.

I cannot enter into a contract with someone who is termanally ill to help them die because it is unlawful.

IF this clause in the contract with VM was deemed unlawful/unfair etc VM could not rely on it in court.

I do not believe they can rely on it in court.

It is a sad state of affairs when people think companies make the laws in our country and that what is written in commercial contracts/EULAS/AUPs etc is the law.

I think you would find that Virgin have a very strong defense in your signature being on their documents accepting their terms and conditions, and their legal team would take apart any argument you tried to use saying otherwise.

Do you really think any large company would leave themselves open by not adhering to the laws of the land, because if they did they would fail very quickly.

Thunderballs · 13-08-2008, 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

theLaw, trying reading the thread.

Someone complained about an email they had received from the OP's VM connection - no spying took place.

.

This does raise another interesting point .

I didnt write the email, it isnt addressed to me yet I have been sent it by VM.

Does the fact the sender used my and ofc Virgin and whoever elses systems/infrasturcure to get to the recipient email address mean that it can be read/used by all those organisations whose infrastructure it used to reach its destination ?

Does the sender therefore loose any rights to prvacy they might have bny sending it via email or are there laws governing how those organisations proviing infrastructure use this senders email ?