UKTV widescreen resolution.

[DVD Cinema]

Is it me, or is Dave on Virgin Media, part of the UKTV widescreen group to be, at a lower resolution that it is on DTT Freeview?

[Mick Fisher]

I've always had the feeling that PQ on Freeview was better that VM but that's down to bitrate.
As for WS resolution I would think it fills the screen on a WS TV. If it doesn't it's not WS.
I'm not quite clear as to what you are getting at here.

[DVD Cinema]

The bitrates on Virgin Media are higher than Freeview actually.

Is Dave on Virgin Media 720x576 full PAL line resolution, or is it 544x576, like on a lot of Freeview channels, which along with their low bitrates on Freeview, makes for a poorer picture?

[Mick Fisher]

I'm still a bit lost on this. 720x576 = 1.25:1 Res. This would display as full screen on a SD TV. It's certainly not WS which is going to be at around 1.76:1.
544x576 = 0.94:1, or should it be 576x544? which = 1.06:1.. still making not much sense to me.

As you may remember my VM DTV experience was atrocious which is why I now have Sky+.

Using Dave as an example, from what I remember as I almost never bother to watch it, the PQ between Freeview and Sky is pretty much identical. Back when I had VM DTV the PQ on Dave (or as it was UKTV Gold2) was below that of Freeview, like watching a mpeg4 movie from poor filmstock and with a bitrate below 800. Not unwatchable but with grain and unnatural contrast levels and colours.

As a matter of interest how does one find out the actual bit rate and the resolution of broadcasted material. All my assumptions are just based on perception.

[nialli]

My experience has been that Freeview's okay for the BBC channels but everything else on the platform has very poor PQ, especially the likes of More4, E4 and Film4. The Virgin TV channels (Dave, UKHistory, Virgin1) are a little better. Lots of digital artefacts and poor rendering. And I live in an area with perfect Freeview reception (couple of miles from Crystal Palace) with three separate Freeview tuners to compare (two built in to TVs, the third in my Panasonic DVD recorder).
By comparison, the picture on both my V+ and Samsung V box is fantastic; no contest. I'm viewing the V+ via HDMI and the quality is near-HD (on the SD rendering). Samsung is on a smaller Sony screen (20") via SCART and is a huge improvement over the Freeview on the set.
Obviously experiences are different for everyone, but if you find Freeview superior to VM's picture, there was something wrong with your local config.

[Mick Fisher]

Originally Posted by nialli

My experience has been that Freeview's okay for the BBC channels but everything else on the platform has very poor PQ, especially the likes of More4, E4 and Film4. The Virgin TV channels (Dave, UKHistory, Virgin1) are a little better. Lots of digital artefacts and poor rendering. And I live in an area with perfect Freeview reception (couple of miles from Crystal Palace) with three separate Freeview tuners to compare (two built in to TVs, the third in my Panasonic DVD recorder).
By comparison, the picture on both my V+ and Samsung V box is fantastic; no contest. I'm viewing the V+ via HDMI and the quality is near-HD (on the SD rendering). Samsung is on a smaller Sony screen (20") via SCART and is a huge improvement over the Freeview on the set.
Obviously experiences are different for everyone, but if you find Freeview superior to VM's picture, there was something wrong with your local config.

I don't doubt that there was but what with the necessity to reboot every day in order to get the EPG to load, the rediculous warnings shown twice a day about "you can't use your remote as we are updating some settings" and as VM showed absolutely no interest in fixing it with repeated engineers telling me "that's just the way it is you will have to put up with it" I dumped it and got Sky+. I have found Sky+ vastly superior to VM DTV in every conceivable way.
I see from posts here that many people suffer the same problems.
According to some posters though, they never or seldom have to reboot and find their VM DTV more than satifactory but if I am to believe the many engineers who have attended then the whole VM DTV network was as poor as my service. Who to believe? Well I only have my own experience to use as a yardstick and so it is the only standard I can judge the service by, everything else is hearsay.

Originally Posted by Mick Fisher

I'm still a bit lost on this. 720x576 = 1.25:1 Res. This would display as full screen on a SD TV. It's certainly not WS which is going to be at around 1.76:1.
544x576 = 0.94:1, or should it be 576x544? which = 1.06:1.. still making not much sense to me.

As you may remember my VM DTV experience was atrocious which is why I now have Sky+.

Using Dave as an example, from what I remember as I almost never bother to watch it, the PQ between Freeview and Sky is pretty much identical. Back when I had VM DTV the PQ on Dave (or as it was UKTV Gold2) was below that of Freeview, like watching a mpeg4 movie from poor filmstock and with a bitrate below 800. Not unwatchable but with grain and unnatural contrast levels and colours.

As a matter of interest how does one find out the actual bit rate and the resolution of broadcasted material. All my assumptions are just based on perception.

SD Tv at full res is indeed 720x576 however thats only the display resolution. Broadcasters can reduce the bitrate required by reducing the horizontal resolution. The STB in the customers house has to take the broadcast signal and re-create the full res 720x576 image again.
544 horizontal res is not uncommon. Some channels go even lower!