might give Linux OS 2007 a go - Page 8

The Jackal · 02-03-2007, 18:23

Its falling on deaf ears popper

popper · 02-03-2007, 19:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

course any old Joe can install windows its all wizard run as any old Joe should be able to install Linux however its what happens next thats the problem.
I spent a lot of time learning what I know and im no No0b however if linux worked out the box with easy to install drivers and run everything I need for day to day computing without having to compile everything then I woudl consider learning other aspects of the system.
Why should I have to read paragraphs of text to install a driver? or a piece of software? no thank you. If linux is ever going to become mainstream it will need to more user friendly if it does not then it wont

one thing I have noticed is when I express my views on Linux I get talked down to by the Linux fanboys something to be honest im not prepared to tolerate

hopefully not by me zing, i might use both windows and linux, they still dont give me what i want most in my better machine.

even after all this time while their both reasonable OS's for the x86 based hardware, its fast true but the bios, the shells, and the GUI are just not intigrated liek the AMIGA was.

i wonder if the LinuxBios will be the one that finally makes somthing like the amiga firmware options available.

if you never went past games back in the day, then you wont understand what im after, but heres a few SIMPLES things that would help any current x86 hardware today.

power up the amiga and hold down the two mouse buttons and the intigrated GUI pops up with ANY harddrive you happen to have configured to be a boot drive.

you can set any no. of harddrives to be bootable,not just limited to 4 primary drive partitions..... ( i dont count logical drives s their junk, do it real or not at all ).

i did a test once and had something like 12 hd's all bootable and selectable from the built-in GUI mouse menu.

a simple GUI (anything useable , i dont care what, inside linuxBios, cut down rebol might be nice)that works like the amiga firmware GUI, a simple port/rewrite of the amiga shell and/or its kingcon device so the shell apps can be used.

two very simple shell apps that take advantage of the fact the basic GUI exists in the bios and can be used to make very simple but effective end user GUI's, these being requestchoice and requestfile

its works as simple as this:

requestchoice "this is a window name" "1" "2" "3" "0"

puts up the simple GUI window with a title of 'this is a window name'
and 4 mouse clickable buttons , with end one always being the return and quite option.

with these simple basic things, it becames so simple to make GUI front-ends that were controlled from the amiga cli/shell for ANY cli app you care to mention.

sure, the amiga is dead to most, and its underpowered, theres always open AROS for x86, but again let down by no current way to get a good GUI bios etc.....

to this day, it cant be done because theres NO basic GUI code inside the x86 bios that can open to a shell/cli when theres no OS already installed or running from ram.

give me a linuxBios or 3rd party bios that can be installed on todays hardware, thats got the GUI, the cli/shell, and the basic built-in commands to make basic GUI's controlled by scripts and we have the beginnings of something better.

and it seems linuxBios if the tech devs think different for once or look to amiga bios for idea's (see winUAE emulation to try these options), can include all the innovations the amiga bios included and make them available to future generations of x86 and other cpu's, a GUI inside the bios with cli windows/linux/anything you care to mention, linkable emulation can be a very good thing to bring the hardware and software closer together, intigration as it should be...... and dont forget real HAL.

---------- Post added at 19:09 ---------- Previous post was at 18:56 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrC-3rr0r

Its falling on deaf ears popper

no, i just think zing, and many others perhaps just need a reason and the right livecd to try and give them a salution to their problem, then they will look at linux and whatever else and begin the lerning curve.

in the case of zing, he's hardware interest/invested, so needs good hardware options to make his work and play easyer, harddrive images playing a very big part of his time and effort, Hence the freeNAS and Ghost4Linux might interest him.

given that zing will have masses of old machine parts and drives sitting around plus the needed network cards, it would be easy to download,burn and boot freeNAS and give it a try,

it would also probably interest people that need or want large harddrive storage but dont want to be bothered installing a windows OS from scratch just to get their old unused box running as a network storage and put it in another room somewere so they dont need to hear it.

then if i ever find that elusive DVB-T yuan livecd with vlc then that too can become a good cheap TV network device, that too might interest some other people into TV recording storage/serving.

i could go make my own special livecd or instll a full distro but a generic working livecd is alwasy going to get far more interest from the average windows crowd as its boot and go, no install required until later after you see it to be a good option for your needs....

