Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[BetBlowWhistler]

http://www.btcustomerevents.com/secu.../john_regnault

You would have thought that this person would have been involved in advising the BT board about the trials wouldn't you?

And Bruce Schneiers' blog is a good read btw
http://www.schneier.com/blog/

[davethejag]

Good Morning, I have just been reading yesterdays "Mail On Sunday" and in the "Financial Mail" section there is an article headed "BT Rivals Pay Broadband Toll". At the end of this article there is this bit -

"Meanwhile Vivienne Reding, European Commissioner for Information Society and Media, demanded that Ofcom should investigate BT's secret trials to spy on internet customers' browsing habits in order to target advertisements"

I hope that this will make a few more people aware of what is going on.

Dave.

[madslug]

Originally Posted by BetBlowWhistler

http://www.btcustomerevents.com/secu.../john_regnault

You would have thought that this person would have been involved in advising the BT board about the trials wouldn't you?

Interesting that the meeting was on 20th June 2007 - just when the 2007 trial started and the agenda includes: The security threat environment is constantly changing. By the end of 2007, Gartner* predicts that ‘75% of enterprises will be affected with financially motivated, targeted malware that evaded their traditional perimeter and host defences.’ - BT's bold.

The only thing they got wrong is that the threat level is now at 100%.

And: Senior BT executives will outline the critical threats keeping security officers awake at night. They will be joined by senior security professionals from the DTI and Reuters who will share their valuable experiences in securing large scale networks.

If I wasn't such an innocent I may suspect that BT were on a fishing expedition.

Has anyone written to any other speakers at that meeting? Who talked about DPI for profiling and anti-phishing. Was it discussed under 'Ethical hacking - preventing the unthinkable'

[Rchivist]

While we are thinking about network security and how it works within BT - I found this document (while trying to research who shot JR)

http://www.btglobalservices.com/busi...sestudy_EN.pdf

There are quite a few names in there, they may or may not be current, and remembering the BT email principle - firstnameDOTlastnameATbtDOTcom - maybe we could contact them to ask about how involved they were with the 2006 and 2007 trials?

It does occur to me that the police might want to have a ferret around the staff involved in BT network security and ask who did and who didn't know about the secret trials.

This page of google might repay a little investigation - I've searched on
"President, Security" then refined with a Search Within string of "BT"
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en...n%C2%A0results

There is a video of Bruce Schneier from 2007 here
http://www.networked.bt.com/bigthinkers_security.php
Includes a panel member from F-Secure (who have since formed a negative view of Phorm's technology)

Must go - have a good day.

[Matari]

Is it worth contacting David Davies, the Conservative MP who recently resigned over the 42 day detention policy? He is a big advocate re 'defending our basic freedoms' and in this particular article (http://www.conservatives.com/tile.do...&obj_id=145275) says:

'We will soon have the most intrusive ID card system in the world. There is a CCTV camera for every 14 citizens - despite growing evidence of their ineffectiveness as deployed. We have the largest DNA database in the world, larger than any dictatorship, with thousands of innocent children and millions of innocent citizens on it.'

and in this article (http://www.conservatives.com/tile.do...bj_id=145263):

'This may be the last speech I make to the House. Of course, that would be a cause of deep regret to me.

But at least my electorate, and the nation as a whole, would have had the opportunity to debate and consider one of the most fundamental issues of the day the ever intrusive power of the state into their daily lives, the loss of privacy, the loss of freedom and the steady attrition undermining the rule of law.'

[madslug]

Originally Posted by davethejag

Good Morning, I have just been reading yesterdays "Mail On Sunday" and in the "Financial Mail" section there is an article headed "BT Rivals Pay Broadband Toll".

Online at http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/investi...9&in_page_id=3

[BetBlowWhistler]

I've just read through Bruce Schneiers' blog back until February and nary a mention of Phorm (expect a couple of people mentioning it in the comments).

Now that tells a story in itself.

[icsys]

It would seem, at last, that mainstream media is finally starting to report snippets of the BT/Phorm scandal.

BBC News has published an extract from the HoL questions last thursday:

'Test case'

Lord West was also asked about trials by BT of an online system of advertising involving more than 30,000 of its customers, known as Phorm.

In 2006 and 2007 this matched adverts to users' web habits, although BT did not inform customers they were part of such a project.

The peer said the government was "not aware" of the tests beforehand, and an investigation was now checking if these had been "appropriate".

Since then BT had made a formal approach to begin a trial "of about 10,000 broadband subscribers", Lord West said, but he was unclear if this was "covered by law".

A test case might be needed to consider whether this was a form of "interception", he added.

©BBC News

[Rchivist]

Originally Posted by icsys

It would seem, at last, that mainstream media is finally starting to report snippets of the BT/Phorm scandal.

