Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[rogerdraig]

i don't follow their reasoning their if they accept the home office reasoning that if they have consent its ok they still would not be even thinking of doing this as the home office clearly said both us and the sites we visit have to give consent

even if we opt in they have no way of gaining consent of all the sites we visit

plus even if they get around that if i opt out mirroring my data even if they don't use it according to that home office thing would still leave them in it up to their necks as it would still be intercepted whether or not anything was done with the data

or am i being silly

[popper]

its nice that the
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/0...rasite-cookie/
admins are so vigilant and fair

shame the beteBT cant be the same, ROTFL, took them long enough to come lock and clean out the (i assume)CF references to the law etc

http://www.beta.bt.com/bta/forums/th...D=16952&#16952
i wonder what they will remove, as if i couldnt guess...


now go and put that Phorm coo quote up on that bits.blogs.nytimes..,and all the other interesting facts we have collected ...

"25.
April 8th,
2008
5:29 pm
The commenters using the names Ken Harrison and Sandra Harwood above are posting from the same IP address.

Sandra Harwood and the person using the name Brad Wright both have e-mail addresses at the same obscure e-mail provider.

Readers are encouraged to evaluate their comments accordingly. Commenters are encouraged to disclose their affiliations when relevant.
— Posted by David F. Gallagher N.Y. Times "

[mark777]

I've just noticed that there has been a bit of a scuffle with members from this site and the BT forum. The BT forum is now 'locked' for moderation.

We don't need this on a night when the Phorm Team have been sent to bed early, without supper, for getting caught with their hands in the Wiki jar. Tomorrow morning they will be having a larff.

We need to be working together against Phorm. We also all need to be going for any ISP that works with them, together.

[popper]

Exactly my point....

try telling that to PeterN and his
"
It's right to view other opinions and gather information but it is not right for non-BT customers to be posting and debating on the BT support forum.

Virgin Media have their own forum and it's easy enough to visit there if you want to know way their customers are saying and there are plenty of other places for general discussion on this or any subject so no-one is trying to censor or supress anything."

(their MB SW is naff use the url below if you like)

and then 30 minutes later you get censorship
"Locked thread while the moderators delete off-topic posts and those which break forum rules. It will be re-opened later today.
Mark Wilkin
Support Community Coordinator
http://www.beta.bt.com/bta/forums/me...ID=17064#17064
we shall see whats left after they edit etc....


its fine though, as id imagine most betabt readers will have this thread open now due to the links i placed there earlyer, and they can always register here and talk without BT spying or removing their posts if they like..

BTW PeterN if your reading, this is not an official Virgin Media support forum.

its a totally independent forum with zero ties to VM other than some very good VM personel that chose to sign up on their own time and be a part of this site, helping people.

CF freely encurages ALL Broadband and non broadband customers to contribute in all things, as long as it helps users with their problems etc.

no doubt you shall still benefit from the CF members hard work and actions in the future regarding this end users v ISP/Phorm situation.

JFYI, VM dont have an official web forum, or even a simple web based news server front end,they use only limited antiquated news server support that most people dont use these days.

[unicus]

Originally Posted by rogermevans

even if we opt in they have no way of gaining consent of all the sites we visit

I was talking to a friend today who I know frequents el Reg and he runs several websites so I asked him if he'd read about Phorm but he'd only seen the headlines so knew nothing about them. His reasoning for not reading was a lack of time (like most of us) and it wasn't about the ISP's he deals with, fair enough. I told him about Phorm and he was shocked, "I don't won't them near my sites" he said "glad I'm not with those ISP's either". He couldn't believe the ISP's would get into bed with a company using that system, "they must be stupid".

What this showed me is that the word has to be put out to people, let them know what's happening, even if they are competent techies they might not have seen this coming for being too busy...and hope we're not too late.

So in the morning I'll go through my address book then off to other forums I frequent. But first I need some sleep

[mark777]

Originally Posted by unicus

I was talking to a friend today who I know frequents el Reg and he runs several websites so I asked him if he'd read about Phorm but he'd only seen the headlines so knew nothing about them. His reasoning for not reading was a lack of time (like most of us) and it wasn't about the ISP's he deals with, fair enough. I told him about Phorm and he was shocked, "I don't won't them near my sites" he said "glad I'm not with those ISP's either". He couldn't believe the ISP's would get into bed with a company using that system, "they must be stupid".

What this showed me is that the word has to be put out to people, let them know what's happening, even if they are competent techies they might not have seen this coming for being too busy...and hope we're not too late.

So in the morning I'll go through my address book then off to other forums I frequent. But first I need some sleep

I've worked in IT for 15 years and didn't know anything about Phorm until I read the Berners-Lee article on the BBC site a couple of weeks ago. (I don't get out much!).

I do think most techies know about it now. We need to keep posting to forums/blogs and writing to MP's and looking at the law etc. (not forgetting viral mail with all the links.)

