Multiple abortions

Then he will be out of the picture and all the potential is there

[Osem]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

Whilst I agree that abortion should not be seen as an alternative to contraception, nothing in the article quoted supports your first sentence.

Actually that's a bit of an omission on my part - those figures were from a Radio 5 Live news interview I heard regarding this story which was what actually sparked my post in the first place. I just didn't have time to make all that clear when posting as I had to go out.

My own view on abortion is that it's sadly necessary in certain circumstances as already alluded to by others. Quite why, though, in this day and age so many women should need multiple abortions is beyond me. Of course contraceptive failure is a factor but what do they mean by that? A split condom (hardly anyone's fault) or a lack of discipline to take the pill regularly whilst being sexually active (a trifle neglient). In the former case nobody is to blame, not so in the latter in which case any subsequent abortion is surely akin to being a form of contraception of last resort.

BBKing - Groups like these:

Marie Stopes International, the British Pregnancy Advisory Service (BPAS), Brook Advisory Services who don't ever seem to come out openly and acknowledge the misuse of abortion in just the same way as anti-abortion groups seem always to deny the genuine grounds for abortion.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

Then he will be out of the picture and all the potential is there

Yes, and we the taxpayer will probably be sponsoring the child for 18 years.

On the other hand she is an attractive and fairly bright teenager, who could meet a guy who wants to work for a living, not scrounge on benefits, sell drugs or steal to feed his drug habit.

If she met such a decent person, a child concieved would be likely to have a much better start in life and not turn out like the **** future father she is now with.

Hell man least it will be a few quid that isnt going from your taxes to funding warfare

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

well I know for a fact they still terminate after a foetus is viable. A friend of my ex wife gave birth at 22 weeks and the child survived at that time they still terminated at 24 weeks. I do not know if thats still the case

Lets conveniently ignore the following shall we? While we're feeling righteous and using a single case of 22 weeks to show how awful 24 weeks is...

Originally Posted by http://www.tommys.org/media/statistics/key-statistics/premature-birth-statistics.htm

Survival rates

Babies born at 23 weeks have a 17% chance of survival

Babies born at 24 weeks have a 39% chance of survival

Babies born at 25 weeks have a 50% chance of survival

From 32 weeks onwards, most babies are able to survive with the help of medical Technology [EPICure data]

Outcomes

1 in 10 premature babies will develop a permanent disability such as lung disease, cerebral palsy, blindness or deafness.

50% of premature babies born before the 26th week of gestation are disabled, a quarter severely so. (Fowler GA. Preemie problems: the sobering statistics. US News World Reports 2000; vol 129: pp56).

Of children born before 26 weeks' gestation, results in 241 of the surviving children at six years (early school age) indicate a high level of disability as follows:

* 22% severe disability (defined as cerebral palsy but not walking, low cognitive scores, blindness, profound deafness)
* 24% moderate disability (defined as cerebral palsy but walking, IQ/cognitive scores in the special needs range, lesser degree of visual or hearing impairment)
* 34% mild disability (defined as low IQ/cognitive score, squint, requiring glasses)
* 20% no problems

Tommy's, that well known pro-abortion organisation.

If your ex-wife's friend's baby is perfectly healthy, then fantastic, she managed to beat the odds, just don't try using her as an argument to suggest that because her baby was ok at 22 weeks, most babies will be.

[Escapee]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

Hell man least it will be a few quid that isnt going from your taxes to funding warfare

I disagree, as I Work in the very buoyant defense industry I welcome lots of cash in that direction.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Exactly, the pill, condoms, coil, injection, implant, even vasectomies can still result in pregnancies.

Interesting how the BBC portrayed the statistics regarding the 54 with 8 or more, rather than stating, as suggested by the quote, that 33 were over 30 years old (ie the majority), they try to put it into the reader's mind the idea that they're being used through recklessness by suggesting youngsters are using it so often, leaving the reader (who's generally lazy) to do the maths.

I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave earlier ....


Update

I've just found this which quotes the source:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...bortion120.xml

and this by chance (from 2004):

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...ixnewstop.html

Which doesn't say much for the BPAS's ethics at that time.


and this:

http://www.prochoiceforum.org.uk/comm65.asp

"Nevertheless, today abortion is an essential method of family planning and should be accepted it as such."

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Osem

and this:

http://www.prochoiceforum.org.uk/comm65.asp

"Nevertheless, today abortion is an essential method of family planning and should be accepted it as such."

