Secret terrorism dossier left on train....

[Osem]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7449845.stm

Quite astonishing!!

Well it's no longer astonishing because it's become commonplace sadly.

I'm wondering just how much/many sensitive documents are wondering around the country and beyond in the company of forgetful civil and military personnel?

Has no one bothered to tighten up security anywhere at all?How can someone just walk out of their workplace with such documents without any checks being made?

[tweetypie/8]

Originally Posted by Osem

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7449845.stm

Quite astonishing!!

i hope the idiot has to look for another job,preferably cleaning the bogs.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

Well it's no longer astonishing because it's become commonplace sadly.

I'm wondering just how much/many sensitive documents are wondering around the country and beyond in the company of forgetful civil and military personnel?

Has no one bothered to tighten up security anywhere at all?How can someone just walk out of their workplace with such documents without any checks being made?

It's not quite on the same level, but I remember when I first started working for a large(ish) public organisation. A couple of days after I started, they had a burglarly in one of their buildings, in which a *lot* of equipment was stolen.

I had to go to that building the next day to pick up some equipment. I walked in with no ID (deliberately). About 15 minutes later, I walked out with about £10,000 worth of equipment (a £4000 laptop and a £6000 video/data projector). I made no attempt to hide the fact I was taking the equipment.

Not once was I challenged by the security guard despite that fact that he didn't know me (I had started a couple of days earlier). I had no ID and no uniform (the dress code was casual so I wore jeans and a T shirt). In fact, I had nothing that didn't show I had walked in from the street. He sat there watching me go out of the building.

I reported this to my line manager, was called in to his line manager to explain what had happened, and, IIRC, the guard was promptly fired as a result.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by Incognitas

How can someone just walk out of their workplace with such documents without any checks being made?

Easy, if you are cleared at the appropriate level there is nothing to stop you copying data to a memory stick. The vast majority of employees in government/defence jobs are cleared to at least Restricted level, with many cleared to Secret Level.

The official secrets act, List X status, ITAR and company policy means action could be taken if an employee was negligent, this would be likely to happen in a private company but when the government is the employer there appears to be no action taken.

[Cobbydaler]

Originally Posted by Escapee

Easy, if you are cleared at the appropriate level there is nothing to stop you copying data to a memory stick. The vast majority of employees in government/defence jobs are cleared to at least Restricted level, with many cleared to Secret Level.

The official secrets act, List X status, ITAR and company policy means action could be taken if an employee was negligent, this would be likely to happen in a private company but when the government is the employer there appears to be no action taken.

Well, he has been suspended...

Originally Posted by The BBC

An unnamed Cabinet Office employee was suspended after the documents were left on a train seat and handed to the BBC.
Mr Miliband said the official was not authorised to remove the files from government premises, but national security did not seem to be "at risk".

Link

[Tezcatlipoca]

Originally Posted by Osem

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7449845.stm

Quite astonishing!!

Hardly surprising... not the first time something sensitive has been left in public

[Osem]

Sadly that's true but I find it astonishing that, given what's been happening over the last year or two, this sort of thing is still going on! You'd have thought they'd have learned something from past experiences .......

[Xaccers]

Who needs the freedom of information act eh?

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Osem

Sadly that's true but I find it astonishing that, given what's been happening over the last year or two, this sort of thing is still going on! You'd have thought they'd have learned something from past experiences .......

Perhaps we should ask why they are taking vital documents home, might it have some thing to do with staffing levels and not having enough time in the day to complete their work?

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

Perhaps we should ask why they are taking vital documents home, might it have some thing to do with staffing levels and not having enough time in the day to complete their work?

Have things changed that much in the civil service since I last worked with them in '97?
Do they now kick everyone out at 4:30pm, stopping people staying late to finish working on those TOP SECRET documents?

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Have things changed that much in the civil service since I last worked with them in '97?
Do they now kick everyone out at 4:30pm, stopping people staying late to finish working on those TOP SECRET documents?

In which case why are they taking them home, which was the point I was making, there seems to be a lot of tut tuting in this thread without actually asking why this keeps happening

[danielf]

Perhaps this is why the 42 day detention limit is needed? Staff are so overworked that they can't be expected to read the documents without taking them home?

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

In which case why are they taking them home, which was the point I was making, there seems to be a lot of tut tuting in this thread without actually asking why this keeps happening

They should not be, pure and simple.
Yes I've seen top secret documents strewn across desks while the occupant has been elsewhere, but everyone with access to that area had top secret access anyway so in theory were as trustworthy as the person who required the documents.

Encrypted on a stolen laptop is one thing, at least they're encrypted (my current place uses 256bit encryption and they're just a car manufacturer) so less likely to be read by whoever finds them, but a printed document???
Should never have been out on a train, hence why the person responsible has been suspended.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

They should not be, pure and simple.
Yes I've seen top secret documents strewn across desks while the occupant has been elsewhere, but everyone with access to that area had top secret access anyway so in theory were as trustworthy as the person who required the documents.

Documents Restricted or Secret must not be left out on desks whilst unattended, the reason is that Escorted visitors may not have the required level of clearance to view those documents.

All Restricted and Secret level documents should be locked away, also computers without suitable encryption should not contain any of these documents.

Th reason why breaches are made are often for very simple reasons. For example, I am not allowed to connect an unauthorised memory stick to a piece of equipment and copy files. The authorised memory sticks with encryption take 3 hours to backup some folders that take about 5 mins on an unencrypted stick.

I understand some people put them on an unencrypted stick, take them home and burn them on a CD. The CD can then be placed in a secure nachine and copied to he required location.

It's simple, measures are put in place to aid secuity but the impact in practice means people take more risks with data than if there was no security system in place to start with.

It's all about human nature!