02-03-2007, 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by dev

assuming you mean this thread => http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...ad.php?t=33229 it seems you were learning fine, even made a post saying you fixed a problem on your own. as you stated in the thread you just 'need the intrest bug to hit me' so you now seem to just not be interested and seeing as you seem to be able to learn it quite easily i dont get your apparent hate for it

choosing distributions from large american companies (redhat/fedora for example) is a bad move as the american laws are enforced onto you (no mp3/dvd playback by default) whereas smaller / non-american based distributions are free to include mp3/dvd playback

---------- Post added at 16:20 ---------- Previous post was at 16:15 ----------

have a look at http://ext2fsd.sourceforge.net/

afaik it enables read access for both ext2/3, not sure on writing never used it to write

Im being realistic when I say its not got a place in the mainstream yet im not wrong either

---------- Post added at 19:11 ---------- Previous post was at 19:10 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrC-3rr0r

Its falling on deaf ears popper

you dont seem to be listening to me much either

The Jackal · 02-03-2007, 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by popper

i wonder if the LinuxBios will be the one that finally makes somthing like the amiga firmware options available.

Last time I looked linuxBIOS was still a little immature ?

Mind you I have never used so really shouldn't comment like that.
Also I thought that it was just specific to loading a kernel to operate the motherboards hardware bits. After that you'll still need to boot the machine as normal either by using a windows kernel or linux kernel

Wouldn't it be lovely though if linuxBIOS was installed as defaults on all motherboards

BIOS throws back the error :
" Mr Zinglebard : Is that a WINDOWS CD that you are trying to boot and install "

---------- Post added at 19:18 ---------- Previous post was at 19:12 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by zinglebarb

you dont seem to be listening to me much either

I am listening to you mate

" You said you dont care you dont wanna know : Learning Linux is not gonna put bread on the table blah blah blah "

But we're the Linux Jehovah's witnesses and we believe theres a wrong way and OUR way.

ps When I said " Its falling on deaf ears popper " I was referring to Zing

pps Its all getting a bit silly now

Jon T · 02-03-2007, 19:34

In some respects Linux in it's current form is a bit like Win 3.11, it worked, but god did you have to battle to get it to work(especially in respect of adding new hardware). Maybe in a few years Linux will mature(as Win 3.11) did, into a "pickup and use" OS, but at the moment it is nowhere near that point.

Zingle, your right IMHO in saying that Linux hasn't got a place in the mainstream yet, but you need to narrow that down a bit, you mean the Desktop Mainstream, I say this because(and I can't remember the precise percentage), over 80% of the websites on the 'net are served up by Apache running on Linux.

I do run Linux based systems myself, but not at the desktop level. ATM, i've got a IPCOP firewall/gateway runnning, and a FreeNAS box.

popper · 02-03-2007, 21:45

im not sure but theres this
http://www.osnews.com/story.php/1737...d-by-LinuxBIOS

---------- Post added at 20:27 ---------- Previous post was at 19:46 ----------

The Future of Packaging Software in Linux

[ Saturday, 17 February 2007, kocio ]

http://polishlinux.org/linux/the-fut...ware-in-linux/

---------- Post added at 20:34 ---------- Previous post was at 20:27 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gavin

Me too, for what it is. The trouble is with it, is that 'official' NTFS-write support is experimental/beta, and I just can't risk my data on that. So using Ubuntu is kind of limited for me. Just a shame there isn't a single file system that is universal to all.

I do like the way that both Ubuntu, Mandriva and Gentoo happily recognised my NIC whereas Windows needs an additional driver off the mobo CD.

NTFS-3G 1.0 Released
Linked by Thom Holwerda on 2007-02-21 16:50:56 UTC, submitted by Dominique
http://www.osnews.com/story.php/1732...G-1.0-Released
http://www.ntfs-3g.org/
"
NTFS-3G Read/Write Driver

Updated: February 28, 2007

The NTFS-3G driver is an open source, freely available read/write NTFS driver for Linux and other operating systems. It provides safe and fast handling of the Windows XP, Windows Server 2003, Windows 2000 and Windows Vista file systems. Most POSIX file system operations are supported, with the exception of full file ownership and access right support.
The purpose of the project is to develop, continuously quality test and support a trustable, feature rich and high performance solution for hardware platforms and operating systems whose users need to reliably interoperate with NTFS. Besides this practical goal, the project also aims to explore the limits of a hybrid, kernel/user space file system driver approach. Performance, reliability and feature richness per invested effort are being examined. The driver is in STABLE status. Please see our test methods and testimonials on the driver quality page. "

