A little inside information by an Employee.

[davie765]

Having just read the first post in this thread I felt I had to post this (my first post) sorry if in not reading the 100's of other posts I'm taking this off topic, I will read up now.

I for one am quite happy with the service I get from NTL for my broadband, the digital tv's not bad when the remote works or the guide doesnt freeze, maybe one day they will be able to work out how to send a bill correctly.

I have been with NTL since the original 512K broadband and I can honestly say over the last nearly 6 years I have probably had 1 maybe 2 correct bills !!.

My last bill has over 100 quids worth of credit covering cockups and even a goodwill 30 pound credit for all the stress I've been caused, however it also contains 14 pounds worth of telephone calls to the customer support centre sorting out all the problems in the first case.

And as for VOD !!! apparently I watched the same episode of lost 3 time in a row, the woman in CS said that if I hadnt watched it, I wouldn't have had it on my bill (along with a 4.99 adult program I've never watched) I suggested that she counted the number of credits on my bill to see how accurate her billing system was .

Being a complete masochist I've decided to give them one more chance with no VOD or support calls and see if they get it right, if not I will be 'attempting' to cancel my subscription to the wonderful world on NTL.

AAAAARRRGGGHHHHH !!!!!!!!!

P.S. sorry for the venting it was either this or kick the cat !! (jk)

[themelon]

Originally Posted by gooner4life

it was a safety reason, a vehicle catching on it etc.

also BT will compensate those customers greatly unlike ntl.

21CN will be to the home as well, they will be getting rid of system x switches, everything will be cabled up in the exchanges, frames engineers will be a thing of the past.

customers will dial a number or log onto a website to order a product and by the time they finish the call to an automated system or browse to a different page the product will be active on the customers account and delivered via 21CN.

i've worked for NTL, BT and Homechoice, i've never seen a network as impressive as 21CN albeit they were just the plans.

To be fair though the BT speaker wire isnt exactly dangerous to a passing vehicle, if it is tall enough it will just rip it in half and the voltage agint exactly gonna kill anyone!

Maybe if the had maintained the wire in the first place, it would not have been dangling so low and they would not have needed to cut it.

BT will only compensate the customers 10 days of line rental, EXACTLY the same and ntl and the minimum agreed by OFCOM. Apparently it has been quite hard for these people to get this applied to their account involving lots of department bouncing.

21CN really is a waste of time, it is BT trying to 'big up' themselves and look like they are improving something, when infact the end result for the customer will be negliable. As mentioned by many previously the current core BT network to the exchanges is already very good, probably amongst the best in the World, the real let down is the section from exchnage to the home.

If BT were to replace this to all homes in the UK it would cost them billions and probably send them bankrupt, they may implement it over say the next 50/100 years but it will not happen in 5 Years, most likely not 10 or even 25 years.

BTs record is as poor if not worse than ntl on delivering services on time. Were is the BT VOD service promised for 2006?? We have BT Home hub which 'apparently' supports VOD, Home Hub incidently is crap and has the wireless range of a portable tv aerial made from a coathanger. I suspect that the VOD service isnt working very well due to the bandwidth limitations and would be more trouble than it is worth to them.

Replacing the core network will achieve nothing, it will be super fast to exchanges, then as crap as it is now on victorian speaker wire to your house. I am amazed that BT do not even see it as a requirement to provide a line that doesnt crackle to their customers, If I want a new line I have to pay for it.

[Womble]

Originally Posted by themelon

Home Hub incidently is crap and has the wireless range of a portable tv aerial made from a coathanger.

I thought it was quite good. I set one up for a friend of mine, very easy, even had port forwading pre-set for emule, torrents and gaming! And VoIP for cheap calls

I [I]thought[I] 21CN was the first steps to going over completely to an IP network. Then BT will run it out to customers.

What would BT benefit from doing VOD? They make a fortune without that hassle. They also have an agreement with Sky.... don't they?

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by themelon

To be fair though the BT speaker wire isnt exactly dangerous to a passing vehicle, if it is tall enough it will just rip it in half and the voltage agint exactly gonna kill anyone!

