[Now Official] More ntl speed changes

Originally Posted by jtwn

You already have a 30gb cap.

People on 1.5mb will hit the cap twice as fast, like you will/would, but you don't hear any complaints

750K has 30GB cap, 300K is 5GB cap.

Well I closed that bandwidth monitor for the I/O activity coming from it

Went over 90 already though. So looks like 5GB isn't enough

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by Scott

750K has 30GB cap, 300K is 5GB cap.

Well I closed that bandwidth monitor for the I/O activity coming from it

Went over 90 already though. So looks like 5GB isn't enough

Looks as if you'll be staying on 300k I guess.

EDIT: I would imagine the 5GB is probably looking at current usage of 300k users, and I expect 95% or more are considerably under 5GB a month - although it's not a bad deal considering that 1GB a month from BT is £20...

Originally Posted by Ignition

Looks as if you'll be staying on 300k I guess.

EDIT: I would imagine the 5GB is probably looking at current usage of 300k users, and I expect 95% or more are considerably under 5GB a month - although it's not a bad deal considering that 1GB a month from BT is £20...

Well after reading another thread about NTL dropping prices for students (which I'm a student at Tamworth & Lichfield College) I can get 750K for £20, which is well in the limit of what I'm willing to pay for

So more than likely later I'll be getting my parents to ring them up (I'm the ONLY person who uses the internet, so it's basically mine)

[DeadKenny]

Originally Posted by zovat

And you will be able to rub it into the faces of those who cannot get NTL

(I told my Boss that this was happening and he called me a jammy B%$^$%^ - and he is right, I actually feel that I am lucky to live in an NTL broadband area...)

10 months time, ADSL will be storming ahead in speeds well into and beyond 3Mbps, and that's assuming ADSL2/2+ isn't out by then and large chunks of cities aren't LLU'd exchanges (which offers far more speed if they are).

Nice speeds/prices from NTL, but I wouldn't consier myself lucky to be in an NTL area. Far from it, it's been nothing but hell an misery. I wish I was in a Telewest area personally (though I'm lucky enough to also be in an area with an excellent ADSL exchange. It even has a LLU service through EasyNet though I went with PlusNet who use BT for ADSL).

I fully expect ADSL prices to drop further in the next 3 to 6 months, plus speed increases. SDSL is also on the increase and dropping rapidly in price. Won't be long before it hits consumer level.

I'd be interested to see where NTL go with network expansion though. Expand the cable network or (as has been reported), move into ADSL to get new customers instead. NTL's current cable network limits them to a finite number of customers (7 million I read), and from what I gather they are not planning to lay more cable as ADSL is far cheaper.

[BBKing]

10 months time, ADSL will be storming ahead in speeds well into and beyond 3Mbps

I think that's over-optimistic, given that ADSL 2 would be needed to push that to reasonable exchange<>premise distances and 2+ isn't certified, AFAIK. You're talking a big upgrade of existing exchanges before it would become viable for most ADSL ISPs (who aren't LLU and can't buy their own ADSL2/2+ kit).

To save me checking, is much existing ADSL CPE (e.g. my router) ADSL 2 upgradable or do you need to buy new stuff?

It'll happen, no question, but at least a year behind ntl before most people have 3Mb ADSL available.

Well that's my idea out of the window due to faulse advertising.

EDIT: Looks like I'm going to have to pay £7 more for the faster one, at least my parents are giving me the family allowance next year

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by DeadKenny

10 months time, ADSL will be storming ahead in speeds well into and beyond 3Mbps, and that's assuming ADSL2/2+ isn't out by then and large chunks of cities aren't LLU'd exchanges (which offers far more speed if they are).

Nice speeds/prices from NTL, but I wouldn't consier myself lucky to be in an NTL area. Far from it, it's been nothing but hell an misery. I wish I was in a Telewest area personally (though I'm lucky enough to also be in an area with an excellent ADSL exchange. It even has a LLU service through EasyNet though I went with PlusNet who use BT for ADSL).

I fully expect ADSL prices to drop further in the next 3 to 6 months, plus speed increases. SDSL is also on the increase and dropping rapidly in price. Won't be long before it hits consumer level.

BT haven't offered businesses 3Mbit yet, 4 years after releasing the service, I wouldn't get optimistic about wholesale DSL being all that.

