Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[roadrunner69]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

True

Again you point to 'DATA' being intercepted. Is it really data or just session/vistor information which could take the form of web metrics or even logon cookies.

how are they supposed to serve up 'relevant' ads without any relevant DATA?

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by ceedee

Any NSA spying on our browsing data would be illegal in this country (BTW, do you have any documentary evidence of that?)
But Phorm claim that their system will be completely legal.

If you (really) want further information about the arguments against Phorm, I'd suggest you have a read of BadPhorm.
However, if you're simply a troll aiming to stir up a fight here, I'll expect you to carry on baiting...

Seriously I'm just trying to weed out the specifics of why you lot are so anti-phorm and imo it's down to different opinions with the two clans being seperated by

[1] Those who dislike the idea of ISPs profiting off their back.

[2] Those who think this tracks everything they do.

Personally clan[1] know what they are talking about and I'm all for their cause. Those in group [2] need some education on the subject.

ps No I don't troll however most my posts appear to give that impression. I've got to live with it and so do the people around me.

[OF1975]

Quick on channel 4 news now!!!

[lucevans]

Originally Posted by roadrunner69

Do you have any real references for this.... or have you been reading too much Dan Brown?

While the keys CAN be broken the amount of computing power and time is still
WAY beyond what would be required to read ALL encryped web traffic.

This debate is about OUR data being unconditionally intercepted and read for pure greed - not national security

Jesus EVERYBODY types faster than me

Except me, it seems...

[kt88man]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Again you point to 'DATA' being intercepted. Is it really data or just session/vistor information which could take the form of web metrics or even logon cookies.

@ The Jackal

Take a 'quick flick' through this document...

http://www.freshpatents.com/Targeted...pe=description

[3x2]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

True
Again you point to 'DATA' being intercepted. Is it really data or just session/vistor information which could take the form of web metrics or even logon cookies.

No, it is the content of all your unencrypted web traffic.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by roadrunner69

how are they supposed to serve up 'relevant' ads without any relevant DATA?

The cookie along side session information will give them all the data they will ever need but more exact targeting would be to profile users or cookies with the plain text content of the page being viewed

[OF1975]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Seriously I'm just trying to weed out the specifics of why you lot are so anti-phorm and imo it's down to different opinions with the two clans being seperated by

[1] Those who dislike the idea of ISPs profiting off their back.

[2] Those who think this tracks everything they do.

Personally clan[1] know what they are talking about and I'm all for their cause. Those in group [2] need some education on the subject.

ps No I don't troll however most my posts appear to give that impression. I've got to live with it and so do the people around me.

The Jackal, have you read the patent application? Have you read the statements made by phorm to the New York times? Issue 2 may not be applicable right now but statements made by phorm and also the details contained in the patent very clearly lay out the possibility that this is the thin edge of the wedge. There is absolutely nothing so far to stop Phorm with regard to function creep. It would be very easy for Phorm to change the software and start snooping on traffic other than that on port 80.

How about you go read up more on Phorm, read the entire 10 page Richard Clayton report (I have) and then come back and tell us why the issue of function creep isn't an issue we should be worried about? Lets remember this is a company that has a very checkered past and even up until recently has shown that it cannot be trusted. You did read about their attempts to edit their own wikipedia entry didn't you?

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by 3x2

No, it is the content of all your unencrypted web traffic.

Again why can't you trust phorm to do this ? I'm sure all phorm will be looking for in the pages are keywords for tagging.

[roadrunner69]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

[1] Those who dislike the idea of ISPs profiting off their back.

[2] Those who think this tracks everything they do.

Personally clan[1] know what they are talking about and I'm all for their cause. Those in group [2] need some education on the subject.

ps No I don't troll however most my posts appear to give that impression. I've got to live with it and so do the people around me.

As many on here have pointed out, its not so much what they claim their system
does now, (thats bad enough) but the function creep that will inevitably occur
with seemingly little independant monitoring, once they get their slippers under the beds of our ISP's.

And, if you have to ask why we don't trust phorm, then you obviously haven't read half as much on this issue as you claim.

[kt88man]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Again why can't you trust phorm to do this ? I'm sure all phorm will be looking for in the pages are keywords for tagging.

Simply because on past history Phorm do not appear to be a very trustworthy company.

You are happy with it... that's fine. A lot of people here are not.

[manxminx]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Again why can't you trust phorm to do this ? I'm sure all phorm will be looking for in the pages are keywords for tagging.

That's not the point. The point is that they intercepting our personal data. Remember what was said last week by Phorm: "We can actually see the whole Internet". What is at stake here is our privacy. And yes, I'm very much aware that Phorm isn't the only threat, it's just a very thin edge of a very large wedge.

I'm sorry 'Jackal' I do not see why I have to defend my beliefs to you. Who are you anyway? If you were a genuine member of the British public asking genuine questions and wanting to understand the issues then fair enough. But you're not are you?

[unicus]

I just want to add my thanks to Alexander Hanff & Dr Richard Clayton for defending our right to privacy at the meeting yesterday and also to Simon Davies for getting Alexander up as a speaker especially when he didn't need to.

@The Jackal - your posts indicate that you are a little naive regarding this subject, and this is not a personal attack but constructive criticism. The potential implications and misuse of the equipment and system used by Phorm have only been touched on in this thread and is only likely to be. Suffice to say that Phorm's system can only make identity theft easier and that has devastating consequences

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by OF1975

The Jackal, have you read the patent application? Have you read the statements made by phorm to the New York times? Issue 2 may not be applicable right now but statements made by phorm and also the details contained in the patent very clearly lay out the possibility that this is the thin edge of the wedge. There is absolutely nothing so far to stop Phorm with regard to function creep. It would be very easy for Phorm to change the software and start snooping on traffic other than that on port 80.

How about you go read up more on Phorm, read the entire 10 page Richard Clayton report (I have) and then come back and tell us why the issue of function creep isn't an issue we should be worried about? Lets remember this is a company that has a very checkered past and even up until recently has shown that it cannot be trusted. You did read about their attempts to edit their own wikipedia entry didn't you?

FINALLY I get a legible answer out of you. It wasn't too hard was it ? Thankyou.

The references to the patent, function creep and Clayton's report have proved invaluable.

[3x2]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Again why can't you trust phorm to do this ? I'm sure all phorm will be looking for in the pages are keywords for tagging.

There are 3600+ items to this thread and a lot of them cover your questions in great detail.