Maybe if the had maintained the wire in the first place, it would not have been dangling so low and they would not have needed to cut it.

BT will only compensate the customers 10 days of line rental, EXACTLY the same and ntl and the minimum agreed by OFCOM. Apparently it has been quite hard for these people to get this applied to their account involving lots of department bouncing.

21CN really is a waste of time, it is BT trying to 'big up' themselves and look like they are improving something, when infact the end result for the customer will be negliable. As mentioned by many previously the current core BT network to the exchanges is already very good, probably amongst the best in the World, the real let down is the section from exchnage to the home.

If BT were to replace this to all homes in the UK it would cost them billions and probably send them bankrupt, they may implement it over say the next 50/100 years but it will not happen in 5 Years, most likely not 10 or even 25 years.

BTs record is as poor if not worse than ntl on delivering services on time. Were is the BT VOD service promised for 2006?? We have BT Home hub which 'apparently' supports VOD, Home Hub incidently is crap and has the wireless range of a portable tv aerial made from a coathanger. I suspect that the VOD service isnt working very well due to the bandwidth limitations and would be more trouble than it is worth to them.

Replacing the core network will achieve nothing, it will be super fast to exchanges, then as crap as it is now on victorian speaker wire to your house. I am amazed that BT do not even see it as a requirement to provide a line that doesnt crackle to their customers, If I want a new line I have to pay for it.

I took the no crackle for granted when I was with ntl, now on BT its incredibly annoying.

[popper]

Originally Posted by Womble

I thought it was quite good. I set one up for a friend of mine, very easy, even had port forwading pre-set for emule, torrents and gaming! And VoIP for cheap calls

I [i]thought 21CN was the first steps to going over completely to an IP network. Then BT will run it out to customers.

[i]What would BT benefit from doing VOD? They make a fortune without that hassle. They also have an agreement with Sky.... don't they?

here an old post now from the reg and while it IPTV ,that covers VOD too.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/11...its_way_part2/
part of the story,its 3 pages long:
IPTV/VoD: The world that's on its way
"
Industry comment One of the most common questions operators and analysts are asked is whether IPTV will happen, and if it does, whether if will deliver its promise.

The answer is probably not one you'd expect. It already has happened, and is already delivering. IP and internet technologies may not turn up on our doorstep or down our aerial socket tomorrow morning, but the key point to remember is that in 20 years it will be the dominant method of broadcasting.
The secret is in seeing the bigger picture. Rupert Murdoch infamously declared recently that market entrants need to operate in the mass market or in niche segments, or else they would be someone’s lunch in the middle ground.

Broadcasters have already seen it, as have a lot of telecoms companies. Cable operators are using IP over their coaxial wiring, every country has one or more "triple play" operators and both BT and Sky are evolving their businesses to so-called "hybrid" distribution that uses a combination of both traditional RF transmission and IP back-channel distribution through broadband.

The last mile copper network in the UK is too unreliable for immediate real-time video on-demand so these first services will see an incremental delivery pattern starting with offline "push" downloading onto PVR hard drives that gradually change to live video. BT's 21CN upgrade and digital switchover will help to drive the migration."

[themelon]

Originally Posted by Womble

I thought it was quite good. I set one up for a friend of mine, very easy, even had port forwading pre-set for emule, torrents and gaming! And VoIP for cheap calls

I [I]thought[I] 21CN was the first steps to going over completely to an IP network. Then BT will run it out to customers.

What would BT benefit from doing VOD? They make a fortune without that hassle. They also have an agreement with Sky.... don't they?

It is easy to set up, granted; but it is very expensive and not the best quality. You can purchase better equipment to do the same for less, I feel. The wireless range was poor, It had 3 bars in the same room yet my netgear router always has 5 and my rangemax is max in all rooms in the house.

I think BT would like to do VOD if they can get it to work as Quad play is the holy grail for all ISP/Telco/DTV Providers now.