---------- Post added at 20:44 ---------- Previous post was at 20:34 ----------

Quote:

Xaccers said:
The point is the players aren't legally capable of playing encrypted DVDs
Think of it like this, just because you can get in a car, turn it on and head down the street, if you don't have a license to do it, you can't do it legally.

that might be true..., however if you have your own private road/track , you can drive that car on there as much as you like and no unlawful act has taken place.

private road=fair use in most countrys consumer laws.

---------- Post added at 21:09 ---------- Previous post was at 20:44 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gavin

Again, what is the point of a HD if you can't write to it? Firstly, all my work is there, which can't be updated. Secondly its where all my storage space is. I can only download upto the limit of my ext3 petition which is about 20 gig

[edit] sorry cobby, you got there as usual before me 8)
already gave you the stable windows filesystem but you can go the other way too.

http://verens.com/archives/2005/09/3...t3-in-windows/
http://www.fs-driver.org/index.html
"
If you currently have Windows running and you realize that you need some files for your work which you have stored on an Ext2 volume of your Linux installation, you no longer have to shut down Windows and boot Linux!
Furthermore, Windows will now be able to handle floppy disks which have been formatted with an Ext2 file system.
Linux Ext3 volumes can also be accessed. To do that, please read the FAQ section. "
http://search.virginmedia.com/result...for+windows&cr=

---------- Post added at 21:27 ---------- Previous post was at 21:09 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gareth

Have been using ntfs-fuse for a while now, and not had any problems with it whatsoever. I'll probably switch to ntfs-3g some time but for now I've not had any issues with ntfs-fuse.

To get it working, you just create a directory, e.g. /media/Windows and then edit the /etc/fstab to point the NTFS partition to the new directory... add a couple more options (mine looks like this...
/dev/sda1 /media/Windows ntfs-fuse auto,user_xattr,umask=000 1 1) and it'll automatically be available when you next reboot.

If you want to restrict access to the NTFS partition to only certain users, it can be done too very easily.

I've yet to find a way, however, of getting my Windows installation to access my ext3 partitions in either RO or RW mode.

http://www.fs-driver.org/faq.html#acc_ext3

---------- Post added at 21:45 ---------- Previous post was at 21:27 ----------

as a side note regarding paying a licence to the patent holder of the software decoder, its wise to consider this.
http://www.number-10.gov.uk/output/Page11077.asp
"
The Government remains committed to its policy that no patents should exist for inventions which make advances lying solely in the field of software.

Although certain jurisdictions, such as the US, allow more liberal patenting of software-based inventions, these patents cannot be enforced in the UK.

The test used to discern between patentable and non-patentable subject matter in the UK has recently been clarified by the courts, and is applied rigorously by the Patent Office.

Under this test, the true nature of the advance being claimed in a patent application must be determined, and if this advance lies solely in the field of software, or another non-technical field such as methods of doing business, the patent will not be granted.

If the advance being made by an invention does lie in a technical field, it must also be non-obvious and sufficiently clearly described for the invention to be reproduced before a patent will be granted by the Patent Office.

The recently published Gowers Review of Intellectual Property, an independent review commissioned by the Government, recommended that patent rights should not be extended to cover pure software, business methods and genes.

The Government will implement those recommendations for which it is responsible, and will therefore continue to exclude patents from areas where they may hinder innovation: including patents which are too broad, speculative, or obvious, or where the advance they make lies in an excluded area such as software."

in the case of hardware dvd players, the IP payment is for the hardware decoder inside the player, not any software that the hardware might include unless its in the US.

Alien · 02-03-2007, 22:00

Q. What's the difference between an evangelical Linux fanboy & a Jehovas Witness?

A. The Jehovas Witness will leave you alone if you don't answer the door!

Tristan · 03-03-2007, 01:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

The point is the players aren't legally capable of playing encrypted DVDs

Think of it like this, just because you can get in a car, turn it on and head down the street, if you don't have a license to do it, you can't do it legally.