Easynet LLU is for businesses only, unless you can pay a small fortune for a 512k service that is!

BT apparently want to drop wholesale ADSL prices, as even their own BT Retail want to unbundle network because they find the prices distasteful. To say there will be a sudden rush in ADSL to 3, 4 whatever Mbit is as BBK said a little optimistic. BT just don't have the network to do it right now, and that is the same network nearly all the ISPs rely on.

[DeadKenny]

Originally Posted by BBKing

I think that's over-optimistic, given that ADSL 2 would be needed to push that to reasonable exchange<>premise distances and 2+ isn't certified, AFAIK. You're talking a big upgrade of existing exchanges before it would become viable for most ADSL ISPs (who aren't LLU and can't buy their own ADSL2/2+ kit).

True but some of the bigger exchanges are being upgraded fairly frequently.

To save me checking, is much existing ADSL CPE (e.g. my router) ADSL 2 upgradable or do you need to buy new stuff?

I think you need ADSL2 capable equipment. I deliberately sought out a router that has ADSL2/2+ support just in case.

It'll happen, no question, but at least a year behind ntl before most people have 3Mb ADSL available.

It's surprising how quick it could happen. A year ago 1Mbps ADSL was just a dream and BT were reluctant to let people sign up even for 512kbps if they weren't close enough. Turned out the restriction was not technical however, just BT were sticking to theoretical tolerances but with a bit of tweaking and a more relaxed policy they found they could reach much futher and increase speeds.

Cheap 2Mbps ADSL has come about much quicker than I expected.

Still, as I say, I'm interested to see what NTL do with ADSL.

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by DeadKenny

True but some of the bigger exchanges are being upgraded fairly frequently.

Ah that'll be why www.samknows.com shows several exchanges over capacity.

It's surprising how quick it could happen. A year ago 1Mbps ADSL was just a dream and BT were reluctant to let people sign up even for 512kbps if they weren't close enough. Turned out the restriction was not technical however, just BT were sticking to theoretical tolerances but with a bit of tweaking and a more relaxed policy they found they could reach much futher and increase speeds.

1Mbps ADSL has been available since the beginning, just not on a home package. As has 2Mbps. Top package available from BT for either businesses or offices, 4 years after commercial launch, and 8 years after trials (done at 2Mbit downstream) are.... 2Mbit. There's progress and innovation at its' finest.

Cheap 2Mbps ADSL has come about much quicker than I expected.

Still, as I say, I'm interested to see what NTL do with ADSL.

Give it time with 2Mbps ADSL, as Plusnet and all the other 2Mbit IPStream users get migrated to 50:1 once the 2Mbit home product is out. Considering that more than one person I know on the 2Mbit OFFICE class 20:1 pipes that these are running on at the moment is suffering problems due to an oversubscribed exchange I'm sure that when at nominal 50:1 service will be.... interesting

I asked a BT communications manager why BT were so reluctant to release 3Mbit. His response was a tacit one, but basically came down to BT offering what their network can provide at the moment.

BT have just completed an upgrade run, nonetheless 10% of their exchanges are overcapacity at the moment - http://www.samknows.com/broadband/capacity-summary.php

If they are having this much trouble with 512k - 2Mbit I'm not optimistic about higher speed products coming from BT at a reasonable price.

LLU is the only thing that'll even look like doing this, however as previously said ADSL2 is still not approved as part of the ANFP, ADSL2+ a similar story. Until this is done it's illegal to deploy these technologies in the UK. Even when done neither of these helps that much with range of DSL. A couple of hundred metres that's all really, just means you can bond lines easier and if you are really close you can get fast services. However at the moment said faster services would max a small exchange's backhaul single handedly...

[Chrysalis]

Have to agree with what's been said, higher speeds for ADSL are a long way off, only LLU providers provide it and this is largely limited to london. Of course easynet is business prices. We will also see ADSL move over to capping because of BT Wholesale changes, isp's will be forced to either contend users higher or charge more, capping is very likely without a big price hike.

[slowcoach]

Originally Posted by DeadKenny

It's surprising how quick it could happen. A year ago 1Mbps ADSL was just a dream and BT were reluctant to let people sign up even for 512kbps if they weren't close enough. Turned out the restriction was not technical however, just BT were sticking to theoretical tolerances but with a bit of tweaking and a more relaxed policy they found they could reach much futher and increase speeds.