[kibblerok]

Originally Posted by themelon

It is easy to set up, granted; but it is very expensive and not the best quality. You can purchase better equipment to do the same for less, I feel. The wireless range was poor, It had 3 bars in the same room yet my netgear router always has 5 and my rangemax is max in all rooms in the house.

Thats the point, its a market thats currently unfilled and has little awareness.

Touting wireless BB, security, free calls over the internet in one box supplied by good old trusty BT would be very popular and easy money from BTs view... now that customer have the hub, they're more likely to stick with their overpriced broadband and phone line.

Whether its good value or not is another matter.... these are the people that probably would have bought a crappy belkin router from PC world if they hadn't got the hub anyway.

[bowman]

Originally Posted by pharrell

Having worked for BT, Sky, TalkTalk (Carphone Warehouse) & HomeCall (Phones4u) whilst being a student, and now a full time position with NTL.Telewest I have the information to inform customers of all products and prices, and keep myself upto date with product information regularly.

First let me start off by saying, this offer everyone keeps talking about, with Sky giving free broadband, there is a 2Gibabyte monthly usage limit - as soon as this is exceeded, you will be charged accordingly - no company gives broadband away for free, and doesn't make a profit somewhere along the line, they have shareholders to please, not just their customers.

Secondly, BT's broadband, UPTO 8MB, only 7% of the UK are eligable to recieve this (you need to live close to the Local Exchange Data Centre), as BT use old 1870's copper wire network technology, when NTL.Telewest have fibre-optic cables which can support upto 100MB/s - To put this into perspective, South Korea only have fibre-optic cables, and their average broadband user is on a 90-100MB/s connection, and with Japan, they have the capability to give 1GB (1024MB) broadband to users - They have the fastest broadband connections in the world - so fibre-optics is the broadband of the future, where as BT would have to spend over £7billion to upgrade their networks, which I can't see them doing for at least the next 15/20years, and only because they will have to, to keep up with the rest of the world - and as TalkTalk, HomeCall, Sky, Toucan and any other major ISP all "piggy-back" on BT's network, they will be stuck in a loop too - why do you think AOL (America On-Line) have just signed a major contract with NTL.Telewest, so their customers can enjoy the benefits when the UK catches up with the rest of the world, especially the Far East.

As for the prices, NTL.Telewest give you free Line Rental (with CableTV packages), Free Weekend Calls to all Local & National UK home telephones - Our call package prices are dropping, we are the first company in Europe to offer "Quad-Play" - visit the websites, compare the prices, and you will see, NTL.Telewest works out cheaper, and you will be able to get it all on the one bill, so it's convenient too.

I know there will be questions and querys, so i'll drop by and answer them, untill then, Enjoy NTL.Telewest if you are with them, and if not, jump on the bandwagon quickly, or be stuck with the service a developing country would have.

Regards,

A Customer Care Advisor.

[Shaun]

Originally Posted by themelon

If BT were to replace this to all homes in the UK it would cost them billions and probably send them bankrupt, they may implement it over say the next 50/100 years but it will not happen in 5 Years, most likely not 10 or even 25 years.

You're just being silly now.

IF there's about 25 million res line in the UK then we can assume that to replace them will cost approximatly £100 (max) a line based on the fact that they charge between £125 and £175 to install a compmently new line.

25m x £100 = 2500m = 2.5bn.

Now pocket money but far less than BT are spending on 21CN and less than half of Ntls current debt (before they even think about ITV).

Once 21CN is rolled out (2010/11) I can see them spending this sort of money on upgrading the last mile.

It's the only sensible way to do it too, as what's the point in replacing the lines when there isn't anything (other than ADSL2+ which is mainly limited by line length not the age of the line) to plug them into in the exchange.

I can't see it taking 50 to 100 years either, that's just a silly exaggeration. It never took that long for BT to build its current network.

[popper]

Originally Posted by Shaun

You're just being silly now.

IF there's about 25 million res line in the UK then we can assume that to replace them will cost approximatly £100 (max) a line based on the fact that they charge between £125 and £175 to install a compmently new line.

25m x £100 = 2500m = 2.5bn.

