Shocking Service From Virgin Media

[Incomplete]

Originally Posted by Incomplete

4-6Mbit seems a reasonable guesstimate. 2.61km as crow flies, around 4km of cable length.

Yeah 6Mbit.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by Incomplete

Loop loss averages 10dB / km. Another 3dB or so is added by CPE equipment. I'm spot on for that, 1.4km line, 17dB downstream attenuation.

---------- Post added at 08:19 ---------- Previous post was at 08:17 ----------



Ewww Talk Talk

Who states the average is 10db loss per km? I have seen it quoted by mrsaffron on adslguide but I do not just use my experience I use everyone who reports theirs. Most people who report their stats and line length have a higher then 10db loss per km and I think that is either a made up figure or miscalculated.

I stand by what I said based on reported figures the average loop loss is considerably above 10db per km most likely due to poor quality cabling. For some people its over 20db per km so I have not based on high end and my own line is actually 17db loss per km.

I would use long lines as a better comparison.

My sisters line is 0.8 real length 0.3 straight and is also 17db attenuation.
Friends line is 4.9 real length 4.4 straight and is 48 db attenuation (so almost 10db loss per km)
Another friend is 1.5 real length and has 39 db attenuation
Various people have reported their attenuation and know their actual line lengths and all are around 15 per km loop loss.

This 10db I suspect is based on specs for good quality new copper which doesnt apply to most of BTs local loop.

I can see now why you so happy about BTs loops you are one of the lucky 25% with a short line, and many of these take the I am alright Jack attitude in that because they have good specs they assume all is good.

[Incomplete]

BT use a cable model: a telephone line of 0.5mm copper, 1km long will loose 10.301 dB at 300kHz.

If you think they are lying about this or are incorrect I'd suggest you contact Ofcom. BT also may want to know as all their advertising of their fixed rate services were based on this assumption.

That or BT may know more than your knowledge based on reading internet forums about their own network.

Regarding your other comments I never said anything about the quality or otherwise of BT's network so all I can say to that is (hate this word but) whatever - I have had the pleasure of troubleshooting a lot of BT copper related issues on DSL lines so I assume nothing.

Anyway sorry to disturb your now cross-thread rant. BT are rubbish, ADSL is rubbish, worst network in the world, crap copper everywhere gone green, BT intentionally make lines longer, etc, etc.

If you want to see crap lines go check out some other countries such as USA and Canada with all overhead loading coiled and bridge tapped gack, or Australia with a fixed very strict distance and very low speed DSL deal.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by Incomplete

BT use a cable model: a telephone line of 0.5mm copper, 1km long will loose 10.301 dB at 300kHz.

If you think they are lying about this or are incorrect I'd suggest you contact Ofcom. BT also may want to know as all their advertising of their fixed rate services were based on this assumption.

That or BT may know more than your knowledge based on reading internet forums about their own network.

Regarding your other comments I never said anything about the quality or otherwise of BT's network so all I can say to that is (hate this word but) whatever - I have had the pleasure of troubleshooting a lot of BT copper related issues on DSL lines so I assume nothing.

Anyway sorry to disturb your now cross-thread rant. BT are rubbish, ADSL is rubbish, worst network in the world, crap copper everywhere gone green, BT intentionally make lines longer, etc, etc.

If you want to see crap lines go check out some other countries such as USA and Canada with all overhead loading coiled and bridge tapped gack, or Australia with a fixed very strict distance and very low speed DSL deal.

When and where have BT stated they use 0.5mm copper for all their lines? I have heard from numerous BT employees that the copper used varies from location to location, the unluckiest will have poor aluminium cable and the luckiest will have thicker good quality copper cabling, so straight off when you mention 0.5mm copper cable I am already seeing question marks, what % of lines use 0.5? if no % is defined then thats something else that puts that into dispute. I also suspect specs on paper the ones you have written will generally be worse then real experience due to corrosion and ageing of the copper.

[on in an hour!]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

When and where have BT stated they use 0.5mm copper for all their lines? I have heard from numerous BT employees that the copper used varies from location to location, the unluckiest will have poor aluminium cable and the luckiest will have thicker good quality copper cabling, so straight off when you mention 0.5mm copper cable I am already seeing question marks, what % of lines use 0.5? if no % is defined then thats something else that puts that into dispute. I also suspect specs on paper the ones you have written will generally be worse then real experience due to corrosion and ageing of the copper.

this ones warming up..niiiccceeee

[Incomplete]

Originally Posted by on in an hour!

this ones warming up..niiiccceeee

Sorry to disappoint but it's not going to warm up anymore.

I did type a big response then realised how pointless it is dignifying the above with a response. I don't engage in discussion on technical matters with people whose experience is internet forums and who have an agenda as they consider the service this technology supplies them inadequate.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by on in an hour!

this ones warming up..niiiccceeee

I wont be commenting on this much more dont want to get into a slanging match, I just advise anyone looking into getting into adsl to do your research and try and find out of neighbours what their service is like.

[jcw00]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

I just advise anyone looking into getting into adsl to do your research and try and find out of neighbours what their service is like.

Good point.