Lets just add some context shall we?

For many women, abortion currently acts as an essential back-up to contraception, necessary to enable them to regulate their fertility and plan their families. Since individuals are expected to plan their families, abortion is now considered by most sections of society as a 'fact of life'. In early pregnancy at least, abortion is viewed by most as preferable to unwanted childbirth.

· In this context, it is inappropriate for abortion to be considered as a problem - rather it is a solution to a problem.

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Lets conveniently ignore the following shall we? While we're feeling righteous and using a single case of 22 weeks to show how awful 24 weeks is...



Tommy's, that well known pro-abortion organisation.

If your ex-wife's friend's baby is perfectly healthy, then fantastic, she managed to beat the odds, just don't try using her as an argument to suggest that because her baby was ok at 22 weeks, most babies will be.

by your own statistics then I put you that some babies are aborted that with the correct medical care could have survived but are left to die .... MURDER

17 out of every 100 abortions performed at 23 weeks could have survived .... MURDER
39 out of every 100 abortions performed at 24 weeks could have survived .... MURDER

Possibly 10 % estimated at your statistics would have suffered no disability so thats 4 or 5 out of every 200 abortions performed at 23 or 24 weeks would have survived with no problems tell me thats not MURDER

Tell me this if I was to kill you just 1 person with no physical or mental problem (apart from acute left wing disease ) could I possibly get away without a MURDER charge????

[tweetypie/8]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

I will get flamed for this but I personally think abortion for any other reason than severe handicapped is tantamount to murder . Abortion for choice imo is just wrong .

how right you are zing.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

by your own statistics then I put you that some babies are aborted that with the correct medical care could have survived but are left to die .... MURDER

17 out of every 100 abortions performed at 23 weeks could have survived .... MURDER
39 out of every 100 abortions performed at 24 weeks could have survived .... MURDER

Possibly 10 % estimated at your statistics would have suffered no disability so thats 4 or 5 out of every 200 abortions performed at 23 or 24 weeks would have survived with no problems tell me thats not MURDER

Tell me this if I was to kill you just 1 person with no physical or mental problem (apart from acute left wing disease ) could I possibly get away without a MURDER charge????

You've forgetting that there is no way of knowing, you're also trying to portray an either or situation, either they die or they're happy healthy productive members of society, ignoring that of those 17 out of 100 which "may" have survived, all but one will suffer disabilities.

I laugh at you calling a staunch Tory supporter "acute left wing" by the way.

Have you ever had an abortion Zing?
Ever found out that your partner aborted your child?

You say all but 1 so your saying its ok to kill that 1. ffs man 1 is to many 1 in 1.000.000 would be to many

No I have never been involved in abortion but I have a wonderful daughter who keeps me sane here and I have a nearly 4 year old who I have never seen due to relationship issues with her mother however I certainly would rather know she is alive than dead.

Have you been involved in abortion? if so is your conscience clear or does it not plague you some nights do you never wake up in a cold sweat thinking about holding that baby nurturing her/him seeing it grow develop its first steps first words??? all quashed cuz maybe you or your partner thought " im not ready"??

Life is the most precious thing you can give to take a human life appalls me and I see a foetus as a life no matter what science you argue.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

Have you been involved in abortion? if so is your conscience clear or does it not plague you some nights do you never wake up in a cold sweat thinking about holding that baby nurturing her/him seeing it grow develop its first steps first words??? all quashed cuz maybe you or your partner thought " im not ready"??

Yes I have been, no it doesn't plague me, why would it?
Does it plague you when you fap one off into a kleenex, or when your partner has her period? Do you wake during the night in a cold sweat wondering what if you hadn't decided not to get pregnant, that stain on the bedsheets would have grown up into a human being, but you chose to prevent that from happened?

what a crock mate well you obviously made your choice between you well done

BTW I have not had a partner for over a year and sperm does not live that long so your little analogy is cow poop. You obvious dipped your wick whether you were one of the unlucky 1% or you didnt take precautions you obviously wasn't "ready" to take responsibility for your actions and decided to just flush it

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

what a crock mate well you obviously made your choice between you well done

BTW I have not had a partner for over a year and sperm does not live that long so your little analogy is cow poop. You obvious dipped your wick whether you were one of the unlucky 1% or you didnt take precautions you obviously wasn't "ready" to take responsibility for your actions and decided to just flush it

You have no idea what you're talking about Zing, as usual, instead you're making assumptions about a situation you've never been in, and for your sake I hope you never are.