Now pocket money but far less than BT are spending on 21CN and less than half of Ntls current debt (before they even think about ITV).

Once 21CN is rolled out (2010/11) I can see them spending this sort of money on upgrading the last mile.

It's the only sensible way to do it too, as what's the point in replacing the lines when there isn't anything (other than ADSL2+ which is mainly limited by line length not the age of the line) to plug them into in the exchange.

I can't see it taking 50 to 100 years either, that's just a silly exaggeration. It never took that long for BT to build its current network.

they could also ask the user to pay a % of the cost to , if for instance you pay £50, then they give you something in return
over the year or whatever deal the user might consider a bargin to get far better speeds etc.

[Shaun]

Either that or just increase the line rental by £1 per subscriber from the date the line is replaced.

Shouldn't take too long to claw it back. After all £100 to replace each line is based on engineers installing just one line but they'd be replacing whole streets at a time.

[Chrysalis]

Shaun yeah but BT recently seem just concerned about low prices, logically a £1 on line rental to everyone would certianly help pay for it but they dont want to upset people who are price sensitive to a £1 increase and who wouldnt see a benefit from FTTC. Fibre in the last mile doesnt really increase their headline speeds which is what the adsl2+ will do it just improves the performance and stability for the 75% who dont have great lines.

FTTH isnt going to happen for a while FTTC would be the next step, another obstacle of course is LLU, ofcom wont like the situation LLU providers will be left in following a FTTC rollout.

[RileyM]

Originally Posted by breamhunter

...i`m on O2 Pay & Go, I top Up £10.00 a month for that I get 100 credits to spend on calls or texts (x net call is 1 credit text is also 1 credit), I get 10% off my Topups back, I also get O2 treats and top it all off the £10 I put on is still mine!!!

Same here, i used to be with Virgin PAYG, but when i got Free O2 SIM with included mintues, texts & GRPS, i made the switch. It works out much better for me being with O2. Reception here is also better with O2 than Virgin/T-Mobile

[themelon]

Originally Posted by Shaun

You're just being silly now.

IF there's about 25 million res line in the UK then we can assume that to replace them will cost approximatly £100 (max) a line based on the fact that they charge between £125 and £175 to install a compmently new line.

25m x £100 = 2500m = 2.5bn.

Now pocket money but far less than BT are spending on 21CN and less than half of Ntls current debt (before they even think about ITV).

Once 21CN is rolled out (2010/11) I can see them spending this sort of money on upgrading the last mile.

It's the only sensible way to do it too, as what's the point in replacing the lines when there isn't anything (other than ADSL2+ which is mainly limited by line length not the age of the line) to plug them into in the exchange.

I can't see it taking 50 to 100 years either, that's just a silly exaggeration. It never took that long for BT to build its current network.

Not really.

Can you imagine how much road digging they would have to do? To lay Fibre to the Home and at what cost, they have to apply for local authority permission for widespread digging now. Its going to require a lot more than just installing a new line from a junction box on the pole, it will need to go all the way to the exchange.

Ntl (or predecessors) have racked up huge debts laying cable to less than half the UK; imagine the costs of relaying cable to every home in the UK? it aint gonna be cheap and BT aint gonna do it anytime soon.

They will let us use a substandard service at high prices for amy years to come, until it is an absolute necessity to replace it.

[Shaun]

Originally Posted by themelon

Not really.

Can you imagine how much road digging they would have to do? To lay Fibre to the Home and at what cost, they have to apply for local authority permission for widespread digging now. Its going to require a lot more than just installing a new line from a junction box on the pole, it will need to go all the way to the exchange.

Ntl (or predecessors) have racked up huge debts laying cable to less than half the UK; imagine the costs of relaying cable to every home in the UK? it aint gonna be cheap and BT aint gonna do it anytime soon.

They will let us use a substandard service at high prices for amy years to come, until it is an absolute necessity to replace it.

Surely as the cable is already there all they need to do is re'pull the cables. It's not like they are starting from scratch the ducting and roadside cabinets are already there.