BBC News has published an extract from the HoL questions last thursday:

'Test case'

Lord West was also asked about trials by BT of an online system of advertising involving more than 30,000 of its customers, known as Phorm.

In 2006 and 2007 this matched adverts to users' web habits, although BT did not inform customers they were part of such a project.

The peer said the government was "not aware" of the tests beforehand, and an investigation was now checking if these had been "appropriate".

Since then BT had made a formal approach to begin a trial "of about 10,000 broadband subscribers", Lord West said, but he was unclear if this was "covered by law".

A test case might be needed to consider whether this was a form of "interception", he added.

©BBC News

Yes - the message IS penetrating. And it is important to remember - these guys (who make media editing decisions - not the reporters themselves) are as yet UNinphormed, and may even have been DEphormed. But that doesn't make them enemies. We need to take it gently and not rant at them just because we have been living with this for a few months and get frustrated at the MISinphormation.

It just needs a new non techie, non patronising vocabulary, focussed on technophobes or technilliterates, that makes it clear in politically astute, PR conscious language, that ordinary people will resonate with.

So - words like
interception of your broadband line, snooping, keeping track of where you go/what web sites you visit, watching you while you are online, hitting you with targetted adverts, making the internet more complicated and more fragile, making your web pages load slower, making your browsing less safe, and less private. Exposing your children to unnecessary risk by following THEM round the internet. Assuming everyone wants this unless they actually switch it off. Justifying it by using secret unpublished research that no one has actually seen.

And for the politicians - making the internet less trusting - do the security services want to see everyone using an encrypted internet? Or will that make protecting national security a lot harder? Do they want e-commerce to become vulnerable? Do they want MP's and home workers to have their data traffic snooped on by a Russian linked company?

Meanwhile, with the more INphormed - carry on the technical analysis and really show them we (well you - I don't understand it at all!) know what you are talking about, and that the technical people are very alarmed about this vulnerable man-in-the-middle weak Phorm controlled DPI link in the infrastructure. Root out the Gibsons, the JR's, the Claytons, and keep them talking.

The downside of this is that it will probably result in "scaremongering" accusations - but I think we can live with that.

[Deko]

Also from Beeb article.

Meanwhile a 40% pay rise for Mr Thomas has been put on hold until the autumn.

His salary had been due to increase from £100,000 to £140,000, but this has been delayed owing to a review of his powers, responsibilities and salary scale later in the year.

ouch.

[Rchivist]

Originally Posted by BetBlowWhistler

http://www.btcustomerevents.com/secu.../john_regnault

You would have thought that this person would have been involved in advising the BT board about the trials wouldn't you?

And Bruce Schneiers' blog is a good read btw
http://www.schneier.com/blog/

Thanks for that piece of independent googling. I'll email the gentleman with the initials JR.

[BadPhormula]

Originally Posted by icsys

"He's accustomed to getting what he wants, and he knows how to do it both through hard work and clever manipulation."

That's a nice quote. We would never have noticed that?
I wonder if the MP's and Lords enjoy being manipulated?

Slight correction. "...enjoy being cleverly manipulated"

[Deko]

From the

http://kickstand.typepad.com/metamus...-formerly.html comments section.

It's the ignorant who are causing the biggest stir.


This is the intellect & tricks of this CEO, he just can't take the fact that others have a completely different view to his own.

I'm not ignorant & I ask BT & Phorm formally once again to remove the Profiler on the "Kingston RAS", which is potentially monitoring all my interenet traffic.

Evidence of such profiler redirections can sporadically be seen in my Router logs!

Posted by:Jonah | July 21, 2008 at 01:31 AM

my bold !


Jonah you on here ? PM me if you are.

[BadPhormula]

Originally Posted by BetBlowWhistler

I'll second this. JR is a top bloke, and if for a second I thought he had been involved in this product I would a) have been surprised and b) would probably have trusted their claims a little more.

Anyone involved in network security will take about 2 seconds to discover who this person is as he is quite visible in the community. Campaigners might even be able to email him directly using the old firstname.lastname@domainname that is used at BT. Nuff said.

It's also worth pointing out that anything added or removed from BT's network (be it BT Retail or other group members) is subject to a change request being approved.

This CR has many details, such as a summary of the intended purpose, backout plans, and a list of approval groups that need to sign it off before it can be added to the network.

I can't imagine something that is placed in such a crucial position in the network would not have a CR. It would nice if that information made it into the public domain wouldn't it ?

Hail the honest whistleblowers that have to live with their conscience!
three cheers

[phormwatch]

Entity-Relationship diagram updated (July 21):

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/9408/phormumlil1.jpg