Now if someone were to tell you how to circumvent the encryption so you can play encrypted DVD's without a license through this forum, technically that'd be encouraging and aiding others to breach copyright (we're not in Norway).

Or think of it like this.

Any device capable of reading from CDs requires a fee to be paid to Sony and Philips, the inventors of the format (although I think the 25-year patent time limit is up soon). That means your stereo, your computer CD-ROM drives, and your in-car CD player. Likewise, the DVD Consortium collects patent fees from anyone who makes a device for reading DVDs.

Once you've bought a CD (for which the producer has earned a fee), and a device for reading said CD (for which the inventor of the format has earned a fee), you can play it any time you like with any program you like in any operating system you like.

Once you've bought a DVD (producer earns money), and a device for reading said DVD (inventors earn money), why on earth should there be any extra restrictions on how and when I can play it?

Watching CSS-encoded DVDs on Linux is certainly not breach of copyright. All copyright covers is, well, copying, which isn't taking place. DVD videos aren't commercial software. There's no End User Licence Agreement that comes with a DVD stating certain conditions of use. At best, you could claim that the CSS-decoding software violates certain software patents. However, unlike the US, software patents aren't valid in the UK, so this isn't a worry. (And besides, the standard libdvdcss2 library doesn't actually do this: it just generates all the 110 or so possible CSS keys, and tries each one to see whether it works.)

No, this country isn't Norway, but happily we're not the US either. Software patents simply do not apply in this country, and so many things you read about that require a licence in the US (such as MP3 or WMV decoding) can be freely implemented in this country without fear of illegality.

And long may it remain so.

The Jackal · 03-03-2007, 03:49

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjKbnk-Vh2I

LOL This guy almost hates linux as much as Zing !

I was in stitches watching this guy struggling to set up wireless on ubuntu but hell at least he's trying.

Alien · 03-03-2007, 04:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrC-3rr0r

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjKbnk-Vh2I

LOL This guy almost hates linux as much as Zing !

I was in stitches watching this guy struggling to set up wireless on ubuntu but hell at least he's trying.

03-03-2007, 07:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrC-3rr0r

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjKbnk-Vh2I

LOL This guy almost hates linux as much as Zing !

I was in stitches watching this guy struggling to set up wireless on ubuntu but hell at least he's trying.

I dont like linux im not gonna use it my choice not yours im just gonna ignore these threads in future and ill ignore you also

Gareth · 03-03-2007, 16:46

At least you've tried it, mate. You don't get along with it or find that it doesn't suit your needs... that's fine. It's the people that won't try it and still slag it off that do my head in.

03-03-2007, 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrC-3rr0r

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjKbnk-Vh2I

LOL This guy almost hates linux as much as Zing !

I was in stitches watching this guy struggling to set up wireless on ubuntu but hell at least he's trying.

^^^ That attitude does my head in. I accept that people wont agree with me but this man seems to not accept the same

AntiSilence · 03-03-2007, 17:16

I have recently been messing with Ubuntu and Kubuntu just to see what they're like. They both worked with my hardware (nForce2 chipset) so the network card worked, and the soundcard worked. The graphics seemed to work, but wouldn't let me set a higher resolution that 1024x768. I asked CRC about this and he informed me of a file to edit. Tried that, it wouldn't let me save the file due to permissions. Found the file manually, and chose to open it as Root, edited it and saved it. Still not working.

Kubuntu's display options detected my card correctly (GeForce 6800GT) and I selected the card, but still wouldn't change resolution. In addition, the selection box (mouse button down and drag thing) is very sluggish when over a certain size. I presume this is because the gfx drivers are open source and not from nVidia.

Had a look on the nVidia site and found some Linux drivers. Downloaded and had a quick look, some compiling was required so didn't bother with that.

Got fed up of looking at 1024x768 desktop so quickly plugged my XP drive back in.

Overall, looked nice. I liked the virtual desktop feature and the OS Updater was worked nicer than the Windows one, and I can see why some people like it. But it's definitely not for me. Maybe on a second PC, but no way as a main OS since I would then have to leave my BF2 clan unless you can get BF2 working.

ZrByte · 03-03-2007, 17:17

Zing, CRC, If you two don't stop arguing, so help me I will pull this forum over and head home!!!!