But, we need to start thinking about putting leaflets under car windscreen wipers as well. We are NOT engaging with enough people.

There are local elections coming up. We seem to have a Government that does not recognise the law!! We have votes.

---

I think we should all have at least 1 or 2 support/complaint e-mails in as well, on a rolling cycle. This Phorm stuff could get expensive in staff time, but I am really concerned that it might infect my mobile phone.

[Portly_Giraffe]

Originally Posted by mark777

But, we need to start thinking about putting leaflets under car windscreen wipers as well. We are NOT engaging with enough people.

Please contact me via email to discuss this as I have some ideas. There's an address on the about page of http://www.inphormationdesk.org

[kt88man]

Going down....

As at 09-Apr-2008 10:22:34
1,462.500 Price | Move -212.50 -12.69%

http://www.londonstockexchange.com/e...%20B1WTNC4PHRM


Good Morning to the PhormUKPRteam

[mrjolly]

I noticed this morning that there's an early day motion up on the parliament website that currently has 16 signatures - including a few I recognise too!

TARGETED ADVERTISING TECHNOLOGY

Foster, Don

That this House notes the recent developments in targeted internet advertising, particularly the emergence of the company Phorm; notes with concern the reported technical test conducted by BT last summer, where BT were accused of using Phorm to track customers without their knowledge or prior consent; believes that a system whereby consumers opt-in to Phorm would be far more transparent and appropriate than the opt-out system currently proposed by Phorm; and therefore calls on internet service providers to make Phorm an opt-in service.
----

Hi Phorm team!

Is anything being done about the flaws that have been found in the Phorm system that have major privacy implications? The one where someones webwise UID is made available to any site that wants it, and the one that allows a website to opt a person into being intercepted and tracked without their knowledge or consent.

Here's 2 quite serious implications, I'm sure there are lots more.
Sites can opt users in without their knowledge and then collaborate to track the user themselves.
Sites can publish the webwise UID's along with a list of pages accessed thereby exposing personal details along with possible 'sensitive' information.

Not really a gold standard, is it?

[Barkotron]

Originally Posted by kt88man

Going down....

As at 09-Apr-2008 10:22:34
1,462.500 Price | Move -212.50 -12.69%

http://www.londonstockexchange.com/e...%20B1WTNC4PHRM


Good Morning to the PhormUKPRteam

Blimey, that has absolutely tanked again this morning. Have we missed something major happening? It's been fluctuating around 1700 for about 2 weeks, then suddenly drops another 200 points? Seems a bit odd to me.

[Ravenheart]

\o/ local MP Lynne Jones signed it.

Although she's not my MP she was hugely supportive of a local campaign when they closed our hydrotherapy department. She answered my emails and letters quickly and has kept in touch since. which is more than can be said for my own MP.

[AlexanderHanff]

I am trying to figure out why their stock has taken such a dive this morning. I can't find any significant new news which leads me to believe that maybe there is something big going to break today.

The EDM is from 2nd April so it is not new news and only has 16 signatures (which is pretty pathetic really, clearly we need to pressure our MPs more and using real letters not emails.)

It does make me smile to see them drop to 14.25 though I bet Morgan Stanley aren't too happy Their 20.00 per share deal to raise 32M GBP is currently 33(ish)% higher than the market value.

Alexander Hanff

---------- Post added at 12:10 ---------- Previous post was at 12:07 ----------

I wonder what will happen when I publish my paper on Monday

---------- Post added at 12:14 ---------- Previous post was at 12:10 ----------

I think next week we should all send letters to Morgan Stanley expressing our outrage that they intend to invest in an illegal technology

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

I am trying to figure out why their stock has taken such a dive this morning. I can't find any significant new news which leads me to believe that maybe there is something big going to break today.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed about this:

Originally Posted by CaptJamieHunter

A little birdie tells me there might be a statement from Virgin Media today. Might not be around later to comment further, previous commitments mean I'm away from station for most of today.

[BeckyD]

Could this have anything to do with the stock prices today?

In a new twist, the most influential voice in the identity space has now spoken out on the topic: Microsoft's identity guru Kim Cameron agrees that 'opt-out' implementations of Webwise are in breach of the Laws of Identity. This is important - Kim is shaping the principles that will drive future privacy-protecting identity systems, and if Phorm is an inappropriate third-party in the online identity relationship then they have a real problem on their hands.
It's very likely that attention will shift to BT and VirginMedia, who have both been very quiet indeed about their 'opt-out' approach to Phorm (TalkTalk are off the hook because they have taken a more privacy-friendly 'opt-in' approach). The real test will be whether those providers start to lose business over this, particularly in Croydon and Ealing, where further trials of OIX and Webwise are due soon.

Full article:
http://www.computerweekly.com/blogs/...-independ.html

[AlexanderHanff]

Originally Posted by LadyMinion

Could this have anything to do with the stock prices today?

Full article:
http://www.computerweekly.com/blogs/...-independ.html

Nice find

Alexander Hanff