Cheap 2Mbps ADSL has come about much quicker than I expected.

Still, as I say, I'm interested to see what NTL do with ADSL.

In actual fact the restriction WAS technical, just because BT have decided to relax noise limits doesn't change the physics.
Many people, like me, who had perfect 512KB ADSL are unable to have 1MB ADSL because the old problems are still there.
Continuously loosing connection will be a problem for many people who failed the original standard even if they pass the new standard.

"Extended Reach" is just marketing hype, the same infrastructure is still in place, and until BT is forced by IP's using their infrastructure to spend some serious money the dream of higher speeds will remain just that, a dream, for many people.


BT are pushing 1MB as if virtually everyone can have it for the asking, not so.

Many people will apply for 1MB and reluctantly accept 512KB when the line test fails, or worse, when the 1MB service is diabolical. This is good marketing by BT as many would have not applied for 512KB originally as it is such poor value compared to their 1MB service.

In the London Car Trade they have a practice named "Birdcalling", a punter phones about an advertised car, it's always a car everyone is looking for, the dealer prices it at a real bargain price. The punter is told that they will hold the car until he gets to the showroom. Upon his arrival, after a 200 mile journey, the punter is told that another salesman has sold the car by mistake and that it has already left the premises, "I'm very sorry about that Sir, to make amends I will do you a really special deal on one of these cars over here". The punter with the money burning a hole in his pocket reluctantly drives off in a car he could have bought at his local dealer.

[Jonboy]

it all sounds to good to be true to me

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Paul M

As things stand, ntl cannot really impose caps because they have no ability to mass monitor usage in such a way that you, the user, can be kept informed as well. But I doubt this situation will last.

They are spending millions on upgrading the networks for these new speeds, and other services, and my bet is that this new equipment will be able to monitor you usage much better, and keep you informed of it.

Maybe not straight away, but I think it will come - and when it does, I suspect you will see a big change in attitude - and they will start to take action against you if you exceed your limit, either by cutting you off, or reducing your speed, or maybe charging you for the extra usage.

btw - I haven't seen this mentioned, but I am led to believe that the caps for these new speeds are 'total traffic', i.e. upload and download.

As anyone who has been on any of the NTL trails can confirm they do actually have the ability to monitor our usage and stop our connection if we exceed it, all it needs is new modem configs (which we will obviously need anyway) and some basic changes at their end.

And as you said the bandwitch monitors did include both down and up stream traffic as part of your allowence so i'm certainly guessing as you said that will be the case with this (and is probally the case with the current guidelines)

[cjmillsnun]

Originally Posted by Scooby

Your jumping the gun a bit there as you don't know all the details of if this is available to new customers etc....

Wrong,

Originally Posted by ntl press release

These speeds will be rolled out to new customers in first quarter of 2005. Existing customers can upgrade to these new speeds by paying a £25 administration fee

therefore my rant stands!

[Stop It]

Originally Posted by Ignition

BT haven't offered businesses 3Mbit yet, 4 years after releasing the service, I wouldn't get optimistic about wholesale DSL being all that.

Easynet LLU is for businesses only, unless you can pay a small fortune for a 512k service that is!

BT apparently want to drop wholesale ADSL prices, as even their own BT Retail want to unbundle network because they find the prices distasteful. To say there will be a sudden rush in ADSL to 3, 4 whatever Mbit is as BBK said a little optimistic. BT just don't have the network to do it right now, and that is the same network nearly all the ISPs rely on.

And BT wholesale arent allowed to reduce their prices, due to OFCOM's over regulation, something they are challenging at this time , by threatening to end their plan to spend 9Billion on network infrastructure upgrades, At this time, ADSL speeds have reached a low point, one that probably wont change for a while, not until the aforementioned upgrades allow for cheaper bandwidth.

Not only this, but atm the amount of people who have 2Mb ADSL available to them is very small, even with higher speeds to come, it still will be a postcode lottery, at least with NTL, I know that everyone will be able to get the top speed, regardless of location (Usually).

Yes, NTL have had their issues, and still do, but this is a huge step in the right direction, Id much rather pay to NTL than the misleading BT (wholesale or retail)